Real Masiah Hazrat Isa(A.S) VS mirza ghulam ahmed

[coolguylin]

Physical you say? enlighten me with your Islamic knowledge on this issue please. I dropped by jaw the moment i read this post of yours. Is it all to save Jesus (AS) from dying? or any other purpose behind ?

Although i can refute this claim of yours with in a matter of seconds but lets think about it for some time on what you just said.

Satan as we know is made of fire. We know that Allah has given comparison of His punishment with fire. Now, if hell is a physical place, and you believe fire to be the fire that we are aware of in this world... how would throwing satan in fire of hell have any impact on him? fire going in fire?

OK i will answer on DD's behalf here..
You are made of clay right?? What if i hit you with a big stone of clay?? again and again.. will it not hurt you?? Will you not die if i throw a big stone of clay on your head??? answer me !!

[Mr.Popat]

But i think you are making a big mistake here.. you mean that EVERYTHING should be rational and acceptable (according to yur relegion), But.. its not like that.. you can feel and see and feel only a few things..by yur senses.. but it doesn't mean that its all what you see.. but its actually yur ignorance.. our thinking is limited.. even we can not think of infinite... and thats where you people are most ignorant.. where you want to be everything rational and understandable according to physical world.. No my dear.. you are mistaken.. you follow the modern Godless world of acquiring knowledge through sense, perception and rationality.. This is Not true..I believe that ALLAH SWT WHO is the CREATOR of physics.. CAN Nullify and hault it at any time HE wants.. Just like HE did at the time of Miraj-e-Nabi (S.A.W.W).. or at the time of Hazrat Isa (A.S).. Physics is bound to follow HIM.. HE is not bound to follow physics..

My religion Islam is the purest and the a religion that can lead one to Allah , if followed correctly. Islam's a religion which needs to be followed according to the teachings of Quran, hadith and sunnah. It needs not any kind of fairytales in it, to make it seem more interesting. Why do you want me to believe in things which has got absolutely nothing to do with the religion of Allah, Islam? Why do you even expect me to believe what you believe when your own beliefs are so twists that you dont agree with your own people? I guarantee you there are other Muslims who dont believe hell and heaven to be physical. Are they wrong? are you wrong ? You guys cant even have one belief on any one issue and there you are proving other people's beliefs false? Let me tell you man.. i am a firm believer of Islam, not the islam which was founded by subcontinental Mullahs according to their likings. It just saddens me to see people of my own religion believing in stuff which makes no sense whatsoever. You ask me to use the common sense in regards to Isa (AS)'s second arrival, but when some questions are put forth to you, you say Allah knows best? common sense only required from my side , and not yours?

No, i dont want everything to be rational. There are things which are beyond our thinking. Which is why i expect to have a debate with solid evidence provided from Quran or Ahadith. If they cant be provided, i wouldnt believe it. Why would i any way?.. I am a true Muslim, and base my beliefs according to Quran/hadith/ProphetMuhammadPBUH's sunnah.

[Mr.Popat]

OK i will answer on DD's behalf here.. You are made of clay right?? What if i hit you with a big stone of clay?? again and again.. will it not hurt you?? Will you not die if i throw a big stone of clay on your head??? answer me !!

you say you do not whether hell or heaven is a physical place. Thus, you answering in his/her behalf make no sense.

again, your reply doesnt make sense. No, i will not 'die' if you throw a big stone of 'clay' on my head. Theres no such thing as clay stone.

oh and by the way, as i was talkin of miraaj with you, may i ask if according to you Muhammad PBUH met other prophets on his journey to heavens? if yes, were they all alive in heavens, just like Jesus (AS)? what made Allah send down Prophet MuhammadPBUH's soul back in his body, while keeping the other prophet's soul in heavens??

[coolguylin]

who ask you to bring your own thinking here? are you allowed to pick and choose whatever you feel is right in islam? I asked for an islamic belief regarding Heaven and hell .. whether they are physical or spiritual? Please reply with a bit of research done from your side.

