No, but do you deny that it was the need of the hour to consolidate power?
Now you are saying NO - earlier you concluded Theorist 's post as the best answer of my question :)
were you at mistake earlier or are you at mistake now :)
if they were the need of the hour to consolidate power - Bhoy I tell you - we need that consolidation hour again as we Muslims as an Ummah going through a very hard time thesedays ...
Thus - it brings us back to a point where we can say - we should implement ' the once successfully implemented system ' again :)
Secularism will give you an Islamic Justice System. May sound contradictory, but look at Europe and the US. A common man has MUCH GREATER chance of getting justice in the US than he does in Pakistan.
The reason for the fairer system being prevalent in the US is because they have the infrastructure in place to achieve some sort of justice. It is not due to secularism so much as it is to do with the fact that they have power and calibrated their machine ... I would question whether US is even full secular.
Now you are saying NO - earlier you concluded Theorist 's post as the best answer of my question :)
were you at mistake earlier or are you at mistake now :)
Theorist said:
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No, they were more concerned about the spread of Islam and to make sure it stayed that way they made amendments to the existing law to show off they are the boss now.
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This is consolidating power. Doesn't mean they were megalomaniacs.
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if they were the need of the hour to consolidate power - Bhoy I tell you - we need that consolidation hour again as we Muslims as an Ummah going through a very hard time thesedays ...
Thus - it brings us back to a point where we can say - we should implement ' the once successfully implemented system ' again :)
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You will consolidate power the same way they did in the 7th century? Where is my camel??
The reason for the fairer system being prevalent in the US is because they have the infrastructure in place to achieve some sort of justice. *It is not due to secularism *
If his brain still works, a thug like that will hire a hitman to do his job. Cutting his hands won't prove to be a good deterrent. As a matter of fact, people will learn to be better criminals. Unless there's a way to make them braindead, I don't think it's going to work. Perhaps a more psychological solution can be considered.
I can't think of anything more psychological than the threat of my hand being cut off ...
Barbaric from whose POV? You always look at the punishment from consensual sex perspective, but what if the guy was a serial rapist or even worst, child rapist?
This is consolidating power. Doesn't mean they were megalomaniacs.
No one from PBUH's companions and Khulfa-e-rasheen made any amendments in the laws prescribed by Quran and Prophet PBUH .. so you cant hold them accountable for something which they havent done ...
You will consolidate power the same way they did in the 7th century? Where is my camel??
well camel still exists and very much help at locations where technology often fails :)
Barbaric from whose POV? You always look at the punishment from consensual sex perspective, but what if the guy was a serial rapist or even worst, child rapist?
Let me remind you that stoning is the punishment for adultery between two consenting adults. Rape comes under the rape law.
I repeat my question, do they harm you or your family? If there are people willing to go to these clubs, what's your problem?
That my dear is for you to ask Allah mian, He made the haram halal rules. My problem is that I sorta give a damn about what He has asked us not to do.
Now my views aren't stopping anyone from boozing the night away, so what's *your *problem? But yes if I was asked to vote on whether IceSoul should be allowed to open a pub in Makkah, I'd vote no. Why? Mere Khuda ki marzi, kar lo jo karna hai.
No one from PBUH's companions and Khulfa-e-rasheen made any amendments in the laws prescribed by Quran and Prophet PBUH .. so you cant hold them accountable for something which they havent done ...
It was just now proved that stoning is not an Islamic law per se.
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well camel still exists and very much help at locations where technology often fails :)
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You have dodged the question, my friend :) I repeat, will you consolidate power the same way they did in the 7th century?
That my dear is for you to ask Allah mian, He made the haram halal rules. My problem is** that I sorta give a damn about what He has asked us not to do. **
Yeah TLK ... I was gonna point out ... barbaric a punishment may be so but surely that strikes fear in to the heart of the would be criminal. It also serves to purge the person of their sin and they leave the world sinless ... People often who did crimes after hearing that worldly penalties remove their sins actually CHOSE the maximum punishments in order to receive forgiveness and that is what is documented today.
The problem is people tend to focus on this life being the means all end all ... but we see the Hereafter as the real abode. To an atheist the only thing I can say is if you don't believe in the Hereafter then don't give yourself up after sinning ... if you want to sin in an Islamic state then do so discretely just don't get caught, and if you do ... deny it and if there is no evidence against you then you can't get punished ... It is so easy. Or just don't commit adultery in the first place ... of course that is another option ...
Yeah TLK ... I was gonna point out ... barbaric a punishment may be so but surely that strikes fear in to the heart of the would be criminal. It also serves to purge the person of their sin and they leave the world sinless ... People often who did crimes after hearing that worldly penalties remove their sins actually CHOSE the maximum punishments in order to receive forgiveness and that is what is documented today.
Water boarding struck fear into hearts alright, but was condemned around the world. Islam teaches us humanity. How then can it condone such barbarity?
Did I say that? I was just wondering why people sitting in Dar-Ul-Harb are so worried about hypothetical pubs in Makkah...
Why not? When debating secularism, why not debate all aspects of it? If secularism was to be implemented in Saudi, sure it would get rid of plenty of retarded rules of theirs that I don't agree with but it would also mean legalising haram things which I'm not about to vote yes to. There needs to be a balance and looking at the secular nations, I just don't see that balance. What's perfectly legal, acceptable, moral and the norm in these societies isn't something I'd like to see being practised in an Islamic society.
Why not? When debating secularism, why not debate all aspects of it? If secularism was to be implemented in Saudi, sure it would get rid of plenty of retarded rules of theirs that I don't agree with but it would also mean legalising haram things which I'm not about to vote yes to. There needs to be a balance and looking at the secular nations, I just don't see that balance. What's perfectly legal, acceptable, moral and the norm in these societies isn't something I'd like to see being practised in an Islamic society.
If you are so not okay with Haram things being legal, why do you live in Ireland?
And you can't have it both ways. Tose rules (most of them) are part of Islam. You wither take it or leave it, no middle way.