when rishta comes...

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes…

@noor321

@Omer259
God seriously. Ok imagine if you were the father of a daughter and you had gotten her married to someone who was in your social circle or through a friend. Then allah na karay the guy turns out to be uneducated but belongs to a rich family. Although when you asked people everyone told you he was educated. This could be because the people you asked we in their plan or had no idea because they thought he was, because he belonged to a rich family. Wouldn’t you regret your decision then? Just because people you know tell the rishta is good, doesn’t mean it is.

I know of an example where the couple are first cousins but the guy turned out to be a jerk and keeps asking the girls family for money. So even if you are close family it doesn’t guarantee whatever they tell you is true.

:k:

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes...

Reha,

You clearly have issues that I cannot provide any therapy for. People like you are angry at themselves for being put into two different cultures( West and Pakistan) that they do not understand. You cannot survive in Pakistan and you are treated as a 2nd class citizen in the US, so that's where the anger comes from. As you do not live in Pakistan, you do not understand the ettiquettes of the rishta process here, and hence your stupid insistence on seeing docuemnts, degrees and paychecks as proof. Start meeting Pakistanis in real life, rather than just trying to make connections in an online forum. In fact, I welcome you to visit Pakistan, so we can teach you a thing or two about how Pakistani/Muslim society works. Watching a few bollywood movies does not make you a desi. The connection to Pakistani culture that you seek so badly can only be obtained by living in Pakstan, not online.

If you never immigrated to the west, then it is likely that your parents did. Ask your parents to help you understand the Pakistani culture, otherwise you will remain an unmarried ABCD your entire life.

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Omer259

You clearly have issues that I cannot provide any therapy for. People like you are angry at themselves for being put into two different cultures( West and Pakistan) that they do not understand. You cannot survive in Pakistan and you are treated as a 2nd class citizen in the US, so that’s where the anger comes from. As you do not live in Pakistan, you do not understand the ettiquettes of the rishta process here, and hence your stupid insistence on seeing docuemnts, degrees and paychecks as proof. Start meeting Pakistanis in real life, rather than just trying to make connections in an online forum. In fact, I welcome you to visit Pakistan, so we can teach you a thing or two about how Pakistani/Muslim society works. Watching a few bollywood movies does not make you a desi. The connection to Pakistani culture that you seek so badly can only be obtained by living in Pakstan, not online.

If you never immigrated to the west, then it is likely that your parents did. Ask your parents to help you understand the Pakistani culture, otherwise you will remain an unmarried ABCD your entire life.

Reading posts like these makes me grateful to my parents for everything they’ve done for me. Im so happy Im not you.

Im actually not angry at all…I found your delusions quite entertaining this morning. Especially this one…you need to wake up and smell the bun kabab. This isnt the 1970s anymore.

Anyway, you do things your way and everyone else does them another way…to each their own!

Good luck! Im sure you will be fine.

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes...

@Omer259 God seriously. Ok imagine if you were the father of a daughter and you had gotten her married to someone who was in your social circle or through a friend. Then allah na karay the guy turns out to be uneducated but belongs to a rich family. Although when you asked people, everyone told you he was educated. This could be because the people you asked were in their plan or had no idea because they thought he was, because he belonged to a rich family. Wouldn't you regret your decision then? Just because people you know tell the rishta is good doesn't mean it is.

I know of an example where the couple are first cousins but the guy turned out to be a jerk and keeps asking the girls family for money. So even if you are close family it doesn't guarantee whatever they tell you is true.

You give a really good example and in some cases that can happen. However, what I am saying is ,I know families who have known each other for decades. They know each and every detail about what theirs and others children are doing. They have grown up together, attended the same schools, attended the same parties, so there is no detail that they do not know about each other. So, definitely there is trust there.

There is nothing wrong with doing background checks if you do not know the family as well as I have described but there is a proper way of doing it, not asking for documentary proof, residency, salary as the confused ABCD Reha describes it. A little ettiquette lesson for Reha on how I would verify a person's education without asking for the degree point blank. I would talk to people who studied in the same college/university, ask other friends/relatives who have gone to that college, not demand proof as Reha is suggesting.

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Reha

Reading posts like these makes me grateful to my parents for everything they’ve done for me. Im so happy Im not you.

Im actually not angry at all…I found your delusions quite entertaining this morning. Especially this one…you need to wake up and smell the bun kabab. This isnt the 1970s anymore.

Anyway, you do things your way and everyone else does them another way…to each their own!

Good luck! Im sure you will be fine.

Good luck to you too. I feel sorry for your parents though. They gave up everything just to immigrate to US only to see their daughter grow up confused. I really hope you can find an ABCD guy in the US to get married to, coz the way it looks you would have a difficult time living with a Pakistani. 1970s??, Who said anything about the 70s, someone missed an Oprah episode yesterday, LOL.

