Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Personally, I do not find purdah, itself, backward (as long as it is the choice of the woman herself). I think what irritates some people about purdah is the attitude of some women who practice purdah.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Don't you think that bad attitude is not just limited to ladies doing purdah? There may certain reasons behind the attitude of ladies doing purdah.. A perception based on certain experiences, about ladies not following purdah. So, I think its a two way game and as you said its a personal choice (may be in open societies), but in societies where religion is strictly followed (wrongly or rightly), there is no space for personal choice in these matters.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
What about the practice of ladies selling gents products like from Razor to shaving cream (in ads all around the world)? Will you also call that sexist?
not really. what i find sexist is the limitation and rights of women in certain religions and cultures and how a womans modesty is about her attire and virginity. to me, thats extremely backward and oppressive
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
not really. what i find sexist is the limitation and rights of women in certain religions and cultures and how a womans modesty is about her attire and virginity. to me, thats extremely backward and oppressive
But some cultures and socities do consider it exploitation, when woman is sold as sex object by giving magical titles like 'sex symbol'.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Purdah is neither oppressive nor sign of backwardness. Its as much right of women to practice it as others who prefer to shun it. As far as attitudes of women practicing purdah women is concerned, I have seen the same for them. Some people mock them like those courting beards (like Muqawwee :D).
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
courting bears (like me)? 
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
beard.. 
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Don't you think that bad attitude is not just limited to ladies doing purdah? There may certain reasons behind the attitude of ladies doing purdah.. A perception based on certain experiences, about ladies not following purdah. So, I think its a two way game and as you said its a personal choice (may be in open societies), but in societies where religion is strictly followed (wrongly or rightly), there is no space for personal choice in these matters.
Muqa, I am not referring to the generic bad attitude. You are quite right that anyone can have that.
The attitude I am referring to in regards to some women who practice purdah is that belief that people must make exceptions for them and cater to them because of a choice that they, themselves, made. For instance, when I worked as a lab technician while I was still at uni, there was once an applicant who was a niqabbi and was applying to be lab technician. She had a problem with numerous aspects of our workplace, such as the uniform, which was standard medical scrubs and was required for SAFETY reasons, and working with male colleagues and expected exceptions to be made for her. Why? If she filled out the application, it is quite likely that she knew what the requirements were as they were listed on the application. If she had a problem with these, why apply and expect exceptions to be made for her? Needless to say, she didn't get the job.
I've seen that type of attitude, to a lesser extent, in a couple of other scenarios and do not understand it. While I don't believe purdah is backward or oppressive if it is the choice of the woman herself, I do believe it is unreasonable to expect special treatment.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Got your point, but the case you are referring is from a society where purdah followers are like beggars (and beggars got no choice). My question was a whole in societies like Pakistan where flag bearer of humanity and female empowerment like Asma Jehangir take purdah following as synonym to injustice to women.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
I don;t have beard and I don’t mock people having beard.
BTW, in show-biz section I got a new meaning of ‘having beard’ referring to certain ladies.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Muqa, I am not referring to the generic bad attitude. You are quite right that anyone can have a bad attitude.
The attitude I am referring to in regards to some women who practice purdah is that people must make exceptions for them and cater to them because of a choice that they, themselves, made. For instance, when I worked as a lab technician while I was still at uni, there was once an applicant who was a niqabbi and was applying to be lab technician. She had a problem with numerous aspects of our workplace, such as the uniform, which was standard medical scrubs and was required for SAFETY reasons, and working with male colleagues and expected exceptions to be made for her. Why? If she filled out the application, it is likely that she knew about certain requirements as they were listed on the application. If she had a problem with these, why apply and expect exceptions to be made for her? Needless to say, she didn't get the job.
I've seen that type of attitude, to a lesser extent, in a couple of other scenarios and do not understand it. Personally, I do not believe that society is obligated to make exceptions for individuals unless they are disabled and purdah is not a disability.
