Zionist...Not Jewish!

I’ve noticed for as long as i can remember that the term Jew has been misinterpreted just like the term Muslim. When we think of the acts of inhumanity that Palestinians suffer, we think of Jews as being responsible because, well Israel is a nation for the people of the Jewish faith. However,…the believing Jews themselves don’t want to be associated with the Zionists because it is the zionists that are fond of wars/fighting/the ‘superior over others’ mentality, etc…

There are been documented Rabbis who are opposed to the state of Israel as it stands because it violates the principles of Judaism and according to them goes against the will of God.

I quote from my source:

*"One means of misleading many Jews and all too many non-Jews is the Zionist misuse of names and symbols sacred in Judaism. They use the holy name Israel**menorah (candlebrum). What hypocrisy, what perversion it is to have the Israeli army fight under an emblem, the meaning of which is explained in the Tenach (on the occasion of a previous return to the Holy Land) as, “not with armed force and not with power, but in My spirit says the Lord of Hosts.” for their Zionist state. They have named their land acquisition fund with a term that traditionally implies the reward for piety, good deeds, and charitable work. They have adopted as a state symbol the * The infamous founder of political Zionism, may his name be cursed, who only discovered his own Jewishness because of anti-Semitism displayed at the Dreyfus trial in France, proposed various solutions to what he called the “Jewish problem.” At one point he proposed to resettle the Jews in Uganda. At another he proposed to convert them to Catholicism. He finally hit on the idea of a Judenstaat, an exclusive Jewish state. Thus from its very beginning Zionism was a result of Anti-Semitism and indeed is completely compatible with it, because Zionists and anti-Semites had (and have) a common goal: To bring all Jews from their places of domicile to the Zionist state, thus uprooting Jewish communities that had existed for hundreds and even thousands of years. Loyalty to the Zionist state was substituted for loyalty to G-d, and the state was made into the modern “golden calf”. Belief in the Torah and fulfillment of religious obligations in Zionist eyes became a private matter and not a duty for every Jew or for the Jewish people. The Zionists made divine law subject to party or parliamentary votes, and they set their own standards of conduct and ethics. *
*
Neither the founder of political Zionism nor any of the prime ministers of the Zionist state believed in the divine origin of the Torah nor even in the existence of G-d. All prime ministers were members of a party that opposed religion in principle and that considered the Bible a document of ancient folklore, devoid of any religious meaning. And yet these same Zionists base their claim to the Holy Land on this same Bible, the divine origin of which they deny. At the same time they conveniently forget the Jewish holiday prayer “and for our sins have we been exiled from our land,” and ignore the fact that the present exile of the Jewish people is divinely decreed and that the Jewish people are neither commanded nor permitted to conquer or rule the Holy Land before the coming of the Messiah. The Jewish people do, of course, recognize special spiritual ties to that land they call it Eretz Yisrael. Every morning, afternoon, and evening, and night they mention it and Zion and Jerusalem in their prayers, and indeed a Jew does not sit down to a meal without doing likewise. To the Jew, the very soil of the Holy Land is different from that of any other spot on this globe, and wherever he is he turns his face toward Jerusalem during prayers. To live in the Holy Land or even to be buried there was always considered to be of high merit."

So, what do you make of this? Does the difference between Zionism and Judaism even appeal to you?

It certainly does to me. I have started to think more and more about how i address the people of other faiths who are considered Ahl-e-Kitaab (People of the Book).

The Orthodox Jews (Specifically Neturei Karta) have been very active in meeting with Muslims to clear any misconceptions that may have taken place in the name of Jewish faith, when infact, Jews are not the same as Zionists. Infact they identify with Palestine more than they do Israel.

I hope people of all faiths can live in peace.

Here’s my source:

http://www.jewsnotzionists.org/differencejudzion.html

Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

While I agree with the fact that zionists and jews are two different parties, there is no denying the fact that SOME (not every jew) do support the zionist movement, while not following the same ideology.

And this is coming from personal experience, as I go to a jewish run university.

Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

Well Rabbi Weiss says that is because their values and beliefs have been hijacked, and the deception they're presented with of the "true" jewish cause and faith leads them to support Zionism.

Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

^ just like some Muslims support Muslim terrorists/extremists, al-qaeda, etc etc.

thanks for the reminder teggy....although I think that most educated people know that the root of the problem is caused by the zionist and not ALL jews.

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I think most educated people know the root cause to be zionists *and *the Palestinians/Palestinian supporters.

Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

Are you saying the Jews are the root cause of the problem? Because some jews favor a Palestinian state. I think otherwise.

Zionism is the root of the problem. Period.

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Palestinians and their supporters have done absolutely nothing to further their cause in the past 50 years. Almost everything they have done and every "leader" they've had has been detrimental to establishing any peace. Period.

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^How can you expect Palestinians to do anything when you cut off the waters, the food, the energy sources, carpet bomb their homes and assassinate their leaders? Back to the stone age is Israel's strategy and hey! they are succeeding. Who is to blame? Come again?

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Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

If Arabs and Palestinians haven't been trying to destroy the state from day one then there would be no cutting off the waters, the food, the energy sources, carpet bomb their homes and assassinate their leaders. So yea, come again, who is responsible for their own plight?

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I dont remember the Arabs who were there to **destroy **Israel as a state, but rather remember the freedom fight for a piece of land called Palestine.

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You can find plenty of quotes of Israeli leaders wanting to destroy the Palestinians as a people and this is part of Israel's policy. How can you expect the Palestinians to make peace with such a people?

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err... why is this in religion forum? it should be in world affairs.

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If you don't remember I suggest you go back to history books. The goal was to expel the Jewish state. They already had their piece of land in the UN parition before they started the wars.

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Because it's a faith based issue Judaism vs. Zionism :)

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Judiasm vs zionism is similiar to Islam vs khilafah.

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and how are Palestinians suppose to establish peace? by allowing america and israel to occupy their land? the way I see it america/israel's moto is "it's my way or the highway".

besides they have taken everything from the palestinian people....how are they suppose to further the cause when they have nothing to work with??

Re: Zionist…Not Jewish!

:rotfl:

Wow…Thanks for the laugh.

Khilafat is a way of governance under Islam. Zionism is anything but Jewish culture/faith/or belief…Don’t believe me? Ask a devout Jew and he’ll tell you what Zionism really is…

Or ask a muslim what Khilafat really is…

It’s best to ask the scholars/believers of the faith you’re accusing to find what the faith is all about, rather than just spew hate and twist the definitions to fit your motifs.

May Allah give you guidance.

:slight_smile:

Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

And you call yourself educated?

Israel didn't even belong there, the whole world had the right to wipe this illegal occupation off the face of the earth.

Ofcourse you're going to destroy something that should not be there.

Here is a family background of the man who created the jewish state of israel.

[QUOTE]
"Herzl's wife Julia, who was prone to mental instability, had three children, each of whom met a terrible end. His eldest daughter Pauline was a drug addict who died in a French hospital. His son Hans, who shot himself upon learning of his sister's death, had left Judaism for a series of Christian churches. His youngest daughter Trude perished in the Nazi concentration camp of Theresienstadt."
[/QUOTE]

Re: Zionist...Not Jewish!

Salam,
That would put palestinian people and anyone supporting them in the same boat. Palestinians are freedom fighters, much like the ones muslims tend to support. You are allowed to fight back when under attack, there is justification for it in Islam. Battle of Badr is a prime example.

Hezbollah, Al-Qaida, Taliban, Chechyan mujahideen, chinese mujahideen, how many categories of "islamic terrorists" will they come up with?

Heck not just the muslim world, you can take a look at Guatemala, Venezuela, Mexico, Vietnam, Chile, Somalia, and many more where "terrorists" have sprung up. If its not in the interest of big daddy America, anyone is a terrorist and with their hold on the media, you can rest assure that muslims would be led to adhere to their policies. (mainly carpet bombing people into smithereens. :))

It was sh. Hamza who mentioned once in his talks,

[quote]
Oppression takes its toll on the oppressor AND the oppressed. And the oppressors have to suffer consequences for their actions. Allah brings it to them.
[/quote]

It is the muslims supporting the zionist state and the fascist state of America, who are in great loss. For the "state of israel" would never be, if it wasn't for America.

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Anything that goes against your biased, predetermined mindset isn't hate or even lack of knowledge. I probably knew more about Islam before you were out of diapers. Just because I am not a believer doesn't mean I can't read the same things you do. The difference is that I haven't been brainwashed from birth to believe everything I've heard, hook, line and sinker.

What Muslim should I ask what Khilifah really is? I'd get 100 diffrent answers from a 100 different people. It is similar to zionism in that it confuses state with religion. It's similiar in that some adherents feel it is part of faith and some don't. It's similar in that it discriminates against those not following the majority.