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Omer259

You give a really good example and in some cases that can happen. However, what I am saying is ,I know families who have known each other for decades. They know each and every detail about what theirs and others children are doing. They have grown up together, attended the same schools, attended the same parties, so there is no detail that they do not know about each other. So, definitely there is trust there.

There is nothing wrong with doing background checks if you do not know the family as well as I have described but there is a proper way of doing it, not asking for documentary proof, residency, salary as the confused ABCD Reha describes it. A little ettiquette lesson for Reha on how I would verify a person’s education without asking for the degree point blank. I would talk to people who studied in the same college/university, ask other friends/relatives who have gone to that college, not demand proof like a ***** as Reha is suggesting.

I dont think you understand how things work here…so you’re obviously unable to advise on matters where you have little knowledge. The only reason you dont make me mad is because you have no idea what you’re talking about…I cant hold that against you now can I? We can hope and pray you will know better someday and thats about it.

What you’re describing is not what people do here…its as simple as that. You live in Pakistan and we dont. We do things differently here. You went to school with your mama, chacha and taya’s sons and daughters. We went to school with non-desies. Get over it. Here, you cannot just call the university, get an aunty or uncle on the phone and say “you know shahid uncle’s son? did he go to uni over there? yeah? okay, thank you ji! see you for dinner on saturday!” or “aunty ji poochna tha ke ye jo larkay valay aye thay humaray ghar kal…inke betay kaam apki company mein karte hain na?”. There are privacy laws and HR.

So yes, verification is necessary because I would prefer not to sponsor someone or babysit them.

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes...

Reha,

Don't be ridiculous, no one is saying to call the university. You always know people who can verify things. It is actually even easier in the US, as there are very few desis and if they are in the same college , then it is likely they know each other. I was in PSA while in college and knew almost all Pakistanis there who are part of it or other social groups.

"You live in Pakistan and we dont". There goes your smug attitude again. For your information, I went to school in the US, so I know how things works there. I am just trying to help you learn about Pakistani culture, but your attitude is not doing you any favours. This is precisely the reason that males who were born and grew up in the west avoid desi girls like you and that's why you are still sitting unmarried and angry

I feel sorry for your situation. Hope you get some counseling which is so popular in the US.

[noor321]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Reha

Here, you cannot just call the university, get an aunty or uncle on the phone and say “you know shahid uncle’s son? did he go to uni over there? yeah? okay, thank you ji! see you for dinner on saturday!”

This actually just made me fall off the chair!!!

[Sehrysh]

Re: when rishta comes...

Don't be ridiculous, no one is saying to call the university. *You always know people who can verify things. It is actually even easier in the US, as there are very few desis and if they are in the same college , then it is likely they know each other. *

Umm, no. Because of how small the desi community is in some places - you cannot go to some "other desi" who went to the same school for confirmation about the person's education. Sure we can hire Private Investigators to dig up information - but most people would rather be asked directly than find out someone had them investigated.

"You live in Pakistan and we dont". There goes your smug attitude again. For your information, I went to school in the US, so I know how things works there. I am just trying to help you learn about Pakistani culture, but your attitude is not doing you any favours. This is precisely the reason that males who were born and grew up in the west avoid desi girls like you and that's why you are still sitting unmarried and angry

I feel sorry for your situation. Hope you get some counseling which is so popular in the US.

The point of the thread is - what should be asked (and what questions are in poor taste) and the method of asking and validating the information. Obviously the method of how to validate the information differs depending on the circumstances. No one should take on faith what someone else has said because there are liars both abroad and in Pakistan.

And your last remark to Reha and women in the west - totally uncalled for - it speaks to your mindset and shows you in a bad light, not others.

[sarad]

Re: when rishta comes...

You give a really good example and in some cases that can happen. However, what I am saying is ,I know families who have known each other for decades. They know each and every detail about what theirs and others children are doing. They have grown up together, attended the same schools, attended the same parties, so there is no detail that they do not know about each other. So, definitely there is trust there.

There is nothing wrong with doing background checks if you do not know the family as well as I have described but there is a proper way of doing it, not asking for documentary proof, residency, salary as the confused ABCD Reha describes it. A little ettiquette lesson for Reha on how I would verify a person's education without asking for the degree point blank. I would talk to people who studied in the same college/university, ask other friends/relatives who have gone to that college, not demand proof as Reha is suggesting.

Assuming atleast some of the members on GS are living in West, everyone is giving their perspective on the question asked, just like you gave your perspective on how things will work in Pakistan.
If this is the way things work in West for Pakistanis, let it be. Ofcourse it is not exactly like Pakistan so things will be a little different.
Also the OP only asked if it is appropriate to ask the mentioned questions. She did not claim these must be asked.