A bit far generalising though. Even though she knew it would put her at a disadvantage she has nothing to lose from applying from the job role. BUt getting angry over someone who has requirements is not appropriate. Everyone has requirements some more then others getting offended over someone elses more strict requirements is taking it too far You wouldn't judge someone of their requirements in a spouse then why their religion which is a million times more imporant?
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Got your point, but the case you are referring is from a society where purdah followers are like beggars (and beggars got no choice). My question was a whole in societies like Pakistan where flag bearer of humanity and female empowerment like Asma Jehangir take purdah following as synonym to injustice to women.
Its wrong to believe beggers can't be choosers we may have different statuses in life but all humans have the same dignity and have the right to hope for equally good things.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
BTW, in show-biz section I got a new meaning of 'having beard' referring to certain ladies.
really?
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showbiz-pakistan/590772-latest-news-and-gossip-14.html
post 278 onwards
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
does that beard refer to singers or what?
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
But some cultures and socities do consider it exploitation, when woman is sold as sex object by giving magical titles like 'sex symbol'.
again, it depends on your own view and how you look at things. for me, when a woman feels she must cover herself to protect her from men, thats limiting her freedom simply because some perverted men cannot control themselves. i find women being much more oppressed in strict religious societies whether its christian, muslim or hindu as compared to truly secular liberal societies. i know you dont agree with any of this but i just felt like sharing my opinion.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Got your point, but the case you are referring is from a society where purdah followers are like beggars (and beggars got no choice). My question was a whole in societies like Pakistan where flag bearer of humanity and female empowerment like Asma Jehangir take purdah following as synonym to injustice to women.
I do not believe that purdah is "backward" or oppressive to women if the woman herself made the decision to practice purdah. A major component of female empowerment is women having the freedom to make their own personal decisions, regardless of what they may choose. Many people erroneously believe that the term "female empowerment" is synonymous with and limited to adopting a more westernised lifestyle and presumptuously assume that every woman wants this type of lifestyle.
"Female empowerment" supporters who stereotype women who choose to practice purdah are rather like the "feminists" who mock women who choose to be housewives. In reality, such people do not want women to make their own decisions. They want women to follow their agenda and only support "female empowerment" if it is inline with their own ideology.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Is it so in Arab word? I have seen Laila wearing veil in Indian movie 'Laila Majnoo'.
intrestingly the niqaab began first in baghdad during the silk road. Men of many different countries would stare at the local women (which at that time would wear revealing clothes with their chest being visable. So the men became jelous , so the veil was enforced to prevent men staring at the local women and causing trouble with the local arab men. This is what i have hear so the veil orginally wasn't enforced for religious reasons to begin with lol.
Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
Not many people realise that covering of face Middle East is a protection against environmental damage. It is as much of beauty ritual as it is a cultural requirement. Historically, both and women in Arabic Bedouin used to cover their faces to protect their skin from blowing sand and murderous sun of the desert land. The popular image of an Arabic Bedouin folklore hero in literature is of a man covered from head to toe in a loose fit and layered tunic/gown, wearing a loosely wrapped turban, covering his neck and face, riding a horse or a camel with long thin sword visibly dangling from his waistband. Probably the images below convey a better idea:
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Re: Why Purdah is considered as a sign of backwardness?
again, it depends on your own view and how you look at things. for me, when a woman feels she must cover herself to protect her from men, thats limiting her freedom simply because some perverted men cannot control themselves. i find women being much more oppressed in strict religious societies whether its christian, muslim or hindu as compared to truly secular liberal societies. i know you dont agree with any of this but i just felt like sharing my opinion.
Agree but I don't think there is a barometer to know overall happiness / satisfaction of humans and ladies in a particular society. Sometimes, following rituals and customs is in our roots and in-built in our psyche and most of the time its difficult to run-away from your roots. You may get a temporary break from these practices, but the in-built psyche finally lead you to believe in these practices if not following actively. Many people who call offering prayers as takkar maarna finally come to close contact with God, when they are near death. So nothing is final and absolute in this world.
