so as a question .. shia do not slander hazrat Umar RA and Hazrat Ameer Muaawiya RA keeping in mind he was Kaatib e wahi ..and do shia not consider Hazrat Umar a True sahabi...and why do the shia not also show the true status of Hazrat Hassan RA brother of Imam hussain ..the way shia show status of Imam Hussain .. Is it becos Hazrat Hassan made a pact between Hazrat Ali and Ameer Muaawiya ...know that the hadith of the Prophet SAW that which ever star *sahabi you follw will be on my path .. ???
So many objections shia raise and make .. and what on earth is this .. that Hazrat Jibraeel mistakenly went to Our Prophet SAW at time of wahi ..whereas shud av been Hazrat Ali RA .. this is objection against Allah Almighty .. that he sent Jibraeel AS to wrong person .. yet Allah told that Angels do not make mistakes ..
Shia in my point of view and in my belief infact are most controversial group out the lot..
^^ these are just some most talked about / discussed issues against the shia amongst many ..and if someone dosnt consider these objections as hate/slander towards sahaba then ...I suggest that that person study from scholars.
and more of your khayali pilao...........and jahalat laden fatwas..........whts ur fatwa for the Nasibis?
and Jibrael must have been having a really bad day so he cudn't spot a difference between a 40 year old man and his 13 year old cousin.....nauzobillah.............this fantasy tht u r ascribing to the shias is better to suited to children's cartoons.........or may b not even that.........
Not limited to that, majority of Shia believies that Quran ( the copy we have) is fabricated (Noori Tebrassi comes to mind, he is burried next to Hazrat Ali (RZA)), some believes that goat ate the quran and some ( who consider them modest) says a 6 year old boy ranaway with Quran and yet there are some who says while compilation of Quran, Ali (RZA) told muslims that the one they had is good enough for them and he kept the original copy of Quran!!!
Now all these are either contradictory to the word of Allah all Mighty or it in a way insult Sahaba (RZA) and Ali (RZA) aswell... most often Shia claims things which in reality insult the very Imams shias.
As far as the difference is concerned, there were two groups who parted their ways from mainstream Islam, one is Kharjies and others are Shias...
ur memory is not serving u correctly here because it is Aisha who has said that part of Quran were chewed by the goat and were lost...........to get a taste let me get u 1 tradition from 1of ur sahi book.......
Sunan Ibn Majah, Book of Nikah, Hadith # 1934
*Narrated Aisha 'The verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times were revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my bed. When the Messenger of Allah (SAWW.) expired and we were preoccupied with his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper." *
and if u want more then i shall be happy to provide u Umar b Khattab's view on this too.........just let me know......
and the mullah who told u the name of Noori Tabrassi was a liar...........doesnt seem like u r interested in knowing the truth or real facts but i will telll u anyway...........Noori Tabrassi is NOT buried next to Imam Ali (as)..........next to Imam Ali (as) are the great Prophets of God, Hazrat Adam and Nuh (as).
Re: What is the basic difference between shia's and sunnis?
[mod]ok guys we have started personalizing. If you can not stay within the limits of decency and have a constructive dialogue, I will have to close this thread. [/mod]
Re: What is the basic difference between shia's and sunnis?
^well......wht r u suppose to do in face of lies, false claims and fantasy being presented as reality.............u can stay away like couple of shia members did in this thread.........or u cud give them a bit of taste of their own medicine........i will choose the later any day.......if they show a bit of respect and ask questions if they dont know then we can talk with mutual respect and hopefully learn something from e/o.........but thats a unfortunately is quite rare........
i dnt have much to add here, but got a question or two to ask
the people who wanted Ali were never satisfied, so they broke off from the rest of the Muslims and started their own sect (Shiia means follower of Ali).
although there where those who wanted Hz. Ali(ra) to be the first khalifa and didnt accept the first 3, there were no shias during the lifetime of Hz. Ali(ra), the shi'ite sect itself started during the life time of the shi'ite 6th Imam; Jafar asSadiq(ra)
There are many minor differences between the two, but the biggest is that shias have something they invented called the 12 infallible imams, who were all descendants of Ali..
the imamat concept is the same for all shias but there are different types of shias, twelvers, seveners etc...
Shias have 10 pillars while Sunnis have 5..
shias have 5pillars of islam called usul-e-deen
Red ones r not true.
Blue .... can u name 10 and 5 pillars ?
in yr quote, u'd highlighted some points in red and said they are not true, one of them was tht sunnis must pray 5 times a day....so how is this not true?
