Re: bi-racial relationships
Ok so Islam has no solution for racist parents?
what if a parent refuses to marry his daughter to man just because his culture is differnt or he has a different skin color?
An adult girl /guy has a right to go choose who they want to marry.
Your view on islamic law doesn't make sense and its not fair.
FYI, court marriages ARE allowed in most of the muslim countries even the ones like Iran that follow strict sharia laws.
Re: bi-racial relationships
i have to disagree mabrook ... dad's permission is not needed if dad's reasoning is absurd, and any other head can become a "wali for the time" for the marriage to take place.
and by aburd i mean ... dad has no real argument, and just random things like ... he isnt punjabi or pakistani ... he is white or black ... he isnt tall enough ... he earns 30,000 instead of 50,000 ...
so ... in this case ... the girl or guy HAS the permission to get married without dad's permission.
i'm hanfi too. as far as i know wali's permission is needed for single virgin and if dad refuses qazi must not proceed but well ppl always find out ways .. yea go ask brother or uncle but islamic law is islamic law if u talk abt islam . court marriages r not related to shariya.
That view simply is not correct. If you don't believe me go and ask an imam of one of the big main mosques where u live (not any of those dodgy maulvis who are more obsessed with culture than Islam).
I haven't mentioned court marriages cos from an Islamic standpoint they don't hold any value (but still recommended for legal reasons and 'security' in western countries, a lot of mosques over here won't allow Islamic marriage without civil done as well cos it can lead to problems esp for the girl)..
If a father was able to discriminate against a person on the basis of race or say he can't become part of my family and Islamically it was ok I don't think I'd even be able to call myself a Muslim. That's pretty messed up imo.
Re: bi-racial relationships
jab mian biwi razi … to kya karay ga qazi 
ye nahi suna kisi nay? 
Re: bi-racial relationships
The Prophet SAAWS said: "There is no marriage without the permission of a guardian." [Sunan of Abu Dawood 2080, Narrated Abu Musa]
"When a woman marries without the permission of her wali, then her marriage is not valid, not valid, not valid." [Related by Ahmad, Tirmidhi and others. Tirmidhi said, this is a hasan Hadith]
from another site
"No marriage except with a guardian and the ruler is the guardian of she who has no guardian." (Reported by Abu Dawud & others and classed as sahih)
"If any woman marries without the permission of her guardian, then her marriage is void, then her marriage is void, then her marriage is void." (Reported by Abu Dawud & others and classed as sahih)
Re: bi-racial relationships
Islam is not harsh as we think
The Wali (Guardian) in Marriage: Role & Responsibilities - IslamonLine.net - Ask The Scholar
Re: bi-racial relationships
If the wali refused to let a woman marry a man whose religious commitment and character are good, then guardianship passes to the next closest male relative on the father’s side, then the next closest and so on. If they refuse to arrange her marriage, as usually happens, then guardianship passes to the qaadi, and the qaadi should arrange the woman’s marriage. If the matter is referred to him and he knows that her guardians have refused to arrange her marriage, then he should do that, because he is the wali in cases where there is no specific wali.
The fuqaha’ (may Allaah have mercy on them) stated that if the wali repeatedly refuses marriage proposals from suitable men, then he is a faasiq (evildoer) and is no longer regarded as being of good character or as being a wali, rather according to the best known view of the madhhab of Imam Ahmad, he also forfeits the right to lead prayers and it is not valid to offer any congregational prayer behind him. This is a serious matter.
