What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Really, i guess this is not the case, if yes, then please highlight those questions, i may have missed them and i can always try to answer them.

I think we are not discussing Dr. Israar Ahmed and you may have to back your claim with some evidence, like i said earlier, he may have been quoted out of context or he may have this believe. I am no way going to defend some one's believe neither i am answerable on some bodys comment.

I would like you to take the comments/questions/querries/discusion with open and neutral mind, once you do that, frankly speaking you will see that i have not asked any question, i only had three questions, which were clearly mentioned, and were clearly ignored by you. now i have reposted the questions again and highlighted them in post # 599 of this thread.

again, there is no point me saying same thing over and over. My father was a non-ahmadi muslim and i very well know the beliefs sunni people hold. I also tell you the same to not follow anything blindly either.

Christains believed in Jesus (AS) thus, were no longer acceptable by Jews, , Muslims Believed in Prophet Mohammad (SAAW), thus, were no longer acceptable by Christains and Jews. all the time it was matter of one Prophet only. Nor muslims call themselves Christain or Jews, neither a jew or christain call them selve muslim. Yet We all believe in Moses (AS), in Jesus (AS)...

Other Muslims, will not call me anything but muslm, as having faith in Imam Mehdi is nor proven from Quran neither from Hadees, in fact both says, that it is a duty of Muslim to follow anyone, who calls you towards the Quran and Sunnah. May it be Salahuddin Ayoubi, Mehmood Ghaznavi or Sultan Bebris...

The problem from ur side is, u believe each and every word which goes into ur favour and dislike very thing which opposes you or does not suits your belief/desires. The Above hadees was not refuted by me, but by the scholars of Science of Hadees and Science of Men ( Ilm-e-Hadees & Ilm-ur-Rijal) and that is 100s of yer before Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani made his cliam. Now, my job was to bring the authenticity of the hadees in front of you, these scholars had nothing against Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani, nor does they knew that there will be someone claiming to be a Prophet... they did their analysis and declared the hadees as Fabricated/Daéef.. now u r free to build ur religion on this fabricated/Daeé'f hadees.

but u believing them and to me the only reason u r believing them, is , it makes ur case stronger, despite the fact that these books/testament are declared null and void, u and others are referring to them to make ur point.
Another thing u are banking on, that there MAY have some verses saved, but how would u know!!! Allah All mighty have nullified the books as a whole, and when any cotract or book is declared void, then there is nothing valid or good, the whole thing is gone... but again being an Ahmadi/Qadyani you are free to refer to these books which have been nullified by Allah All mighty and develop a belief for yourself. It will not be a muslim belief though.

Yes being a Muslim, we need to believe in the fact that Zaboor, Toraít and Anjeel were the books of Allah, and same Allah all mighty, tells us that these books have been fabricated, Although, Christains and Jews do not believe that these books have been fabricated. Ahmadies/Qadyanies can join them in believing so.

I have summarized the questions for u in post # 599, as it is seems that you ( for some reason) are not able to pick the questions.

Why my school of thought matter? i have said that earlier in this very thread that i believe in Quran and Sunnah thats all, and i do not believe anything against the teaching of these books nor does i follow anyone blindly, as Taqleed will not be an excuse on the DAY, you may can refer to Sura-e-wawaya in Quran.

Now once u answer me, i'll explain in detail for the rest.

I don't think so u r right there? Prophet Mohammad (SAAW) went for wars against the Christains and Mushrikeen of Arab and Ajm, the wars ended up killings of many. Allah All mighty have sent Azaab to many nations, the example of Aad and Samood is there in Quran. In the end, when a person insist to no to follow the divine guidance, he is subject to be killed. The Same will happen to those Jews, who will openly stand in front of Muslim Army, with the intentions to kill, so the Quran says, Kill those who kills you and carry on against them untill the Fitna is concluded.. So the same shall be served, unless and otherwise, u have some sympathies with Jews ( i guess Qadyanies and Beha'ies are the one who have mosque in Israel).

Actually there are example, Hasan Bin Sabah, Qaramaties, Beha'ies, Ismailies and many more are there.. you need to do some research.

This Riaz Gohar Shahi, have some audiences in Pakistan, i think they are called Anjuman-e-Sarfaroshan-e-Islam (ASI)... so they are there and are growing in number...