I grew up in Pakistan, spent a good part of my life there and later moved to US. We did not have an extended family or a big social circle in Pakistan for some reasons not relevant here. it is not necessary everyone in Pakistan will have one and will definitely find guy/girl among known families. So it was not an option for us to find all the rishtas in family/extended family.

And everyone goes from their experience.
We did go about investigating about this one guy. The rishta did not happen becuase the guy did not like it and said we could have asked him directly and he would have been happy to provide all the information and proof. So there are all kinds of people and everyone thinks differently.

And from your generalization, we would be a low class uneducated family. I find that very rude.

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Omer259

Reha,

Don’t be ridiculous, no one is saying to call the university. You always know people who can verify things. It is actually even easier in the US, as there are very few desis and if they are in the same college , then it is likely they know each other. I was in PSA while in college and knew almost all Pakistanis there who are part of it or other social groups.

“You live in Pakistan and we dont”. There goes your smug attitude again. For your information, I went to school in the US, so I know how things works there. I am just trying to help you learn about Pakistani culture, but your attitude is not doing you any favours. This is precisely the reason that males who were born and grew up in the west avoid desi girls like you and that’s why you are still sitting unmarried and angry

I feel sorry for your situation. Hope you get some counseling which is so popular in the US.

You still dont get it - just because you came here for a year does not mean you have a thorough understanding of the community here. Like when I go to Pakistan, I only stay for a month maximum. Does that mean I know it all? No.

By the way, do you really think ALL the desies in America go to the SAME college/uni? Is there a desi college/uni in the US Im missing?? Do you think they round us desies up like cattle and send us to only desi schools here? So we make sure we only know other brownies?

This is like bhains ke agay been bajana.

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes…

@noor321

This actually just made me fall off the chair!!!

Cant you just picture it happening though?

[Guac]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Sehrysh

And your last remark to Reha and women in the west - totally uncalled for - it speaks to your mindset and shows you in a bad light, not others.

:k:

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Reha

You still dont get it - just because you came here for a year does not mean you have a thorough understanding of the community here. Like when I go to Pakistan, I only stay for a month maximum. Does that mean I know it all? No.

By the way, do you really think ALL the desies in America go to the SAME college/uni? Is there a desi college/uni in the US Im missing?? Do you think they round us desies up like cattle and send us to only desi schools here? So we make sure we only know other brownies?

This is like bhains ke agay been bajana.

I lived in the US for more than 8 years for my education and I definitely know your kind very well. Get in the habit of reading English properly as it is your national language. Where did I say that all desis go to the same schools?. I said “IF” they are in the same college, then it is likely they know each other.

Come on people, is this the moderator you have here at PakLinks, who does not even understand Pakistani culture very well?. By the way, if I am not mistaken, it is afternoon in North America. Don’t you work or study as it seems you spend all your time online???. Really curious

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes...

The point of the thread is - what should be asked (and what questions are in poor taste) and the method of asking and validating the information. Obviously the method of how to validate the information differs depending on the circumstances. No one should take on faith what someone else has said because there are liars both abroad and in Pakistan.

And your last remark to Reha and women in the west - totally uncalled for - it speaks to your mindset and shows you in a bad light, not others.

Sorry if that comment hurt you in any way. It was only directed to the person it was intended for. If you think you are fair, then you would also critisize Reha for abusing my family,my country, but which you didn't mention in your complaint. Your only worry was my comment about women in the west. what about her crazy rants?

[_RestLess]

Re: when rishta comes...

Sometimes, too much direct investigation and scrutiny can turn off people, one (girl or boy) can easily lose a good rishta by being too nitpicky. Just take your clues and go with it.

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes...

I lived in the US for more than 8 years for my education and I definitely know your kind very well. Get in the habit of reading English properly as it is your national language. Where did I say that all desis go to the same schools?. I said "IF" they are in the same college, then it is likely they know each other.

Come on people, is this the moderator you have here at PakLinks, who does not even understand Pakistani culture very well?. By the way, if I am not mistaken, it is afternoon in North America. Don't you work or study as it seems you spend all your time online???. Really curious

Oh God...

[Reha]

Re: when rishta comes...

Sorry if that comment hurt you in any way. It was only directed to the person it was intended for. If you think you are fair, then you would also critisize Reha for abusing my family,my country, but which you didn't mention in your complaint. Your only worry was my comment about women in the west. what about her crazy rants?

I never abused your family or your country. You need to stop getting so emotional and think about the actual question asked.

[Omer259]

Re: when rishta comes...

I never abused your family or your country. You need to stop getting so emotional and think about the actual question asked.

I answered it didn't I?. I was just minding my business and posted my answer for OP, but all of a sudden you came out of nowhere and attacked me as someone from a small town in Pakistan. I wasn't even talking to you but you started out with personal attacks. You need to stop being so angry and understand your real identity. You are neither American nor Pakistani.