Yes my dear..as people will become alive physically this implies that they will be physical places.. as its also mentioned in the Holy Quran that ''their skin will burn and new skin will appear''..it means that they should be physical places..
by the way, you should ask the above question from mirza qadiani.. that is anyone allowed to pick and choose whatever one feels is right in islam or not?
He should be able to answer it by now !!

[Mr.Popat]

re: Real Masiah Hazrat Isa(A.S) VS mirza ghulam ahmed

well, You're gonna have to believe in your Maseeh Maood/Imam Mahdi (AS) too, right? would they be telling you about the religion of islam as exactly how its been practiced for so many years?... if yes, no point of their coming..what if he/they tell you that this and this belief in Islam was not preached by Muhammad PBUH. what then?.. a label of kafir is waiting for them as well?

[coolguylin]

you say you do not whether hell or heaven is a physical place. Thus, you answering in his/her behalf make no sense.

again, your reply doesnt make sense. No, i will not 'die' if you throw a big stone of 'clay' on my head. Theres no such thing as clay stone.

oh and by the way, as i was talkin of miraaj with you, may i ask if according to you Muhammad PBUH met other prophets on his journey to heavens? if yes, were they all alive in heavens, just like Jesus (AS)? what made Allah send down Prophet MuhammadPBUH's soul back in his body, while keeping the other prophet's soul in heavens??

I strongly and catagorically deny your claims that you are a muslim, if you follow ahmadiyyat.. An ahmadi/qadiyani/mirzai is declared as non-muslim by the whole muslim ummah..
Secondly, you are exagerating the issue, ahmadis are mushrik and i am a creature of ALLAH, and you are being very disobediant towards ALLAH S.W.T, like your kazzab and cult leader mirza ghulam, and i can't be like you..i can't even think like that..
Yes Miraaj did happen and it happened physically, i have no doubt just like i dont have a doubt in me as a being..
and thirdly, i gave you answer about fire and clay, and you CAN NOT refute it.. I can make a stone of clay if you allow me to, and then i will throw it on your head, and we will see if you are hurt or not?
You can't deny it.. you are thrown away along with your logic.. i think i am talking to a mad person who thinks that he can't be hurt with a solid peace of clay...are you made of iron? thats really a funny answer from your side.. i thought you have some thinking and rationality..
And by the way, i can post alot of material about your cult jamaat and your founder's satanic books, that can expose the makrooh face of your founder..

P.S. Allow me to make a big rock of pure clay, and i will hit you with that, and then ask you if it hurts or not if you survive it..

[coolguylin]

well, You're gonna have to believe in your Maseeh Maood/Imam Mahdi (AS) too, right? would they be telling you about the religion of islam as exactly how its been practiced for so many years?... if yes, no point of their coming..what if he/they tell you that this and this belief in Islam was not preached by Muhammad PBUH. what then?.. a label of kafir is waiting for them as well?

Hazrat Isa (A.S) will be the masiah, and He will come after Hazrat Imam Mahdi.. Its what we muslims believe, and you will with your eyes if you lived till then..i hope you live till then..
and the arrival of these two personalities is found alot in Ahadees-e-Nabwi (S.A.W.W)..

[Mr.Popat]

re: Real Masiah Hazrat Isa(A.S) VS mirza ghulam ahmed

lol whatever dude.. call me whatever you like. Mushrik, or whatever. One thing for sure... i am far better than hindu/sikh/budhist who dont believe in Muhammad PBUH at all.

and yeah, theres no clay stone.. but lets go back to our discussion and see what made us come to this discussion of clay stone or whatever. It was that hell and heaven are 'physical' place. I will not believe you in that unless you provide me with reference.

you are also refuted by your own illogical and tall claims.
post whatever material you can find against my jamaat. It will not move me one bit.

What muslim it is who cant verify his own beliefs? verify your claim of heaven/hell being physical.

[Mr.Popat]

Hazrat Isa (A.S) will be the masiah, and He will come after Hazrat Imam Mahdi.. Its what we muslims believe, and you will with your eyes if you lived till then..i hope you live till then.. and the arrival of these two personalities is found alot in Ahadees-e-Nabwi (S.A.W.W)..

i hope to live longer to see them. Until then, I believe Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (AS) to be the promised Messiah and Imam mahdi (AS). Good luck to youand i hope you or your generation get to live to see him/them. Meanwhile, dont regret that time has passed and you did not accept the true Imam Mahdi and Masih Maood (AS). Do not let the beliefs of your ancestors stop you from accepting the truth.