Hindus, Sikhs, Zoroastrians they are there and i beilieve in some big number, does that mean they are no right path/religion.. if number define the truth of religion then Christianity is the biggest religion in the world.. ever thought of that!!!

Hind maiN mulla ko ju hay sajday key ijazat
nadaaN yeh samjhta hay kay Islam hay Azaad

What Exactly he did, that was my question???

Which BTW you cannot answer!!!

I'll see ur comments on above and summarize this part of the discussion!!!

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

Off topic posts removed

Plz do not discuss here someone style of posting ro arguing.

Some of the posts may be returned depending upon other mods review.

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

ok hanibal, since its re-opened again... give me some time to reply you.

meanwhile..how about u read my reply to you again.. and answer some of the questions i raised?.. such as what would u be called if u accept imam mehdi but fail to recognize Esa AS? .. you're good at quoting me but fail to answer me. Answer the following questions.. in point form.. and we can then move on.

Would you differentiate yourself from Islam if Esa AS is preaching Islam?

You talk about people before Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS that they claimed to be imam mahdi?.. I asked you earlier why did u not believe them? You cannot ask this question to me since i've already did my bait on the messiah my heart said is the right one. What about you?.. What made you not to believe them?

You also said that the coming of Imam Mahdi is NOT mentioned in Hadith? it is.. read the hadith my friend.. it is mentioned that huzur SAW said that when u see imam Mahdi convey my salam to Him. Many other hadiths refers a reformer of Islam to come.

Another question i raised was that according to you.. all jews and christians will convert to islam upon Imam Mahdi and Esa AS's arrival. I asked, what if some of them dont?.. will you point a finger at Esa AS's or imam mahdi's truthfulness?

Will Esa AS be nabi if he AS comes back?

PS: oh and by the way.. ur school of thought is important for the discussion to move forward. Without knowing it, you have better chance of attacking my beliefs and i'll just be here defending it. I want to be able to know your beliefs too. Dont just say u follow Quran and sunnah. All the rest of Muslims say exactly that. Shia, wahabi, deobandis..they all say they follow quran and hadith. What belief differentiate you from other fellow muslims? So your school of thought is important here. Thank you.

Please Welcome fariha ali as Poetry Moderator
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Take ur time

I have already answer that, read my reply

Lets decide if Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani was Jesus (AS) or not, then we can go to this point, please do not try to jump to the end part of our discussion, i am sure these and many other queries will be raised and answered from both side

Wrong again, Actually i was talking about Riaz Gohar Shahi who declared him self Mehdi in 80s or 90s i guess... and was asking you that how u gonna refute them, to which i got no answer, and then I again gave example of Gohar Shahi, saying that even he got a jamat, so if having a jamat and number of followers have nothing to do with the truth or religion.

There are two or three ahadees about imam mehdi, none of them is fom Saheen, means, both Imam Bukhari and Imam Muslim rejected all the ahadees about the Coming of Mehdi... are u suggesting that i should base my belief on fake/da'eef ahadees... I am sorry i cannot do that... I have to answer to Allah on the day of judement...

If i ever said JEWS, then please forgive for this mistake, although i believe i never said it, yes Christains will convert... Well who ever do not, will stand with jews, after the Miraculous return of Jesus (AS) no body, but the jews will point the finger to the Esa (AS) truthfullness. ( i am not talking about Mehdi)

He will be pious and well respected Ummati of Prophet Mohammad (SAAW). Nor will he dismiss Jehad-bi-Saif, niether he will pass any verdict which can cancel or issue a new doctrine, but yes like the Sahaba of Prophet Mohammad (SAAW), people will go to him, asking explaining on certain issues and matter of that time, remember, He (AS) will be the most noble amoung the group of Muslims of that time.

My life is not that complex that i have to follow certain school of thought, i lead a simple life, which knows what is sin and what is not, so i simply try not to go near sins, and if i do, i go to my Lord and as for forgiveness on the weakness.

Now i don't know what is the case here, why it is important, assume you are talking to an atheist who have somewhat little knowledge of Islam and ur religion, what will you say to him, first get ur self a school of thought and then we will discuss... I think what you and me is discussing is, if Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani was Jesus (AS) or not...

but i guess you are going to make this thing an issue and may choose to quit the discussion, All Shias, Sunnis, Wahabis and others i had discussion with, normally quit at this point...