[Sehrysh]

Re: when rishta comes…

@Omer259

Sorry if that comment hurt you in any way. It was only directed to the person it was intended for. If you think you are fair, then you would also critisize Reha for abusing my family,my country, but which you didn’t mention in your complaint. Your only worry was my comment about women in the west. what about her crazy rants?

Shall I make the point that you started it by calling people who choose other methods of investigation jaahil or lower-class? But here are your own words just in case you forgot what you wrote:

@Omer259

In my opinion, amongst families that are educated and shareef, this does not happen as they meet other families through their connections and relatives/friends. This could probably be happening in lower class uneducated families where there is not enough trust and greed is definitely a factor.

which you then compounded by saying:

@Omer259

**I am saying that people who are demanding proofs are lower class and jahil. **This is no different than asking for proof that a male owns land or the girl is a virgin, as is done in villages in Pakistan.
If your social circle of friends, relatives and acquaintances are so untrustworthy and “Fraudiya” that you do not trust them and you have to demand proof of degrees and salary information, then by all means go ahead and do the complete background check. However, in most good families I know a brief and discreet background check is done, without having to resort to crude tactics of asking for showing degrees and pay checks.

and then you said…

@Omer259

You think you are better than someone just because you live in the west. Frankly, the problem with people like you is that you have an inferiority complex. Couldn’t really cut it in Pakistan, was always envious of the rich and elite in Pakistan. So somehow you managed to immigrate to the US and now all of a sudden you think you are educated, shareef and the cream of the crop, What a joke!. Just because you live abroad does not make you superior to any Pakistani living in a big or small city. Your smug attitude towards people living in Pakistan is laughable.

The funny thing is that I have lived and studied in the west and seeing the conditions that some people like you live in, trust me there is nothing to be proud and smug about. People think that having a 2 bedroom house, a car and a college degree in the US really makes them superior to people in Pakistan. The fact is that almost everyone in the US has that even a janitor.

Now let me address your social circle issue in the US and explain why there is a such a crisis facing desi girls when it comes to marriage. The fact is that most pakistanis living in the US, live in isolated communities. There aren’t a lot of relatives and friends that they have living in the vicinity, so when it comes to marriage, they really don’t trust people too much, since people from all sorts of backgrounds have come from Pakistan (educated and Jahil, taxi drivers and Doctors), hence the full background body scan. People living in Pakistan on the other hand, have known families and friends for decades.They associate with people of similar backgrounds ( Businessmen around Businessmen, Govt workers, army, civil service around their own). They know and trust the family and do not need to say " Beta, could you show me your latest paycheck?, LOL". **I totally agree with you wanting to do full background checks because it seems everyone around in your circle of friends is a fraud artist. **

You didn’t stop - this is where you get really personal:

@Omer259

**The truth really hurts, doesn’t it??. I did not want to discuss your life situation but you forced me to. **Now, regarding the marriage issue, no one is saying that you cannot do any background checks on potential mates, but there is a proper and decent way of doing it, as it is done in educated families all over Pakistan and that is discreetly and through your own sources. Not greedily and crudely as you suggested by asking for citizenship proof, salary and degrees. This is not a visa office you are dealing with for god’s sake. You immigrated to west, but still didn’t learn the proper etiquette of dealing with people?. No wonder, you still have the inferiority complex that you thought immigrating to the USA would solve.

But of course, you didn’t stop there :hinna:

@Omer259

Reha,

**You clearly have issues that I cannot provide any therapy for. People like you are angry at themselves for being put into two different cultures( West and Pakistan) that they do not understand. You cannot survive in Pakistan and you are treated as a 2nd class citizen in the US, so that’s where the anger comes from. **As you do not live in Pakistan, you do not understand the ettiquettes of the rishta process here, and hence your stupid insistence on seeing docuemnts, degrees and paychecks as proof. Start meeting Pakistanis in real life, rather than just trying to make connections in an online forum. In fact, I welcome you to visit Pakistan, so we can teach you a thing or two about how Pakistani/Muslim society works. Watching a few bollywood movies does not make you a desi. The connection to Pakistani culture that you seek so badly can only be obtained by living in Pakstan, not online.

If you never immigrated to the west, then it is likely that your parents did. Ask your parents to help you understand the Pakistani culture, otherwise you will remain an unmarried ABCD your entire life.

And then your grand finale:

@Omer259

Reha,
…
I feel sorry for your situation. Hope you get some counseling which is so popular in the US.

Omer, it’s enjoyable to have a pleasant discussion with people who have other perspectives - there doesn’t need to be a single right answer. But the point is to engage in a respectful debate. You fell into the classic trap of making generalizations and getting personal and insulting others - that’s why I pointed out your posts.