Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@Ali_Syed

The main reason are fatwas, like for barelvis people not following their school of thought are misguided. Similarly for others barelvis and Shias are mushriqs and kafirs and hence worthy to be killed. Now who would decide who is the righteous amongst all these different people, you, me or Allah? The problem we see in Pakistan is that we have become judge, jury and executioner.

Its a mess alright

But there is a correct interpretation and incorrect and one inbetween.

The correct fatawa is a blessing not a fitnah

The correct fatawa may not fulfil our desires

Then are we to throw the dummy out?

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@muqawwee123

But you still fail to explain why Muslim got right to preach their faith to others, but they don’t got right and a little room for wishing others their holy occasions / festivals. What a fragile version of faith we follow!

We are Muslims here (majority of us), so we try to suppress our strong sentiments out of respect, fear and perception developed over the period of time, but you know when you present such ideas outside Muslim circle, people pick an image of intolerant and bigot religion from you.

Well shirk is just a belief, the religion is against it very strictly. It can be an unforgivable sin and Ibraheem Alaihis Salam Said we are enemies against Mushrikeen.

So i can only ask you to come appreciate The Oneness of Allah which ia the basis for our existence as an Ummah. The purpose for sending of Rehmatul lil Alameen SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam

If your going to hold me as hostage like kakabilli and say if you tell me something that is against my desires i will disbelieve, that would be unfair

I kid you not that wishing christmas willy nilly being not allowed per Islam is a genuine position of Islamic jurisprudence

What you guys feel and do is anybodies guess. Lets not force these opinions of the most liberal of people upon the religion

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@vroom

As far as i have gauged wishing merry christmas is impermissible with an exception. Some of the shaykhs of recent times have done it outside of the spirit of the exception. And of course it appears people are doing it willy nilly

It appears a bidah dalala [reprehensible innovation], certainly for the common folk to be doing it. This is my opinion and perception of the matter

The people of Allah Ta’ala should be celebrating Milad un Nabi SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam and wishing mubarak to this rather then christmas. The reason for this is that Nabi SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam is Rehmatul lil Alameen. So when Allah Ta’ala Said for us to be let showing joyous celebration at The Mercy, Prophet Muhammad SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam who saved us from polytheism deserves to be celebrated rather then an occasion which marks the concept of birth of god. Astagfirullah

Christmas represents a wrong and as such should not be honoured. Isa Alaihis Salam deserves to be honoured but our Nabi SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam is Sayyidul Anbiya.

I know how you guys feel however. Although it can be shirk but for the average person it would not be shirk to wish them a merry christmas but its imperssible [as far i know]

We will have to see how this develops in the future

There is fear with it developing into something that will take us into the fire as Bidahs can

Here is my initial post, it represents my view

[Mirch]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@ajazali

saying merry Christmas to Christians is not equal to owning Isa (AS) either. If you think you really own Isa (AS) with Islamic perspective then can you tell Christians following verse of Quran as well?

Surat An-Nisā’ 14:171
O People of the Scripture, do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul [created at a command] from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, “Three”; desist - it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs.

So you are saying that instead of saying Merry Christmas we should start reciting a Quran and give a sermon to our Christian friends?

[lethal_kamikaze]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

[muqawwee123]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@vroom

Well shirk is just a belief, the religion is against it very strictly. It can be an unforgivable sin and Ibraheem Alaihis Salam Said we are enemies against Mushrikeen.

So i can only ask you to come appreciate The Oneness of Allah which ia the basis for our existence as an Ummah. The purpose for sending of Rehmatul lil Alameen SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam

If your going to hold me as hostage like kakabilli and say if you tell me something that is against my desires i will disbelieve, that would be unfair

I kid you not that wishing christmas willy nilly being not allowed per Islam is a genuine position of Islamic jurisprudence

What you guys feel and do is anybodies guess. Lets not force these opinions of the most liberal of people upon the religion

Today you are shunning question by calling us liberals, but in future when whole generation will ask ‘why people call us intolerant, bigot’, it would be difficult for Muslims to reply. I do follow religion and know something about the concept of shirk (may be not as deep as your goodself), but I seriously feel that we need a reconstruction of thought (call it biddat or what) which doesn’t afraid of questions and which not lead to disastrous thought as I read in a poem today.

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/intikhaab/651199-wanna-be-liberals.html

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

Shirk as such is a broad concept. We can see
some objectional acts when we visit mazars. I have seen people lighting lamps, and bowing in front of graves. Should I as a human judge those who do those acts or do not do them myself and leave the case of others to Allah?

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@kakaballi

I have admitted that I have severely limited knowledge about religion. It was an accident perhaps that I was born in a Muslim family.

Given that I have limited knowledge about the religion, I am myself not sure which group ‘represents’ me.

I know

It is this attitude that keeps me away from getting interested in religion more than I already am. I would rather be happy with being labelled as ‘misguided’ than being a bigoted self-righteous uptight know–it-all throwing kufr fatwas around.

I not just a bigotted self righteous know it all, i am better then you full stop. Yeah im cool’er then you too

Who told you to make a bigotted self righteous knowing qwack all reply to my comment that i was a Sunni?

I know things about what you said regarding my being the reason for you being erm how shall we put it (to be nice) erm liberal?

It was an accident that you were born into a Muslim family - you said. Please look at this statement in detail and stop blaming me.