I am waiting for the answers...

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Lets not decide if he was or not. Lets just answer if you will differentiate yourself from Islam if Esa AS comes and preach Islam?

The whole point is that doesnt matter how ever many people have claimed to be imam mahdi... when the real one comes.. all the false one vanishes. Having a jamaat which is strictly in accordance to Quran, sunnah and hadith is what counts the most. Having the success of the jamaat is what matters. A person being a successor of Imam Mahdi is what the ummah is in need of the most.

so all this time.. im having a debate with a person who has no belief in Imam Mahdi? Your lack of knowledge regarding Imam Mahdi by no means deny his existence. I'm sorry to say this but i have no idea what your belief is then. On one hand u say Esa AS is going to come.. and then according to your belief, it will be the time of the advent of Imam Mahdi and then u are refusing his advent?

you see this is the reason why i need to know ur school of thought. Aramis09's comments on this issue does not suit you.. anyway.. so christians will convert by Jesus AS's arrival as the Muhammad pbuh's Ummati? What about all the christians since 2000 years who died in denial of the final religion of Allah?...

What is this dude... Jesus AS's will be nabi but it wont effect khatam e naboowat? either there is no prophet after Prophet Muhammad PBUH , or that ure interpretation of the word khatam is incorrect. You seem to be twisting your own belief.

Great. respected ummati nabi. We both are on same track. Now, think about it.. how will he know about his naboowat without Allah himself telling him? he will not add nor subtract anything from Islam. He AS will surely revive the true teachings of Islam by the help of Allah almighty. we both agree to this.

[quote]
My life is not that complex that i have to follow certain school of thought, i lead a simple life, which knows what is sin and what is not, so i simply try not to go near sins, and if i do, i go to my Lord and as for forgiveness on the weakness.
[/quote]
Ok doke. Theres definitely some sort of school of thought u are from which is makin you belief Esa AS will come back from heavens bodily and that believing of Imam Mahdi is not important, since according to you these hadith are da'eef. Would you help me if i quote ur ullama in regards to khatam e naboowat and declare them non-muslims? Theres no way im going to argue with you anymore if you do not tell me of ur school of thought. When you are given full permission to attack my beliefs, i should be able to atleast back it up based on your own beliefs, because unfortunately quoting dr israr or zakir naik or any other ullama for that matter would not matter to you.

why do i consider you atheist?.. instead consider me one and convince me that Jesus AS is still up in heavens bodily alive. The moment you prove that to me , i'll leave ahmadiyyat. good deal? Who said we are discussing if Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS was Jesus AS? we are not discussing that. Instead, the discussion is the death of Jesus AS. the issue cant be if mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS was Jesus AS , since you dont believe in him at all.. why dont you convince me that Jesus is still alive..becuz once you do that, you automatically prove Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS false.

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

[QUOTE]
Hind maiN mulla ko ju hay sajday key ijazat
nadaaN yeh samjhta hay kay Islam hay Azaad
[/QUOTE]

you said muslims were slaves. I said muslims were given full rights to practice their religion. What else do you consider 'azaadi' if not the azaadi of practicing your religion? Please do tell me how Muslims were 'slaves' at the time of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS? your this shair goes against you since this shair admits that mullah has the freedom of practicing his religion.. and then it says that it should not be taken as if Islam is azaad?... what else do you need my friend? ab har jagaah to Musalmaan hakoomat karne se raha. Full right of practicing ones religion is not enough?

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

Dude, U asked for time to answer the questions i raised, so lets get that sorted out first, as i need your comments and answers on those..

I have no idea why are u not answering the questions, the issue at hand is IF Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani who claims to be the Jesus and Mehdi, then how one can prove it??? thats the point which need to be made clear.. not that what i believe in or what any other member believes in or what a christain is believing or what jew thinks about the Jesus (AS),

I am developing a perception here that, you are more eager to talk on other issues then proving that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani is Esa (AS) or Mehdi ( or both)

I have clearly said about my belief, but like u said, u want to attack my believes, so thats y u want to know about them, if you are following the RIGHT religion and RIGHT prophet, then y do you care about, Prove the thing i am asking for, Answer my question, i have not attacked your belief, yet. I am just asking for a explaination, in light of Quran and hadees, is it diffficult to Prove Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadayani, the prophet, the Essa (AS) the Mehdi from Quran and Hadees.