The Prophet SAAWS said: "There is no marriage without the permission of a guardian." [Sunan of Abu Dawood 2080, Narrated Abu Musa] "When a woman marries without the permission of her wali, then her marriage is not valid, not valid, not valid." [Related by Ahmad, Tirmidhi and others. Tirmidhi said, this is a hasan Hadith]
from another site
"No marriage except with a guardian and the ruler is the guardian of she who has no guardian." (Reported by Abu Dawud & others and classed as sahih)
"If any woman marries without the permission of her guardian, then her marriage is void, then her marriage is void, then her marriage is void." (Reported by Abu Dawud & others and classed as sahih)
From the same place you've quoted from it looks like you've purposely left out the bit that says:
***'However, according to Imam Abu Hanifah, a lawful gaurdian is not required if the woman is non-virgin (i.e. married before) or a virgin'*
^This is the HANAFI position and what I mentioned earlier. If you want to take a different viewpoint that is up to u but it's misleading to say that Hanafis don't allow marriage without wali's permission because walk into any big mosque and you will see this is not the case.
What Tammy has written in the above post is also correct.
**
Re: bi-racial relationships
Mabrook, it doesn't make sense to not allow adult people to get married themselves. We see it happening all the time that parents can be so unreasonable. How can islam have no solution for racist and unreasonable or materialistic parents who think status/race/culture is above everything including religion.
What if theres a proposal from a guy whos very religious but he's from a different racial background and the parent reject that and go for someone whos totally not religious but from the same caste?
How is that fair?
Re: bi-racial relationships
walis rejecting a GOOD rishta can only be based on ludicrous reasons.
it is also true that marriages where parents have forced girls into it, are also void and haram. and under that light ... so many marriages are void and illegit!
a wali's presence is required in a girl's marriage ... but who is the wali? it doesnt specifically mean father.
From the same place you've quoted from it looks like you've purposely left out the bit that says:
*'However, according to Imam Abu Hanifah, a lawful gaurdian is not required if the woman is non-virgin (i.e. married before) or a virgin'*
^This is the HANAFI position and what I mentioned earlier. If you want to take a different viewpoint that is up to u but it's misleading to say that Hanafis don't allow marriage without wali's permission because walk into any big mosque and you will see this is not the case.
What Tammy has written in the above post is also correct.
now read the next part
*Yet still, the opinion of the majority is more correct and preferable especially under the now-a-days circumstances where marriages without the permission of the brides’ families often lead to problems and bring about considerable harms. Editor] *
Abi Hanifa's students ash-Shaybani and Abu Yusuf both said wali's permission was necessary for the marriage to be valid
walis rejecting a GOOD rishta can only be based on ludicrous reasons. it is also true that marriages where parents have forced girls into it, are also void and haram. and under that light ... so many marriages are void and illegit!
a wali's presence is required in a girl's marriage ... but who is the wali? it doesnt specifically mean father.
yes father is the first natural wali if he's alive. if he appoints someone else in his place that's fine. but if he's dead then brother or closest guardian, male from dad's side is the wali.
yes father is the first natural wali if he's alive. if he appoints someone else in his place that's fine. but if he's dead then brother or closest guardian, male from dad's side is the wali.
Wali can be changed if the father is being unreasonable.
Re: bi-racial relationships
**If the wali refused to let a woman marry a man whose religious commitment and character are good, then guardianship passes to the next closest male relative on the father’s side, then the next closest and so on. If they refuse to arrange her marriage, as usually happens, then guardianship passes to the qaadi, and the qaadi should arrange the woman’s marriage. **If the matter is referred to him and he knows that her guardians have refused to arrange her marriage, then he should do that, because he is the wali in cases where there is no specific wali.
Re: bi-racial relationships
I see alot of pakistani student (male) enjoying relationship with white girls but the family of the guy never find out. They use the excuse of religion and family objection to get rid of the gori jub shook poora ho jata hai! But the guys know from day one that they will not marry her!
Or now a days they have to marry the gori's to get the nationality!
Re: bi-racial relationships
^ why are you saying pakistani "student" male specifically??? relationship for the sake of "enjoying" kahan nahi hoti?
Re: bi-racial relationships
its like: ghar ki murghi (in this case murgha's) daal baraabar!!