5 pillars of islam; sunni- shahadah, salah, zakaah, sawm and hajj
5 pillars of islam; shia- tawhid, adalah(adl), nabuwwat, imamat, qiyamat
it would be a shame if we cannot discuss these matters. obviously there is what appears to be sharp edges in comments but behined that there is a fundamental question which needs to be answered.
for example
i mentioned ummulmomineen earlier, if there is anyone who disagrees with the Quranpak and continues to put allegations on her of adultery (naudhubillah) then surely by its entry in the quranpak we can all unite to condemn them, yeah?
[QUOTE]
it is Aisha who has said that part of Quran were chewed by the goat and were lost...........to get a taste let me get u 1 tradition from 1of ur sahi book.......
Sunan Ibn Majah, Book of Nikah, Hadith # 1934
*Narrated Aisha 'The verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times were revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my bed. When the Messenger of Allah (SAWW.) expired and we were preoccupied with his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper." *
[/quote]
translation Al-Baqara 106 Nothing of our revelation (even a single verse) do we abrogate or cause be forgotten, but we bring (in place) one better or the like thereof. Knowest thou not that Allah is Able to do all things?
i think this verse conveys the belief of all sunnis, but the allegation is that some, many or all shias say things about the Quran which is at odds with this this and other verses. what is the belief of the shias who think the Quran is incomplete, or has other faults? what proportion of the shia populas do these people represent?
it would be a shame if we cannot discuss these matters. obviously there is what appears to be sharp edges in comments but behined that there is a fundamental question which needs to be answered.
sure........i am all for discussing things & asking questions....but v much against putting false labels and accusations on others diffrnt from my faith.......... particularly when i have no or little proof to show for it.......
[quote]
for example
i mentioned ummulmomineen earlier, if there is anyone who disagrees with the Quranpak and continues to put allegations on her of adultery (naudhubillah) then surely by its entry in the quranpak we can all unite to condemn them, yeah?
[/quote]
may God curse be on those who put wrong allegations on others.........let alone a wife of the holy Prophet, mothers of the believers, which will be a great sin.........it was Abdullah ibn Ubay, chief of the hypocrites who spread this rumor about Aisha........and the idea was to defame the Prophet........and the hypocrites failed once again.
[quote]
translation Al-Baqara 106 Nothing of our revelation (even a single verse) do we abrogate or cause be forgotten, but we bring (in place) one better or the like thereof. Knowest thou not that Allah is Able to do all things?
i think this verse conveys the belief of all sunnis, but the allegation is that some, many or all shias say things about the Quran which is at odds with this this and other verses. what is the belief of the shias who think the Quran is incomplete, or has other faults? what proportion of the shia populas do these people represent?
[/quote]
[15:9] Surely We have revealed the Reminder and We will most surely be its guardian.
[41:42] Falsehood shall not come to it from before it nor from behind it; a revelation from the Wise, the Praised One.
be not surprised to know today that Shia believe the same about Quran.............it is Almight's promise to keep his final book away from discrepancies......we believe it to be pure from error.........infact our position is that the system of guidance is free from error.........and all of Allah's representatives were far from mis-guidance........and they were all error-free...........this includes the Prophet and the chosen members of his family.........
err no i guess u’ve got it wrong…
the poster wrote tht the part ‘highlighted in red is nt true’…and one of the points highlighted was tht ‘sunnis pray 5times a day’…which means tht according to him sunnis do not pray 5 times a day…
or have i missed something?
nothing’s worst than watching the ummat of the Holy Prophet(saw) divided:hinna:
ur memory is not serving u correctly here because it is Aisha who has said that part of Quran were chewed by the goat and were lost...........to get a taste let me get u 1 tradition from 1of ur sahi book.......
Sunan Ibn Majah, Book of Nikah, Hadith # 1934
*Narrated Aisha 'The verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times were revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my bed. When the Messenger of Allah (SAWW.) expired and we were preoccupied with his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper." *
and if u want more then i shall be happy to provide u Umar b Khattab's view on this too.........just let me know......
and the mullah who told u the name of Noori Tabrassi was a liar...........doesnt seem like u r interested in knowing the truth or real facts but i will telll u anyway...........Noori Tabrassi is NOT buried next to Imam Ali (as)..........next to Imam Ali (as) are the great Prophets of God, Hazrat Adam and Nuh (as).
Oh dear!!!
Supporting your point from a hadees which has content contrary to ground realities... Please check what are the last verses revealed to the Prophet (SAAW)and what was the period between the last WAHI and the death of Prophet (SAAW) and then talk about the ayaat eaten by Goat... and for others please check the source and men involved in telling this hadees all doubts shall be clear... and my dear friend can you tell me what importance does Noori Tebrassi carries in Shias... Seems like Noori Tebrassi still hurts..