Regarding my belief about the Mehdi, i have said to you, believing on him will not change by religion. I didn't see any obejction back then, but suddenly you have a change in attitude i wonder Y...

I can totaly understand y you want to ignore the points/questions i have raised, I totally understand yoru intention to move the discussion on Essa (AS). I totally agree that we should discuss that as well, but i must say that we need to do that in logical way. Step by Step, so that If i am wrong, that would be proved.. and so on...

Now i must say that, u take your time and answer my concerns...

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It is nonsensical to believe that imam mahdi and Messiah AS will be two different personalities. If both will have the same mission , that is to revive the true teachings of Islam. Since ahmadiyya belief is that Jesus AS is no more alive, hence the hadiths talking about Jesus AS is referring to Messiah of Islam.

Quran is more credible. The whole point of me putting forward the case of Elijah AS is that Allah does not raise up prophets prior to the current ones. Whoever dies doesnt come back to this world again. The title of Messiah is to be given to someone which will be amongst Prophet Muhammad PBUH’s ummah.

Again, Jesus AS is dead according to my belief. What signs from hadith are you talking about? the mircaculous birth of Jesus AS is just for him. Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS got the title of being the Messiah. It by no means mean that He AS is Jesus AS himself as in literal sense. He is the Messiah for Muslims.

Should i wait for your answers now?

ps: i purposely did not write much. Theres no reason why I should be here defending my beliefs when u fail to tell me your school of thought. No, i do not need to know it to ‘attack’ your beliefs.. but rather to defend my own with your beliefs.

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The prophethood will continue, but the condition is if it is amongst the Muslim ummah. No other prophet will come that will cancel Muhammad pbuh's shariyah. Prophet PBUH himself called Jesus AS to come as Nabi. Quran also refers to Jesus AS as nabiAllah. Why did Christians fail to recognize Prophet Muhammad pbuh when it is written in the scriptures that there will be a person with the name of Ahmad? The discussion here should not be if Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS is Imam Mahdi or not.. but rather prove the point if Jesus AS is up in heavens alive. As i said earlier... once u prove that, you automatically prove Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS to be false.

I have no problem talkin about if Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS is imam mahdi. Theres no point of doing that. Not atleast with you.. who says that believing him is not that important. Me explaining you if Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS to be imam mahdi will mean nothing to you unless you get ur beliefs clear about the coming of Jesus AS. Once we sort Jesus AS's issue, we can then move on to Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS's claims.

ps: will it be ok if i quote some of ur ullemas about the finality of Prophethood? because everything we'll talk about Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS deals a lot with the death of Jesus AS and the finality of prophethood.. unless and until we figure those out...no point proving me if He AS is the imam mahdi. How can i prove him right when ur own belief is that Jesus AS is to come bodily from heavens?

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I guess you lack some information on the role of Imam Mehdi , thats y u r saying this, anyway, I was accepting some logical reply, the so-called hadees saying Both are one is fabricated and you are welcome to base ur religion on it, although it doesn't make any sense but who says that the it should make sense.

If Quran credible source, then y are u insisting on some story which is mentioned in a fabricate book??? this make me think that most of ur beliefs are on false assumption, first the the fabricated hadees and this one on the fabricated book, (why somebody would like to have his basic religious belief on fabricated books/sayings...???)

please refer to my post, i have mentioned the signs there!!! if still you can not get it, then i have right to believe that u r purposele ignoring an open question which have directly challenged the position of Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyan.. by repeating a lie again again shall not make it a truth, Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani may be a Prophet for Qadaynies but not to muslims and you have utterly failed to prove that.

What answers, discussion is over, my friend, u have not been able to prove anything which support ur claim that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani was Jesus (AS), u were ignoring those questions since i posted them.. anyway

Summary of ur basic/fundametel believes is as follows:

Qadyanies/Ahmadies believes that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani was the Mehdi and Jesus (AS) at same time, their logic for this belief is a hadees which says that Mehdi and Jesus (AS) would be the same person. Now that hadees it self is classified as fabricated/Daéef by Scholars of Science of Hadees. On top of that, the so-called Muslims Legend of Imam Mehdi itself cannot be proved from Saheen, both Imam Bukhari and Imam Malik have rejected all the ahadees regarding the coming of Mehdi. although few hadeeses are their in other books of ahadees, but cerdibility of those books and those ahadees carries a question mark on it.

