Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Im finding u a reference which explains that this is all well and good in normal cases.

But where injustice has been done we are enjoined to raise our voices and our arms against it

and there was no bigger injustice than the slaughter of ahle bait at karbala

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

We read in Surah Nisa 004.148:

YUSUFALI: Allah loveth not that evil should be noised abroad in public speech, except where injustice hath been done; for Allah is He who heareth and knoweth all things.

This verse makes it clear that the public’s relaying of injustice is permissible. Relaying the suffering of a victim is permissible.

As narrated by al Tabari in History Volume 9 page 183 (English translation by Ismail Poonawala):

**Abbas narrates:

"I heard Ayesha saying “The Messenger of God died on my bosom during my turn, I did not wrong anyone in regard to him. It was because of my ignorance and youthfulness that the Messenger of God died while he was in my lap. Then I laid his head on a pillow and got up beating my chest and slapping my face along with the women”.**

Ibn Katheer al Nasibi in al Bidayah wa al Nihayah Volume 5 page 420 published by Nafees Academy Karachi records the event as follows:

“Rasulullah (s) died while he was in my lap. Then I laid his head on a pillow and got up beating my face along with other women”.
[http://www.paklinks.com/aDecors/image_ico.gif

Bidayah wa al Nihayah, Volume 5, page 420](http://www.answering-ansar.org/answers/azadari/al_bidayah_v5_p420.jpg)
[http://www.paklinks.com/aDecors/image_ico.gif

Sirah Ibn Ishaq, page 713 (declared ‘Hasan’)](http://www.answering-ansar.org/answers/azadari/Sirah_Ibn_Ishaq_p713.jpg)
[http://www.paklinks.com/aDecors/image_ico.gif

Sirah Ibn Hisham, Volume 4 page 655](http://www.answering-ansar.org/answers/azadari/Sirah_Ibn_Hisham_v4_p655.jpg)

Do we need to say anymore? Would the wives of the Prophet (s) indulge in a Haraam activity? Look at the beating ritual by the women of Madina. Ibn Katheer mentions how extreme that beating was that their faces reddened with slapping. What do the Nasibi say about these women?

The extreme mourning of Uways al-Qarni (ra)
The most explicit proof of self-inflicted injury comes from Owais al-Qarni the great Muslim Sahabi, praised by both Shi’a and Sunni erudite. He had an immense love for the Holy Prophet (s). When the news reached him in Yemen that two teeth of the Holy Prophet (s) were broken in the battle of Ohad, he extracted all his teeth. When the Holy Prophet (s) got the news in Medina that Owais had struck down all his teeth, he (s) exclaimed, “Indeed Owais is our devoted friend”. This event can be found written in ‘Seerate Halbia’ vol II, page 295.

The renowned Sunni Scholar Shiekh Farid al Din Attaar in ‘Tazkira tul Awliya’ pages 15-16 writes:

**Hadhrat Uways said: “If you are from amongst companions of the Prophet (s), tell me which tooth of the Holy Prophet (s) was martyred? Also, why did you not break your teeth in adhering to the Prophet (s)?” Upon saying this, he evidenced the fact that his teeth had been broken, and said: “When his (s) tooth was martyred, I broke my tooth, then I thought perhaps it is another tooth, and my continuing to do so, I smashed all of my teeth, and upon doing so I felt comfortable”. Upon witnessing this, the companions proceeded to weep, and they realized that this constituted respect, whilst he had not seen him, he fulfilled the adhered to the obligation to follow the Prophet in its entirety, and taught this lesson when he left this world. **
[http://www.paklinks.com/aDecors/image_ico.gif

Tazkira tul Awliya, pages 15-16 (Mumtaz Academy, Lahore)](http://www.answering-ansar.org/answers/azadari/tazkira_awliya_p15_16.jpg)

Kindly refer to http://www.answering-ansar.org/answers/azadari/en/chap9.php

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

i mean its not just Husein RA and Karbala (north of kufa)
the shia matam as discussed earlier is full time, it is on almost every issue of islam

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

[Yusufali 12:85] They said: "By Allah! (never) wilt thou cease to remember Joseph until thou reach the last extremity of illness, or until thou die!"

the intensity of Yaqub (as)'s grief was to the extent that his sons thought that Yaqub (as) would die on account of his anguish......

anyway.....all arguments beside.....it is quite clear from Sunni text too that Prophet SAWW cried for Imam Hussein and so did the ahlay bayt and the sahaba.............since it is their sunnat so it leaves no room for further arguments...

