Who is the bigger sinner

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Are we dealing with psychotic anger issues, what in that post triggered such a response? I am empathetic toward people with mental diseases, polluting is a crime punishable by law, like throwing down the drain hazardous waste, Yes you get to stand in front of a magistrate and you are judged by him.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

If you think that was anger you must be a fairy.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

https://scontent-a-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1.0-9/s526x395/1924536_305029212983216_7558200883641008442_n.jpg

On the ignore list !!!

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Dear Knight30,

The correct format for your above post is below

Ignoring

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Don't get drawn in (like me) into unnecessary arguments. I appreciate your original post. It would make people with the right mindset think about their own abuse of the environment. We all can improve in this aspect.

If folks have anger management issues which they mask with unnecessary bluster, that is their problem.

You have certainly gotten the dialog started. Thank you for that.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Thank you for the guidance, have you heard of Net Zero Houses, they produce as much energy as they use, Solar is the most economical, reduces tons of CO2 emissions, these will be the wave of the future, China is really gotten on board with sustainability we just installed 10KW Solar PV system on our house.

https://scontent-a-sea.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/p296x100/10150739_10202946817846727_5352533324307270687_n.jpg

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Southie you have no idea how predictable you have become.

You were once a poster who provided good unbiased opinion but lately your opinion always leads you on the side opposing religion. You have no idea how obnoxious that is.

And lol anger management.

As for the dialogue he got started, I think you're just thankful that he got to use a religious family to showcase the nemesis of mother earth. Rather than discuss everyone's own ethical responsibility and duty of care to the environment, he decides to juxtapose with a religious family and imply that they are nemesis of the environment in this picture. Rather than addressing an issue he was having more fun picking who better to finger point. And you sided with that? Yuck.

And the fact that he used a religious family to point his finger was awesome eh? I bet you loved that didnt you. Excited the little overzealous atheist in you into a spasm.

This constant behaviour of yours since your unbanning has seen you lose respect not just in my own eyes but in the eyes of many, some belonging to the group of people first to welcome you back.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Cough cough. I read ur q's 4 lines and stopped reading. I am not anti religion. In fact I accept the ALL religions preach good things. In this thread I gave my opinion on Christian conservatives not being good environmental stewards. And gave my opinion that being a good environmental steward is preferable to being pious or non pious. In other words if u r atheist and pollute u r equally bad as if u r religious and polkute.

U used to bring some honesty to the table. What happened?

PS I still enjoy ur posts when u r not angry. You are funny and fair for the most part.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Congratulations on the 10 kW solar installation. Net metering allows power to be fed back to grid also. Yes with China flooding market solar prices have dropped. Europe some countries may be penalizing solar owners - fee for using grid T&D system. Spain I think. Germany I spite of not having as much sun as other places is ahead of curve.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

You changed. That's what happened.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

I know i haven't. I know i respect all faiths all cultures and all lifestyles.

But I do respect ur opinion. Will stick to non controversial threads from now on.

Take it easy.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

This is why Islam emphasizes that Allah doesn't only look at our deeds, He also looks at our hearts and He is the only one who has access to the hearts.

If a woman wears a hijab only for the sake of Allah and does so with humility, wherein she doesn't believe this single act guarantees her salvation ...nor does she harbor contempt for those that don't wear hijab...nor does she believe it exempts her from being a good citizen... avoids hurting all of Allah's creation be it living or inanimate.......then IMO she would be a less transgressor than the individual who actively takes care of the environment but with a damaging sort of pride wherein he believes himself to be superior to other Muslims based on just this act alone, where he tries to diminish or invalidate other forms of worship based solely on one act. And Allah knows best.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Red velvet dvelvet;9992290]Knight, millions of people contribute toward pollution....not just this family.

Look at the wording of your original post. Even if majority of the people who respond to your thread were to tell you that this family are "bigger" sinners according to their own limited understanding which is not on the level of Allah's knowledge.......what would it accomplish for you? Will you jump around in glee that you've received a collective shunning of this family in your thread that validates your own contempt for them? Is that not also disturbing? Will you show this family your thread? Are you trying to send us the message that religious people are the worst offenders of the environment compared to liberal folks? Do you want us to question the validity of religion or the following of it? You could have expressed your concerns about the environment by including religious references for it as a way to make members more aware and to motivate them......it need not be turned into a platform to "judge" another person/family.......how is that productive or constructive? And if you know this family well, have you made any attempts to encourage them to be more careful about the environment? Have you tried speaking to them from a religious perspective. As I said earlier, religious people are not perfect....they need reminders just like everyone else.
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Redvelvet yours is one of the most interesting and productive replies I have ever read on GS . :-)

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Adherence to the pillars (salah, hajj, etc) or hijab/beard are done for Allah not societal status. I will reiterate again that Muslims, like people of other religions, are not saints. And if you are in the habit of watching beard and hijab sporting Muslims like a hawk for their errors so that you can label them as "bigger sinners" *or invalidate their prayers and other forms of worship, then that's something you need to reflect over. The natural environment is not the only one which can be polluted. When one's heart is teeming with arrogance, it will lead to a pollution of the social environment.