Muslims never believed in Isa (AS)'s second arrival until recently. Therefore, whatever Muslims have been believing thus far is not necessarily suppose to be right.

need answer to this so i can head back to doing something else ..

[QUOTE]
oh and by the way, as i was talkin of miraaj with you, may i ask if according to you Muhammad PBUH met other prophets on his journey to heavens? if yes, were they all alive in heavens, just like Jesus (AS)? what made Allah send down Prophet MuhammadPBUH's soul back in his body, while keeping the other prophet's soul in heavens??
[/QUOTE]

[coolguylin]

i hope to live longer to see them. Until then, I believe Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (AS) to be the promised Messiah and Imam mahdi (AS). Good luck to youand i hope you or your generation get to live to see him/them. Meanwhile, dont regret that time has passed and you did not accept the true Imam Mahdi and Masih Maood (AS). Do not let the beliefs of your ancestors stop you from accepting the truth.

Muslims never believed in Isa (AS)'s second arrival until recently. Therefore, whatever Muslims have been believing thus far is not necessarily suppose to be right.

need answer to this so i can head back to doing something else ..

No you are lying.. No muslim ever believed that Hazrat Isa (A.S) has died.. Untill the arrival of the kazzab-e-azam mirza qadiani.. who was declared nonmuslim and an imposter by all muslims after getting to know his thoughts and his love with british..
You can not provide me one single evidence of a muslim scholar (non-ahmadi) who said that Hazrat Isa (A.S) has died, it was only the imposter mirza..
Becoz refuting this belief that Hazrat Isa (A.S) is alive, means refuting Ahadith which finally lead to Kufr..

[Mr.Popat]

re: Real Masiah Hazrat Isa(A.S) VS mirza ghulam ahmed

lol i stand corrected when i say you dont agree with your own people.

get in contact with crankthatskunk and ask what his belief of Isa (AS) is.

Get yourself one belief as a Muslim and then go around preaching Islam, and refuting other people's belief as false.

PS: you have no right to characterize anyone. You are not following Muhammad PBUH, hence not following MuhammadPBUH leads to kufr.

[coolguylin]

lol i stand corrected when i say you dont agree with your own people.

get in contact with crankthatskunk and ask what his belief of Isa (AS) is.

Get yourself one belief as a Muslim and then go around preaching Islam, and refuting other people's belief as false.

PS: you have no right to characterize anyone. You are not following Muhammad PBUH, hence not following MuhammadPBUH leads to kufr.

I am a sunni muslim, and i agree with them.. how can you say that i dont agree with them?? You are again lying and trying to save your face.. But your tricks will fail dude.. let me tell you this.. you use tricks to support your falshood and lies by yur leader..
I have the right to characterize ahmadi/qadiani/mirzai as nonmuslims..Becoz they are catagorcially declared as non-muslims among all the mulim scholars of all the school of thoughts..
you still have time to atleast read the books of mirza and see what garbage his mind was full of.. and then decide youself that what you are following is right or wrong !!

[coolguylin]

re: Real Masiah Hazrat Isa(A.S) VS mirza ghulam ahmed

I urge all ahmadi friends, to Please read these two links with open hearts, Please..
And i assure you all that if you read them with open hearts and without any harsh feelings, i am sure inshALLAH you will see what you have’nt been able to see untill now..
Here are the links
Bismillah Al-Rehman Al-Raheem
Bismillah Al
Bismillah Al-Rehman Al-Raheem
and a Must Must read for all ahmadi friends Please, click the following
Journey from Illusion to Reality

[Mr.Popat]

re: Real Masiah Hazrat Isa(A.S) VS mirza ghulam ahmed

^^ people embracing different religion/sects make no difference. If this is how you are going to be measuring someone’s belief as right then there are thousands and thousands of people all around the globe accepting Ahmadiyyat as the true face of Islam.

if this is the scale in which you are going to measure then i can produce many many articles of people accepting ahmadiyyat Islam..
How I Accepted Ahmadiyyat - The True Islam
now that was an article if you feel like reading please do so..

now ill show you a clip in which the 5th Caliphate of Jamaat e Ahmadiyya is taking bait.
This was held in Jalsa Salaana UK 2009. Check from 1:50 onwards … Number of people accepted Ahmadiyya Muslim Jamaat and became Ahmadi Muslims are “4lakhs,16thousand and ten” people from 111 countries accepted Jamaat e Ahmadiyya.