Guidance comes from Allah Ta’ala and you have been guided to cursing your good fortune. My saying it is impermissible/permissible to wish christmas has nothing, absolute nothing to do with the state you have been given. Its all your own work

[muqawwee123]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@lethal_kamikaze

LKK bhai. say it in words. Thanks to some Mullahs, we don;t have this facility in Pakistan (I hope you are not for banning this facility).

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@muqawwee123

Today you are shunning question by calling us liberals, but in future when whole generation will ask ‘why people call us intolerant, bigot’, it would be difficult for Muslims to reply. I do follow religion and know something about the ncept of shirk (may be not as deep as your goodself), but I seriously feel that we need a reconstruction of thought (call it biddat or what) which doesn’t afraid of questions and which not lead to disastrous thought as I read in a poem today.

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/intikhaab/651199-wanna-be-liberals.html

I have not read your link yet, but remind me what we are arguing about?

Are you saying if i was to say wishing merry christmas was not allowed or that one must stick to the teachings pf Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah i would be a bigot?

[muqawwee123]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@vroom

I have not read your link yet, but remind me what we are arguing about?

Are you saying if i was to say wishing merry christmas was not allowed or that one must stick to the teachings pf Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah i would be a bigot?

leave it. ou are preoccupied with something and if you are interested then read all the posts in this thread again. I don’t entertain those who after long night story telling ask ‘zulekha mard tha ke aurat’.

[lethal_kamikaze]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@muqawwee123

LKK bhai. say it in words. Thanks to some Mullahs, we don;t have this facility in Pakistan (I hope you are not for banning this facility).

Peace Muqawe Bhai,

Pardon me forgotten YT is banned in Pak. Give me some time i’ll write if for you as well for others who are unable to see YT.

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@Ali_Syed

Shirk as such is a broad concept. We can see
some objectional acts when we visit mazars. I have seen people lighting lamps, and bowing in front of graves. Should I as a human judge those who do those acts or do not do them myself and leave the case of others to Allah?

Shirk is a broad subject. The actions you see at Mazaars have a basis in the religion. They are not Shirk!

Where-as the christians are confirmed as being upon shirk. So your claim that Muslims are upon shirk is not accepted, lighting lamps and bowing infront of graves is Not shirk in Islam

[Mirch]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@muqawwee123

leave it. ou are preoccupied with something and if you are interested then read all the posts in this thread again. I don’t entertain those who after long night story telling ask ‘zulekha mard tha ke aurat’.

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@muqawwee123

leave it. ou are preoccupied with something and if you are interested then read all the posts in this thread again. I don’t entertain those who after long night story telling ask ‘zulekha mard tha ke aurat’.

Just by you saying such and such position is ‘intolerant and bigotted’ does not mean it is such

However if the positions are Islamic and you are saying they intolerant and bigotted then that is a blasphemy

I am not too interested in future generationa liberal feelings. I do not wish to make my life a quest to make theirs as a non islamic influenced comfort zone. No thats not what life as a muslim is about

It would be better for you to say you [as in me] are wrong to say it is impermissible to wish christians merry christmas. That would be better

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

That’s what you believe. How can one condone someone bowing in front of graves? Aren’t we supposed to bow only in front of Allah? This is just one thing we can cite many other similar things. It’s rich throwing stones while sitting in a glass house.

@vroom

Shirk is a broad subject. The actions you see at Mazaars have a basis in the religion. They are not Shirk!

Where-as the christians are confirmed as being upon shirk. So your claim that Muslims are upon shirk is not accepted, lighting lamps and bowing infront of graves is Not shirk in Islam

[vroom]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@vroom

I have not read your link yet, but remind me what we are arguing about?

Are you saying if i was to say wishing merry christmas was not allowed or that one must stick to the teachings pf Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah i would be a bigot?

this is a spot on Question,

I do not have idea why anyone would not answer it, except if they kinda knew that the actual issue is being extracted from the hot air

[muqawwee123]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@vroom

Shirk is a broad subject. The actions you see at Mazaars have a basis in the religion. They are not Shirk!

Where-as the christians are confirmed as being upon shirk. So your claim that Muslims are upon shirk is not accepted, lighting lamps and bowing infront of graves is Not shirk in Islam

Not again.. tera kutta kutta hai, mera kutta tommy and chit bhi meri pat bhi meri.

[muqawwee123]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

@vroom

Just by you saying such and such position is ‘intolerant and bigotted’ does not mean it is such

**However if the positions are Islamic and you are saying they intolerant and bigotted then that is a blasphemy
**
I am not too interested in future generationa liberal feelings. I do not wish to make my life a quest to make theirs as a non islamic influenced comfort zone. No thats not what life as a muslim is about

It would be better for you to say you [as in me] are wrong to say it is impermissible to wish christians merry christmas. That would be better

Thanks for telling me whats blasphemy and whats not. Main shaheed hone ke liye tayyar hoon

[Samir_Mirchandani]

Re: Wishing the christians happy christmas? Allowed or no?

when you wish somebody, do you think they asked for it or benefit by it? or do you benefit by cheering a fellow human being?

There are hundreds of millions of muslims living in non-muslim countries. These have tens of millions of children and play, mingle and learn with non-muslim children. are you going to teach your children that what the majority of their classmates are doing (such as wishing each other happy diwali, merry christmas, happy hanukka…) is sin?

seriously? you have ANY idea what mindset YOU will create in YOUR children if you do that?

I have NEVER come across a Muslim in India or the US that had any issues celebrating diwali or christmas with me or fail to invite me for special biryani! Where are these new found pseudo concepts of Islam coming from?