Yes, Islam has qualified sins into major and minor, but judgment is still very complex. To my knowledge, Islam forbids us to even call another Muslim a hypocrite. Hypocrisy is just one aspect of human nature, and here you want us to "judge" a person on the whole as to whether they are a bigger or lesser sinner....why? It is said that anyone with even a grain of pride in their heart won't have a place in jannah. So going by this hadith alone, anyone with this spiritual *malady, be it a 5-time namazi or a stauch tree-hugger who thinks he/she is a better muslim than others is doomed.

There have been wars that have wiped out communities and devastated ecosystems, and they resulted from feelings of arrogance and contempt....so there are bigger sins than being careless about the environment. There are multimillion dollar agricultural companies poisoning our food, spraying pesticides which are possibly killing of the bees that pollinate more than half of our crops. The average people can only do so much, what about the people on the top? And as for clearing the rain-forests, I imagine confronting the companies or forces behind this destruction would be an arduous battle. Are the Muslims to blame for that too? What about people of other religions? Or how about we remove religion from the equation, and maybe it's a natural feeling of fear that corruption tends to induce.

Did the convention you attended entail a debate on who is the bigger sinner? Well, judgment tends to create animosity which divides people, it doesn't bring them together for a common cause. How do you know if a Muslim that is littering is doing so because they're just not thinking or because they have a deliberate disregard for the environment or evil intentions? Perhaps speaking to them kindly with religious references may make them more aware. That would be more productive than telling them that "Of what use is your salah/hijab/beard if you're gonna trash the environment"...or...to look down on them and their ibadat because they are making a mistake that they may even be open to rectifying had someone humbly reminded/guided them.

It would have been one thing if you had said that our salah should also lead us to take care of the planet. That way you'd be encouraging various good acts and not diminishing or invalidating namaz/beard/hijab based of one action. Your approach/method was not tactful and you cannot seem to recognize that. There are only 3 members supporting you. The majority are put off......so maybe take this as a sign that you should reflect on your method/approach.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

i was also called 'shawn', and numerous other names only because my views differed from the general public here. it makes no sense really. and even if the op is whoever you're claiming him/her to be, why does it matter? why is it so hard to focus on the actual post but so necessary to analyze who the OP must be? really makes no sense.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

RV..Just answer the question please, which do you think is a bigger sin not wearing hijab or not taking cans of paint to the eco station, living a life of a huge carbon footprint. If only lectures could earn respect. unfortunately in the civilized society we judge people by their actions, the day we act in a positive way contributing to society we won't need to swear, cuss, and bully people demanding respect. Religion has itself rendered namaz of many people useless, such as for dikhawa, of women whose husbands are mad at them, unjust people etc. If your prayers do not make you a good citizen, a good neighbour, a good employee and a good relation then the only value I see in it is stretching.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

what harms others is a bigger sin no doubt.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

You know what's really sad, Eliminator? That you believe Muslims who wear hijab/beard and perform the pillars only do it to receive an elevated status in society. Not only do you want to judge who is a bigger sinner, you've already looked into the hearts of other Muslims and determined the intention behind ALL their other acts of worship; that they can only be for dikhawa. That's sick. Worry about your own inner pollution first. Fear Allah's knowledge and judgment of your own heart first before fearing the plight of the environment and the spiritual state of others. And in attempting to guide other Muslims you've so confidently deemed to be hypocrites, adopt a more humble approach.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Why do you keep referring to me by other names, we don't need to look in peoples hearts, we need to see their actions. Actions speak louder than words, if the actions of a religious person are worse than non religious person, does he deserve more respect, all the firqas ripping each others throats out I believe are fairly observant people, I am supposed to ignore the fact that Mr Haji Sir, you just slaughtered someone in cold blood as he says his namaz different from you.

Re: Who is the bigger sinner

Been accused of being anti religious more than once. So one more clarification. So far I have not argued AGAINST religion anywhere including this. What I have done in this thread is get the religious folks to realize that OP is NOT attacking ANY religion. He is bringing a hypothetical case of the actions of one family damaging the environment. While the family may be pious. While a non pious family by its actions takes care of environment.

The issue of what a religion stands for has not been raised. Had OP raised that , I would be the first to criticize.

Please don't make this abt attack on Religion. Any religion. It's a thought provoking exercise on how we need to talk the talk and walk the walk.

When I went after Christian conservatives I didn't go after christianity. My wife is a christian. Went after folks who literally don't give a damn. Don't recycle. Don't use cloth bags. Idle 15 min in drive through instead of walking in and getting order taken care of faster.

None of this is attack on religion. That several posters don't grasp how serious a problem climate change and pollution are is the tragedy. Bringing up irrelevant things such as if one does things with pride and looking down it doesn't Count. OP raised no such points. It's all in your head. And as a clique no one challenges each other.

SORRY cough cough got to speak my mind. My conscience is clear on this one. It is the other side that sees an attack on religion where there is none that needs to remove it's rose colored glasses.