The problem with shias is that they do not look onto the facts, yet they want everyone to believe that they follow Quran, whereas 90% of their faith is Takiya ( not pillow) and some of the Shia groups are found saying that even Hazrat Ali (RZA) use to practice Takiya
100% agree and the other shia group as knwn according to my knowledge is the raafdhiz - raafzi.. and raafzi are teh worst kind if i may say ..as they have teh most absurd views esp in regards to the high status of Abu Bakr RA..and try to defame Hazrat e Abu Bakr RA
I don't think any Shia group like Hazrat Abu Bakr (RZA) or Hazrat Umer (RZA) infact there is a place in Iran where Lulu Feroz is burried, Shias have built a tomb on his grave and have annual URS to remember the great LULU FEROZ...
As a matter of fact Shia don't like any of the Sahaba, their hatred against Sahaba is so high that they even ditch their very own Imam if he refuse to do TABRA on Sahabas... not only this but they only like to follow the Imam who speaks as per their wishes, hence if Imam Musa Kazim tries to do something which they don't like, they will kill him...
and i cud give you dozens of hadiths graded sahi by your scholar on this topic but i am not interested in the topic let alone go in details of the matn or rijaal of these hadiths as with a person like u it will lead to absolutely nowhere…but let me know if u wish to see these hadiths
Noori Tabrassi’s status is no different than other man of knowledge…he held a certain POV which the majority does not agree with…it is not only him but many classical sunni scholars have held similar POV as him…
and the ‘taqqaiya’ part is so ridiculous that its not worth addressing…
I don't think any Shia group like Hazrat Abu Bakr (RZA) or Hazrat Umer (RZA) infact there is a place in Iran where Lulu Feroz is burried, Shias have built a tomb on his grave and have annual URS to remember the great LULU FEROZ...
As a matter of fact Shia don't like any of the Sahaba, their hatred against Sahaba is so high that they even ditch their very own Imam if he refuse to do TABRA on Sahabas... not only this but they only like to follow the Imam who speaks as per their wishes, hence if Imam Musa Kazim tries to do something which they don't like, they will kill him...
and the elephants cud fly too, right? ..............
i doubt u even know who Imam Musa Kazim (as) is?
this post is a certificate of ur jahalat..........
“Noori Tebrassi” is man of Knowledge… a man who believes Quran is fabricated can only be given this status in Shaism… i guess i don’t have to say more on it…
and the elephants cud fly too, right? ..............
i doubt u even know who Imam Musa Kazim (as) is?
this post is a certificate of ur jahalat..........
Yes... and that is why you have started calling names... carry on.. we can see why you got so angry...
"Noori Tebrassi" is man of Knowledge... a man who believes Quran is fabricated can only be given this status in Shaism... i guess i don't have to say more on it....
what is opnion of Jalauddin suyuti, Mohammad Ismail Bukhari, Ibn Kathir, Fakhuddin razi etc?...........whats their status in sunnism?..............and it is better that u say no more because the more u say the more mess u will create for urself...........
Yes... and that is why you have started calling names... carry on.. we can see why you got so angry...
i do not know u and have no problem with u watsoever..............but if u r going to try to present fantasies as facts then its everybody's duty to try to condemn it..........
what is opnion of Jalauddin suyuti, Mohammad Ismail Bukhari, Ibn Kathir, Fakhuddin razi etc?...........whats their status in sunnism?..............and it is better that u say no more because the more u say the more mess u will create for urself...........
oh my god u got me this time, what would i do, how can i avoid answering this where should i hide....
Suytti is historian, nothing more, even he himself says in his books that he has collected all the information without verifying the source, Mohammad Ismail Bukhari says the same in his preface of Sahi Bukhari infact Imam Bukhari goes a step further and says that it is duty of Muslim to verify the thing mentioned in this book...
Now coming back to NOORI TEBRASI your MAN OF KNOWLEDGE who somehow gathered so much knowledge that he claims that Quran is fabricated...
i do not know u and have no problem with u watsoever..............but if u r going to try to present fantasies as facts then its everybody's duty to try to condemn it..........
you mean i should believe on your fantasies which are part of your faith... and i am not condemning them, every individual group have a right to believe whatever they want to believe... Sahabas and other Heros of Islam are not only disliked by Shias, they are well hated by non-muslims as well... so i really don''t care what your believe is but i don't like when you pose fantasies like 6 year old ran away with original Quran or he is still in hiding in some place and ( in this era of sms and email) sending messages through chits... and now don't tell me Shia won't believe this...