Since its an international bait , people who could make it to UK jalsa are there, but people who could not can also do bait by doing the same procedure and repeating after 5th Caliphate. Again, 4lakhs,16thousand and ten people at that time were repeating after Him

You talk about 1 converting to Sunni/shia/barelvi , and we’ll show you people in millions accepting Ahmadiyyat every year. Enjoy.

[kchughtai]

mr. coolguy,

Here is a book containing reply to the allegations raised by Rashid Ali and Abdul Hafeez (alhafeez.org)

• Ahmadiyya Muslim Jama’at Urdu Pages](http://www.alislam.org/urdu/reply/)
  pls read it

[dhanya_podena]

Physical you say? enlighten me with your Islamic knowledge on this issue please. I dropped by jaw the moment i read this post of yours. Is it all to save Jesus (AS) from dying? or any other purpose behind ?

Although i can refute this claim of yours with in a matter of seconds but lets think about it for some time on what you just said.

Satan as we know is made of fire. We know that Allah has given comparison of His punishment with fire. Now, if hell is a physical place, and you believe fire to be the fire that we are aware of in this world... how would throwing satan in fire of hell have any impact on him? fire going in fire?

Thats a poor arguent my dear.

Humans are made of "teen", or mud/clay, does not mean that we and clay are the same thing. Try putting half Kg of clay down someone's trachea and see what happens. Same for Satan, made of fire but does not mean its same as fire and fire cannot harm it.

Moreover, all that i have read from Quran on the issue suggest its a physical place, like Quran 25-66, describes it as "Muqaam".

ANd in the end onus is upon you to prove that heaven and Hell are spirtual or whatever places, because there is no such thing as "spirtual place".

[JeevayPakistan]

@DD

Thats a poor arguent my dear.

Humans are made of "teen", or mud/clay, does not mean that we and clay are the same thing. Try putting half Kg of clay down someone's trachea and see what happens. Same for Satan, made of fire but does not mean its same as fire and fire cannot harm it.

Moreover, all that i have read from Quran on the issue suggest its a physical place, like Quran 25-66, describes it as "Muqaam".

ANd in the end onus is upon you to prove that heaven and Hell are spirtual or whatever places, because there is no such thing as "spirtual place".

Read following hadith:
'The Book Pertaining to Paradise, Its Description, Its Bounties and Its Intimates (Kitab Al-Jannat wa Sifat Naimiha wa Ahliha)' of Sahih Muslim.

6780

Abu Huraira reported Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) as saying that: Allah the Exalted and Glorious, said: I have prepared for My pious servants which no eye has ever seen, and no ear has ever heard, and no human heart has ever perceived but it is testified by the Book of Allah. He then recited:" No soul knows what comfort has been concealed from them, as a reward for what they did". (xxxii. 17)

So, you can see that any imagination of Hell or Heaven that can come in our mind will certainly be not close to what it actually would look like in reality.

If you are thinking about having same body, same apples and grapes, same honey etc in Heaven, and same fire in Hell, than you are certainly wrong.

I believe, that a body will be given to Man, which will be quite different to what we have in this world. It could very well have far more senses than the five we have in this world, God knows.

So, lets leave it to Allah what He has in store for us, and instead put our efforts in doing good deeds so that we can get His blessings in this world and the hereafter.