[quote]
Decent crying is far removed from a frenzy self-flaggelation - the likes of what create euphoric trance like states due to rushing endorphins - I see no one admiring the sacrifice of Imam Hussein (AS) ... everyone is concentrating on how the bodies were treated and that being the cause of grief.
[/QUOTE]

self flagellation is a different topic and lets not start that........

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

what on earth r u even trying to say…read it back to urself and see if it even makes any sense to u!

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

shardmany, u seem like a bit of a fan of convert shows…though u have a poor taste b/c these characters in ur video have phitkaar on their faces and that is not a trait of at least our school…anyway, here is a better program for u if u want to see some real reverts with brains and character…actually one of our gupshup members, who is a convert, appeared on that show too…take a guess and try and look and listen…http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=reverts+world+ahlulbayt+tv&oq=reverts+world+ahlulbayt+tv&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=3271l3966l0l4173l6l5l0l0l0l0l0l0ll0l0

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Assalamo-Alaikum-Warahamatullah-Wabarakatahu,

So hurting yourself and causing pain to yourself is according to Islam allowed. Where were the real men who could've stopped this brutal act when it was neccessary? Where their hands cutt off already by Yazid? Will this barbaric act show their love to the Aley-Bait? I have no respect for such akward practises, practises which have nothing to do with the teachings of Muhammad Mustafa (saw). Now wonder Islam is not taken serious.

The greatest insult to my beloved Prophet Muhammad Mustafa (saw) was another one, though. The creation of the Shia and Sunni sect. And no I won't take away my words as I'm writing the truth. Muhammad Mustafa (saw) came to unify mankind, not to create division. After Prophethood, Khilafat takes over the work. As long as there is no unity, there is no Islam. This thread shows it all. Shia and Sunni members throwing shoes at each other. I applaude.

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

I am happy with shias doing matam , they abuse sahaba /ummahatul momineen and thus justifiably beat themselves.

Self destruction at work.

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

ok, so what i cant seem to understand is when someone dies, we have been told not to cry too much or even at all, for its not good for the deceased, and instead to offer prayers etc. im sure someone with more religious knowledge can even give a ref, sorry i have no refernces, but from what ive heard amnd been told etc. so if this is the case, wouldnt it be better to 0ffer prayers for the same, rather than beat urself.......

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Nadz I can PM you about this. It's a highly miscontrued hadith

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Its a very long debate to be honest and we cant even say everything which we know and which shouldnt be said

So its better just not to talk about it!

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

i’ll swap you a hundred for every one syed ameer hussain shah

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

The Prophet Muhammad ( صلی الله عليہ وسل م ) stood before a large gathering of Muslims anddelivered an address at the time of his final pilgrimage. It is well known in history as the fare-well address of the Prophet. In the course of this address he said:

*“O men, lend me an attentive ear. For I know not whether I will stand before you again in this valley and address you as I address you now. Your lives and your possessions have been made immune by God to attacks by one another until the Day of Judgment.
...
O men, you still have in your possession some prisoners of war. I advise you, therefore, to feed them and to clothe them in the same way and style as you feed and clothe yourselves. If they do anything wrong which you are unable to forgive, then pass them on to someone else. They are part of God’s creation. To give them pain or trouble can never be right. O men, what I say to you, you must hear and remember. All Muslims are as brethren to one another. All of you are equal. All men, whatever nation or tribe they may belong to, and whatever station in life they may hold, are equal. Allah has made you brethren one to another, so be not divided. An Arab has no preference over a non-Arab, nor a non-Arab over an Arab; nor is a white one to be preferred to a dark one, nor a dark one to a white one.”
*
While he was saying this the Prophet Muhammad ( صلی الله عليہ وسل م ) raised his hands and joined the fingers of the one hand with the fingers of the other and then said:

