Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
^we r quite clear abt our beliefs that got to us through the house of Mohammad SAWW.......perhaps u shud worry first abt the obvious contradictions in ur books and teachings tht got through to u..............
So you are going to ignore the sayings of Imam Ali (ra)???
Even Christian, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs and the rest are equally clear about their books as much as your are.
Can you advise me which Shia books you consider to be contradictions-free?
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
So you are going to ignore the sayings of Imam Ali (ra)???
No...I just ignore ur interpretation of the words of maula Ali......have u read this thread before commenting?
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Even Christian, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs and the rest are equally clear about their books as much as your are.
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U can't really b sure of tht......only Allah knows the secrets of the hearts.......but I know one thing abt the Hindus is tht they can have 2 of their gods fighting each other while both being the gods and supposedly good......now that is some real serious contradiction....would u not agree?
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Can you advise me which Shia books you consider to be contradictions-free?
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I was talking about the teachings.......not books that authors themselves have called "sahih" while shutting the doors of ijtehad to those outside the club.....
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
No...I just ignore ur interpretation of the words of maula Ali......have u read this thread before commenting?
I did not give any interpretation to the words of Imam Ali (ra).
It’s just that you rather follow ayatullahs and zakirs, Imam Ali (ra) sermon can wait.
Forget about me reading the thread, better you read the sermon and I have highlighted some portion of it for your attention.
*Spoken when Amir al-mu'minin was busy in the funeral ablution (ghusl) of the Holy Prophet and shrouding him *(the following quoting from Nahjul Balagha)
“May my father and my mother shed their lives for you. O' Messenger of Allah! With your death the process of prophet hood, revelation and heavenly messages has stopped, which had not stopped at the death of others (prophets). Your position with us (members of your family) is so special that your grief has become a source of consolation (to us) as against the grief of all others; your grief is also common so that all Muslims share it equally.
If you had not ordered endurance and prevented us from bewailing, we would have produced a store of tears and even then the pain would not have subsided, and this grief would not have ended, and they would have been too little of our grief for you. But this (death) is a matter that cannot be reversed nor is it possible to repulse it. May my father and my mother die for you; do remember us with Allah and take care of us.” Nahjul Balagha Sermon 233
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
^ur post warrants a two line reply but I will discuss the issue a little bit more.........first of all very glad to c u referencing the gem of a book that is called nahjul balagha...........u r missing the whole point though...........read the words of Maula Ali and reflect on how he handled the affairs of the nation at the death of the Prophet SAWW........he followed every word of the Prophet SAWW and remained patient not only at the loss of his master but also the events tht followed suit as he says in sermon of Shaqshaqiah in Nahjul Balagha which I would like to quote a passage of here too since we r at it......
"........Then I began to think whether I should assault or endure calmly the blinding darkness of tribulations wherein the grown up are made feeble and the young grow old and the true believer acts under strain till he meets Allah (on his death). I found that endurance thereon was wiser. So I adopted patience although there was pricking in the eye and suffocation (of mortification) in the throat. I watched the plundering of my inheritance till the first one went his way but handed over the Caliphate to Ibn al-Khattab after himself........"
now that we see janab e Ali following every word of the Prophet SAWW so closely as was expected of him.....I ask you what was Prophet's sayings in reference to Imam Hussain's martyrdom?........I am sure u will agree that there are no 2 opinions abt how he SAWW remembered Karbala and expected it to be remembered as evident in numerous narrations from both the Shia and Sunni books........there r several references posted in this thread which may have missed ur eye.....tht is why I inquired if u had read the thread before commenting......Prophet SAWW had foretold of his own death at the final pilgrims ordering Muslims to patient and cling on to Quran and his family for guidance........(yet we see a certain prominent individual who acted very strangely at his SAWW departure from this world but that's a different story).......Imam Ali and the real followers of the Prophet SAWW did exactly what they were ordered by the Prophet SAWW........and for Imam hussain AS too they did exactly what they were ordered.........there is no need of 'qiyaas' or guess-work when the command of the Prophet SAWW is apparent to all of us.......
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
Alhumdolillah, Matam e Husain will only increase with the time. Now almost in every corner of this world we have Jaloos e mohrum and aza-dari. I suggest you lot get used to it.
It is the blessing of this Azadari that now even worst of you know what happened in Karbala.
It is this Azadari that makes every enemy of ahlulbait stand out like a sore thumb. Including many on this forum.
So, in essence Matam is here to stay till the revenge of unjust killing of Prophet's PBUH family is taken. I am praying that you don't have to wait too long for this matam to end. Until then please wait or may be ask Allah for forgiveness in advance before it is too late.
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
I think we should let everyone live their lives as they want.
I've nothing against anyone doing matam or not doing it. It really is a choice of preference how you interpret the different hadith as I have seen.
However, what I fail to understand is that our Shia brother and sister go all "haw haye" if we mention anything remotely related to their matam. Yet, they dont look at their own behavior for instance when they are cursing Hazrat Abu Baker or Hazrat Umar and want all the sunni brother and sisters to shut and say they are right?!
Both groups really need to evaluate your behavior and consider how you're portraying muslims, because a non-muslim really doesnt care whether you're shia or sunni. For them, you're just muslim, which in fact you all should start emphasizing on instead of mocking one another, because none of you is better than the other. Truth said.
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
^agree with what u r saying except for the middle part......u r generalizing there..........just like a minority of Sunnis like suicide bombing as their choice of career....very small number of Shias that possess mediocre to no knowledge abt their religion indulge in abuse of personalities revered by Sunnis.......better not to let the rotten eggs (extremists) color your view of either the Shias or the Sunnis......
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
^these were 2 ppl with the same name......one was Hinda's bro.......the other was the half bro of the 3rd caliph and served him as the governor of Kufa where he famously led a fajr congragetional prayer to 4 rakats while under the influence of alcohol.....and later as governor of Madina.....it was him who asked Imam Hussein in Madina for the bayat of Yazid.......
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
^is it just the name that makes people behave good or bad?
it obviously cud influence the personality but waleed itself is not a bad name and there is no prohibition in keeping tht name.........there have been thousands of bad ppl with beautiful names and vice versa....
Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram
it obviously cud influence the personality but waleed itself is not a bad name and there is no prohibition in keeping tht name.........there have been thousands of bad ppl with beautiful names and vice versa....
Just out of curiosity, whether the names Yazeed (which literally means Ba Barkat and there is famous sufi saint Bayazeed Bastami as well), Abu Bakr, Usman are approved by Shias. I can't forget one of our shia teacher who was very bad with students having names Abu Bakr, Usman, etc. I also remember Josh Maleeh Abadi's ' Yadon ki Baraat' where he made fun of the name of Hazrat Abu Bakr (RA).