[coolguylin]

@Mr.Popat

^^ people embracing different religion/sects make no difference. If this is how you are going to be measuring someone’s belief as right then there are thousands and thousands of people all around the globe accepting Ahmadiyyat as the true face of Islam.

if this is the scale in which you are going to measure then i can produce many many articles of people accepting ahmadiyyat Islam..
How I Accepted Ahmadiyyat - The True Islam
now that was an article if you feel like reading please do so..

now ill show you a clip in which the 5th Caliphate of Jamaat e Ahmadiyya is taking bait.
This was held in Jalsa Salaana UK 2009. Check from 1:50 onwards … Number of people accepted Ahmadiyya Muslim Jamaat and became Ahmadi Muslims are “4lakhs,16thousand and ten” people from 111 countries accepted Jamaat e Ahmadiyya.

Since its an international bait , people who could make it to UK jalsa are there, but people who could not can also do bait by doing the same procedure and repeating after 5th Caliphate. Again, 4lakhs,16thousand and ten people at that time were repeating after Him

You talk about 1 converting to Sunni/shia/barelvi , and we’ll show you people in millions accepting Ahmadiyyat every year. Enjoy.

Well my dear, I did not intend to post those links to compete with your relegion’s strength of people.. My intention was that you should read those in detail and get to know the truth and revert to Islam..
Offcourse you can not compete with the strength Muslims have.. We are more than one billion.. And how many are you?
But i did not want competition.. I wanted you to read and get the truth..
Well i feel pity for all those who left Islam and joined ahmadiyyat.. I think they made the worst decision of their life..
See the guy masroor… he has nothing to do but to strengthen his kingdom of so called khaleefa… he wants them to be faithful to the khalifa.. LOL… What a pity… What a loss to Muslim Ummah and themselves.. You should atleats read mirza’s satanic books once..and then decide yourself about him.. I leave it to you..

[coolguylin]

@JeevayPakistan

Read following hadith: 'The Book Pertaining to Paradise, Its Description, Its Bounties and Its Intimates (Kitab Al-Jannat wa Sifat Naimiha wa Ahliha)' of Sahih Muslim.

6780

Abu Huraira reported Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) as saying that: Allah the Exalted and Glorious, said: I have prepared for My pious servants which no eye has ever seen, and no ear has ever heard, and no human heart has ever perceived but it is testified by the Book of Allah. He then recited:" No soul knows what comfort has been concealed from them, as a reward for what they did". (xxxii. 17)

So, you can see that any imagination of Hell or Heaven that can come in our mind will certainly be not close to what it actually would look like in reality.

If you are thinking about having same body, same apples and grapes, same honey etc in Heaven, and same fire in Hell, than you are certainly wrong.

I believe, that a body will be given to Man, which will be quite different to what we have in this world. It could very well have far more senses than the five we have in this world, God knows.

So, lets leave it to Allah what He has in store for us, and instead put our efforts in doing good deeds so that we can get His blessings in this world and the hereafter.

Yes those places will be unimaginably superior to this world.. i agree.. But where does it say that they will be unphysical?? This Hadit does not prove it..

[coolguylin]

@kchughtai

mr. coolguy,

Here is a book containing reply to the allegations raised by Rashid Ali and Abdul Hafeez (alhafeez.org)

• Ahmadiyya Muslim Jama’at Urdu Pages](http://www.alislam.org/urdu/reply/)
  pls read it

‘Haqeeqat al Wahy’ (THe Truth of Revelation). In it Ghulam Ahmed Mirza claims he was visited by an angel of ALLAH who refused to tell him who he was (strange). Then Mirza forcefully asks him ‘Who are you!’ and the angel replied ‘I am tichi tichi’.

Mirza recieved his revelations through an angel called Tichi Tichi.

Do you believe on this kind of person as your maseeha??
hahahahahahahahahaha.. He is more a joker…
Please before giving me references to links, Please DO one good with you..
Please read all the books of mirza, and then come and talk with me.. Then you will be in a better position to understand the mental condition of mirza, So you will understand that a relegion invented by such a person means what,.. Please read his books..
damn… I mean, just imagine an angel comes and says “I am tichi tichi”!!!hahahahaha… do you believe such a person??? then i must say that either you haven’t read his books or you are forced to follow.. becoz i think no sane person can believe on such a person.. LOL