*“Even as the fingers of the two hands are equal, so are human beings equal to one another. No one has any right, any superiority to claim over another. You are as brothers. Do you know what month this is? What territory we are in? What day of the year it is today?” The Muslims said in reply, they knew it was the sacred month, the sacred land and the day of the Hajj.
*
Then the Prophet Muhammad ( صلی الله عليہ وسل م ) said:

“Even as this month is sacred, this land inviolate, and this day holy, so has God made the lives, property and honor of every man sacred. To take any man’s life or his property, or attack his honor, is as unjust and wrong as to violate the sacredness of this day, this month, and this territory. What I command you today is not meant only for today. It is meant for all time. You are expected to remember it and to act upon it until you leave this world and go to the next to meet your Maker.”

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

wasalam.......read history and u will find out where the "real men" were during and after the battle of Karbala........some very interesting events unfolded before and after the tragedy.......I will give u a name of noble Sahabhi's name to look up........Sulayman bin Surad........and Mukhtar ibn Abi Ubaydallah....

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Bigboi The Prophet (saw) also warned his Ummah to be aware of false prophets who will lead their followers to Abyss

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Sorry mate, the guy is above and beyond lame to say the least. Might succeed in impressing a few rural, poor desi folks.

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

No wonder shardmany is impressed.

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

I thought at first it was that shias didn’t know enough to answer this,now they know too much to write it here? :confused:

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

Prophet Muhammad’s demise was the biggest calamity to afflict the Ummah.

This can be confirmed by the following hadith.

Ibn ‘Abbas (ra) and Saabit Al-Jumahee (ra) both related that the Prophet (saw) said:
“If one of you is afflicted with a calamity, then let him remember his calamity by me (i.e., by my death); for indeed, it is the greatest of calamities.”

The Messenger of Allah (saw) said:

“O people, let any person – or any believer – who has been afflicted with a calamity remember his calamity by me and hence find solace in his calamity by any other person [or occurrence], for no one from my Nation will be afflicted by a calamity after me that is more severe upon him than my calamity.” [Related by Ibn Majah, and narrated by 'Aishah (RA) in Sahih Sunan Ibn Majah (No. 1300)]

Hz. Ali (ra) said:
The best that can be said when remembering these and similar calamities is that which Hz. Ali ibn al-Husayn (ra) narrated from his grandfather (Hz. Ali (ra)) that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), who said: “There is no Muslim who is afflicted by a calamity and when he remembers it, even if it was in the dim and distant past, he says Inna Lillaahi wa inna ilayhi raaji’oon (verily to Allaah we belong and unto Him is our return), but Allaah will give him a reward like that of the day when it befell him.”

Narrated by Imam Ahmad and Ibn Majaah, end quote from al-Bidaayah wa’l-Nihaayah (8/221).

Spoken when Amir al-mu'minin was busy in the funeral ablution (ghusl) of the Holy Prophet and shrouding him (the following quoting from Nahjul Balagha)

“May my father and my mother shed their lives for you. O' Messenger of Allah! With your death the process of prophet hood, revelation and heavenly messages has stopped, which had not stopped at the death of others (prophets). Your position with us (members of your family) is so special that your grief has become a source of consolation (to us) as against the grief of all others; your grief is also common so that all Muslims share it equally.

If you had not ordered endurance and prevented us from bewailing, we would have produced a store of tears and even then the pain would not have subsided, and this grief would not have ended, and they would have been too little of our grief for you. But this (death) is a matter that cannot be reversed nor is it possible to repulse it. May my father and my mother die for you; do remember us with Allah and take care of us.” Nahjul Balagha Sermon 233

It makes one wonder if present days Shias consider their grief more for Imam Hussain(ra) than Hazrat Ali's (ra) grief for Rasool-ALLAH(saw)

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Re: Why do Shias beat upon themselves on 9/10 muharram

^we r quite clear abt our beliefs that got to us through the house of Mohammad SAWW.......perhaps u shud worry first abt the obvious contradictions in ur books and teachings tht got through to u..............