Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Dum maro dum
mit jaye gum
Bolo subah. Shaam
hare Krishna hare ram
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Wah wah. On a serious note lack of secularism is not Pakistan’s main problem. All we need to do is tone down the jihad and anti-America rhetoric a bit. Control the corruption and start manufacturing. Easy peasy.
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Aren’t we talking about secularism?
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
It’s a scary word. We have to move towards secularism without actually using the word.
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
You can substitute any other God of your liking! This is only a recommendation for happy living! ( I thought safer to stick to original lyrics)
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Right. But Jehad and Anti-America slogans are the source of bread & butter for many, who don’t want to deliver. Those on whose face a line is written : ‘Beware, my Islam is too much fragile. It is hurt by making any Non-Muslim Head of State. It is hurt to own a Nobel Prize winner Qadyani’ 
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
You can substitute any other God of your liking! This is only a recommendation for happy living! ( I thought safer to stick to original lyrics)
Koi baat nahin uncle. Eeashwar ek, Roop anaik :)
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
We could give them some other job, like cleaning the gutters. There’s a solution to every problem. The thing is people are scared of Qadyannis cause someone said that they are even more dangerous than KAfirs. Change won’t be easy.
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Ex chancellor Vastanvi had to resign when he said muslim should now move on like other communities, he had to resign despite being known progressive. Shudras have 19% quota in govt, OBC has 27%, Forward caste like mine fights in general seats to get govt job
Yadav being 22 % are less than 1% in job Muslim being 15% are nearly 4 percent Brahimins being 7% nearly 30 percent even though they fight in general merit.
classic case with medical seats in my state
to get a medical seat for a forward caste guy like me. one should get a rank below 800 out of total 60000 participants.suppose if a guy in that 800 gets a seat in national exam like AIIMS
a guy with 801 rank won't get that vacant seat if he is from forward caste,they would give it someone from bc/sc/st(muslim,christians included) who is of 3000-4000 rank,even with a rank of 10000-15000 they could still earn in dental/veterinary
i think government should ban quota system based on caste rather it should be based on poverty line,there are many rich bc/sc as well as poor forward caste
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Your post just trivialized the instutionalized discrimination against Muslims. It is sad when intelligent and reasonable folks deny the existence of institutional discrimination - and cannot or will not distinguish it from random individual level discriminationm
See, if muslim is discrimated by a hindu, it is discrimination, if a hindu is discriminated by parsee, it is non issue, parsees are minority.
Muslim need not to sing vande matram,national song, it hurts their religion and bhoomipoojan is hurts secularism?
Muslims have seprate civil code, a seprate personal law board but if they can't get beef on Gandhi jayanti it hurts secularism?
this secularism is menace to forward castes, Brahmin,Baniyas,Jats/Landlord who were the freedom fighters in the freedom struggle, but ambedkar has more busts then Gandhi and Bhagat taken together.
15% muslim Sacchar commision, Ranganath Misra Commision, 22% yadavs no one gives a ****.
Ahemadis 100% literate
Shia's 70% literate
Sunnis 30%
unique way of discrimination by majority isn't it?
classic case with medical seats in my state
to get a medical seat for a forward caste guy like me. one should get a rank below 800 out of total 60000 participants.suppose if a guy in that 800 gets a seat in national exam like AIIMS a guy with 801 rank won't get that vacant seat if he is from forward caste,they would give it someone from bc/sc/st(muslim,christians included) who is of 3000-4000 rank,even with a rank of 10000-15000 they could still earn in dental/veterinary i think government should ban quota system based on caste rather it should be based on poverty line,there are many rich bc/sc as well as poor forward caste
RBI recruitment 30 seats all together, 15 general seats, 1 for kashmir displaced, 1 for 84 victim, 2 for handicaps Forward class. Remaining 11 for physically and mentally fit General caste,where best of indian brains fight, and when these best of brain become Subbarao this is bias towards forwards. hail secularism:D
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
I think you still are continuing tovtrivialize institutional bias. Roti kapda. Aur makan are 3 basic needs. In Bombay a flat in 1970 worth rs z23000 goes for 35 lambs now. A 13% compounded annualized return. Muslims could not availnof this return because they were not sold these flats.
The ambedkar reference was uncalled for.
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
I think you still are continuing tovtrivialize institutional bias. Roti kapda. Aur makan are 3 basic needs. In Bombay a flat in 1970 worth rs z23000 goes for 35 lambs now. A 13% compounded annualized return. Muslims could not availnof this return because they were not sold these flats. The ambedkar reference was uncalled for.
Of cousre, not only muslim even many Hindus can't get it if it is from another minority, speaking for muslim is secularism in India, speaking for people of forward caste is either trivializing or right winging, Speaking for Gandhi is trivializing, speaking for ambedkar is giving dalit right. Jai ho secularism waale baba ki.