^ You obviously can't read Shamus (or rather 'shameonme' as someone else pointed out in Life1), my dad's from Pakistan and has a Pakistani passport, my mum has a Bangladeshi passport and she's mixed Bengali (also part Swedish/French). I've stated I'm part Bengali loads of times on this forum inc the fact that I speak Bengali better than Urdu.
To me your just a Bengali. I have nothing in common with bengaz and personally dislike alot of them, on a side note this is a Pakistani forum not benglatimes.com so seriously i couldn't give two tosh if you are Bengali. I join this forum too talk to my own people.
How exactly does being with a white lad mean I have an inferiority complex?? Most ppl have said you seem to be the one with the problem, you're the one who bleats on about race in nearly all ur posts like u have a huge chip on ur shoulder. Didn't one of the mods even ask u if u'd been turned down by a white girl one time too many..
Typically Bengali mentality look up to the white people but your people are black and do give off visual pollution so I can see why you tend to go that way. It wasn't a mod, its was 'aahmed' and as a muslim I don't date, I’ve never been attracted to white British girls maybe because I’ve grown up among my own people who are proud of their roots aswell as our sisters being well known for their beauty.
Everyone knows the type of guys who speak the way u do, they're underachievers or loners who are angry at the world and the only way they can feel good about themselves is by going on about 'racial purity' and 'pride.' The majority of Asian boys who have this attitude are just like the majority of losers who join the BNP.
Oh Deeba you are seriously paranoid girl and I really do question your mental state. On these forums all I see you do is boost about your white bf or how you constantly love to remind us of how educated you and your family are by stating on numerous occasions of how your brother has studied medicine. If he was really a good brother he would have prescribed you some fluoxetine tablets by now as desperate measures are needed for a desperate girl like you.
LOOL Your really are a naive person trying to assume my racial views are due to my educational background but let me just say for everyone sake racial purity was also spoken by a man who went to the same school as me and known to the UK masses as Enoch Powell, man destined to be the prime minister of this country until his famous 'River Of Blood' speech. All I want to say about my education is that I’ve been to the best grammar school this city can offer and is ranked top 15 in the country on a annual basis and study a course which now requires students to have 8a* at Gcse.
Oh, and u should be careful what u say on here or u'll end up getting chucked off the forums again, obviously people were getting irritated by all ur BS. So much for 'most ppl think like me.' You coudn't believe that there were more girls on here married or in mixed relationships. Well apart from Farrah some others who spring to mind sraight away are Mamaof3, SomeGroovyChick, Maroush, AthensBride and those are just off the top of my head.. So what was that rubbish about how it's so looked down on in here lol
Your a desperate girl by trying to influence the mod again, don't worry I can't be asked to talk to a Bengali any longer so consider yourself ignored from now on and its not just me who feels this way, as I on countless time have spoken to Pakistani lads who study at Barts, who have had numerous problems with your kind. No Pakistani lad would have married you anyways as Bengali's are pretty much disliked on the whole and not seen as good-looking people. On a final note this forum is not my life and I view people on my social interaction and not by what I see online. I couldn't careless how those people view me and if they are Kashmiri, Pashtun or Mirpuri I apologise if they did not like my comments.
As for this topic all I want to say is those people who have complexes marry outside their own race as they can't get along with their own or find their own race ugly like alot of Indian and Bengali actually do. Thankfully in B'ham Pakistani are very strict in marrying their own and I myself will never even consider marrying someone different from my own race.
Re: bi-racial relationships
^^ some heated discussions....
I have never been attracted to dark skinned girls like bengali, tamil, black, etc...
I am love with Mediterranean Girls....they are the hottest.....
^^ some heated discussions....
I have never been attracted to dark skinned girls like bengali, tamil, black, etc...
I am love with Mediterranean Girls....they are the hottest.....
You try and act all gorafied but it seems you haven't adopted any of their good points like racial tolerance, still the same narrow minded fair-worshipping dark-loathing inferiority complexed imported Paki views, I bet you have a big stash of Fair & Lovely somehwhere.