To make the thing more funnier, Qadyanies believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani was the Mahdi but they refuse to believe the fact that what ever ahadees (right or wrong) are available on the topic of Mehdi, provides totally different signs about Mehdi, none of them can be proved in Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani.. funny isn't it, they take what ever suits them, they reject or object or argue on things doesn't suit their need.

In this discussion, Qadyanies brought up the Issues of Prophet Ellijah and Idrees (AHS), both were refuted and it was proved that in both cases the belief of qadyanies was based on the fabricated books.

Coming to the subject of Jesus (AS), again the have ignored all the questions i asked about the signs of Jesus (AS) and just came up with a comment that it is their personel believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani was the Jesus (AS).

On what basis they have this believe, what are the grounds of their believe how they are going to prove it from Quran/Hadees, they are not interested in it. or may i say, they cannot.

If you have forgtten the title was FUNDAMENTAL BELIEFS OF AHMADIES, now one of them is that Qadyanies/Ahmadies consider Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani a Prophet, Jesus, Mehdi... and defending it something else, you were not able to prove that he actually was it.. all you gave is some examples from fabricated books and some fabricated ahadees... Well if ur religion is based on Fabricated Material, i must say that, it will be real hard to defend it and the approach would be the one you have adopted... Good luck with ur approach...

If you are that much interested in my beliefs, please feel free to start a new topic, and i may answer there...

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Qadyanies can believe what ever they can, may be prophet hood will continue in their religion as jews have the same concept that the prophet-hood would contiunue but it will be in JEWS/BANI-ISRAEL only.. so you can have the same belief.

U can quote whomever you want to, ulemas, illamas or who ever, if their quotes are against the Sahi hadees i have posted about the finality of Prophethood then they are wrong...

I am not interested in the return of Jesus (AS), i was interested to see, if the your Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadayni, fulfill the prophecy of the JESUS (AS) or not, which you decided to not to talk on, in that case i'll be right to assume that atleast you do not have enough knowledge of ur religion and its science and its fundamentals, or you may not want to discuss them as they can be proved wrong..

Unless and untill you want to discuss the signs of Jesus (AS) and locate them in Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyani, I am not interested in this discussion as Return of Jesus (AS) and Mehdi is purely internal issues amoung muslims and non-muslims should worry about their things only, specially if they have already got their Jesus/Mehdi..

I'll rest my case here, but if you do want to take this discussion further, you need to stick on the fundamentals of Ahmadiyat/Qadyaniyat.. going here and there will take us no where...

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yes yes yes i agree with that. and probably it will matter little whether Hazrat Isa is believed to be alive in heavens or not. ( even though he is!!!!!)

MAIN THING THAT is agianst islam is that mirza has declared himself a nabi. that has made them non-muslims. they are not muslims niether are they any SECT of muslims.they have twisted tha meaning of KHATIM UN NABIYYEEN and veses of Quran to SUIT their purpose. and UMMAH agrees.

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

Peace All

This thread is getting out of hand.

The title is about presenting the belief of the Ahamdi people. All that comes afterwards is superfluous. Instead of resorting to these people are so and so just keep to the basic topic.

To clarify: Ahmadi have such and such an opinion about this and mainstream Sunni/Shi'a beliefs are this ... there is no need to go further and say therefore these people are such and such because this will create not only a breach of the forum rules but also a breach of Islamic conduct.

Now I urge from now on you all try to summarise the specific points and leave it there then we can leave this thread ... anymore mudslinging will mean the thread will have to close again this time permanently.

Full Time Masti - May 2013
Full Time Masti - May 2013
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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

[note]
As Br Psyah has said, we need to give this thread a direction and try to reach a conclusion.

Plz summarise your points, or we will do it for you.

Aramis and d-toxed have now a separate thread to discuss the allegation issue and Mahdi belief among traditional muslims also separated into new thread.

If the thread continues to be all over the place as now, we may lock it again, put down a summary and then allow only pre-moderated posts

[/note]

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

I have already summarized my points in my last posts, unless Mr.Popat want to talk on those points ( proving the fundamentals of Ahmadiyat/Qadyaniyat to be true), i have no interest left in the topic at hand.

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I have summarized my posts as well and told what the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadi Muslims are. I'll repeat it here once more:

  • Ahmadis believe that just like any other prophets ...Hazrat Esa AS is dead. He AS is no more coming back to this world bodily alive, as if one is dead, he does not return to the Earth again.
  • We as ahmadis believe in 5 pillars of Islam whole heartedly.
  • We believe Prophet Muhammad PBUH to be the seal of prophets. Khataman nabiyeen.
  • We believe Quran to be the final word of Allah and that Muhammad PBUH's shariyah is the last of the shariyah. No other law can now come from Allah that will cancel Muhammadi PBUH's shariyah. Anyone who does that is surely a liar.
  • We believe in all the hadiths mentioning the coming of Imam Mahdi and Isa AS.
  • Our belief is that the hadith mentioning the coming of Isa AS is actually the Messiah of Islam, and not the Esa AS which was sent to bani israel.
  • Our belief is that Imam Mahdi has come. His name is Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad AS.
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OK before the thread closes down quickly. The first post which should have been is if someone likes Jamaat Ahmadiyya then how they can be part of it.

To become an Ahmadi you have to fill a Ba’at Form which is directed to Khalifa tul Masih for approval.

The declaration form on be found at following link: http://alislam.org/introduction/declaration.pdf

Promissed Messiah (A.S) has laid down following 10 conditions of Ba’it. The converted Ahmadi has to read these conditions and declare that he will try his/her utmost to adhere these conditions:

The initiate shall solemnly promise:

**I **That he/she shall abstain from Shirk (association of any partner with God) right up to the day of his/her death.

**II **That he/she shall keep away from falsehood, fornication, adultery, trespasses of the eye, debauchery, dissipation, cruelty, dishonesty, mischief and rebellion; and will not permit himself/herself to be carried away by passions, however strong they might be.

**III **That he/she shall regularly offer the five daily prayers in accordance with the commandments of God and the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him); and shall try his/her best to be regular in offering the Tahajud (pre-dawn supererogatory prayers) and invoking Darood (blessings) on the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him); that he/she shall make it his/her daily routine to ask forgiveness for his/her sins, to remember the bounties of God and to praise and glorify Him.

**IV **That under the impulse of any passions, he/she shall cause no harm whatsoever to the creatures of Allah in general, and Muslims in particular, neither by his/her tongue nor by his/her hands nor by any other means.

**V **That he/she shall remain faithful to God in all circumstances of life, in sorrow and happiness, adversity and prosperity, in felicity and trial; and shall in all conditions remain resigned to the decree of Allah and keep himself/herself ready to face all kinds of indignities and sufferings in His way and shall never turn away from it at the onslaught of any misfortune; on the contrary, he/she shall march forward.

**VI **That he/she shall refrain from following un-islamic customs and lustful inclinations, and shall completely submit himself/herself to the authority of the Holy Quran; and shall make the Word of God and the Sayings of the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) the guiding principle in every walk of his/her life.

**VII **That he/she shall entirely give up pride and vanity and shall pass all his/her life in humbleness, cheerfulness, forbearance and meekness.

**VIII **That he/she shall hold faith, the honor of faith, and the cause of Islam dearer to him/her than his/her life, wealth, honor, children and all other dear ones.

**IX **That he/she shall keep himself/herself occupied in the service of God’s creatures for His sake only; and shall endeavor to benefit mankind to the best of his/her God-given abilities and powers.

**X **That he/she shall enter into a bond of brotherhood with this humble servant of God, pledging obedience to me in everything good, for the sake of Allah, and remain faithful to it till the day of his/her death; that he/she shall exert such a high devotion in the observance of this bond as is not to be found in any other worldly relationship and connections demanding devoted dutifulness.

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

so where is that claim that mirza ghulam has to be considered a nabi and rasool etc? isnt that the first fundamental belief?

and also if ANYONE who claims to be muslim and did not bait on mirza is a kkafir.(does not matter if he belives in ONE ALLAH. prophet MOHAMMAD, all previous prophets and holy books)

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Re: What are the fundamental beliefs of Ahmadis?

neither have you mentioned your FUNDAMENTAL belief that mirza was better than hazrat ISA