Sikhs did all sort of act from secession to terrorism but they are accepted, muslim weren't into this but yet discriminated. Sunni being discriminated more than Ahemadis and Shia, yes I believe it:)
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
You have equated the lack of housing available for Hindus in parsee community with equivalent for Muslims in Hindu community. Let me explain why it is beyond obvious this is trivialization of Institutional discrimination.
Parsee population - my guess- 200000 in India. Assume average #/ household = 4
So 50000 parsee households.
Hindu popoulation about 770 million. So surely the # of unavailable household pales in comparison to Hindu population.
Muslim population say 200 million. # of Hindu households = 190 million. So # of unavailable households Huge for 200 million Muslim population.
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Financial nuggets in history
On a serious note, very nicely done statistical analysis :k:
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Even no hindu can rent a flat in Parsee colony, strange but true, Shabana Azmi, daughter of Kaifi Azmi, wife of Javed Akhtar is denied flat seems quite strange, rules for poor and rich are different.
The kaur you are missing the fact.....I knwo there are special apartments for followers of particular belief like jains have exclusive apartments where no non-jain can buy flat and in same manner gujrati and parsees have exclusive apartments...and its legal...but what shabana and imran hashmi claimede is true because they aint buying flat in apartments meant for exclusive communities..
P.S.my brother faced same problem while tried to rent a flat from gujrati and that apartment was not exclusively for gujratis...
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
Ex chancellor Vastanvi had to resign when he said muslim should now move on like other communities, he had to resign despite being known progressive. Shudras have 19% quota in govt, OBC has 27%, Forward caste like mine fights in general seats to get govt job
Yadav being 22 % are less than 1% in job Muslim being 15% are nearly 4 percent Brahimins being 7% nearly 30 percent even though they fight in general merit.
you are clearly misrepresenting the facts.....Yadavs are part of hindu religion if we talk about backward muslims we can show muslims more backward than yadavs..
Yadavs got OBC reservation they are part of obc....
Yadav are mainly from under developed states of UP and bihar while muslims about whom we are talking about are spread all over india.....
Of you want to compare yadav please compare them with julaha or other caste of muslim community or at least with muslims from UP and bihar to get a clear picture....
And not getting beef is not my pain but it tells more about secular structure of india....
We are talking about hindu and muslim communities and suddenly you picked up a caste of hindus and compairing them muslims....like they are follower of some other religion....
P.S.yadavs are ruling class of UP and bihar.....
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
A few years back I was studying in a Masters course in some foreign country, and I met an Indian muslim from Gujarat and he was saying the same things that the first preference in government jobs is for higher castes and muslims come last in line. And that the residential areas are segregated in a way that a low caste person and a muslim cannot live in higher caste people's areas. Is that true?
I dont know more about gujrat but heard lot of discrimination in gujrat...
I had seen lot of gujratis few are good but lot of carry communal grudge..i saw they even dont like to drink water at muslim household...
AS far as different areas of muslims are concerned i think such ghettos swell after every religious riots....
Though in maharshtra i can buy home at any place but still hindu dont want muslims to buy homes in their locality...:D
I had seen lot of hindus insulting our servants for working in a muslim family.....They used to say Musalman ke yahan kaam karte sharm nahi aati kya...:D
I still dont know any particular insulting term for hindus but i was taunted for being muslim with a word that they use to insult muslims....
When hindu does not home in hindu india its due to corrupt system same may happen with muslim....but we can sense when its failure of system and when its hatred and discrimination against muslims...
When muslim want to buy some property they suddenly raise the prices....these things happen on regular intervals....
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
As for beef ban on Gandhi Jaynthi. Gandhiji would have been against it. Why bring religious practice into this.
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
As for beef ban on Gandhi Jaynthi. Gandhiji would have been against it. Why bring religious practice into this.
So Gandhi ji was not against the act of cow slaughter?
Re: Was Pakistan meant to be secular like India?
you are clearly misrepresenting the facts.....Yadavs are part of hindu religion if we talk about backward muslims we can show muslims more backward than yadavs..
Yadavs got OBC reservation they are part of obc.... Yadav are mainly from under developed states of UP and bihar while muslims about whom we are talking about are spread all over india.....
Of you want to compare yadav please compare them with julaha or other caste of muslim community or at least with muslims from UP and bihar to get a clear picture....
And not getting beef is not my pain but it tells more about secular structure of india.... We are talking about hindu and muslim communities and suddenly you picked up a caste of hindus and compairing them muslims....like they are follower of some other religion.... P.S.yadavs are ruling class of UP and bihar.....
Yadavs are available all over India as far as Andhra and TamilNadu, get your fact corrects, Muslim always try to present themselves as group which they are not. Syeds and Sheikhs are as good as Pundas and Baniyas even in bihar, Muslim Saudagars are famous for bussiness even before independence. Yadavs are assisted by muslims in UP and Bihar, Bihar had muslim CM much before Lalu. Mulayam's Kursi's three legs are muslims, Azam khan of Rampur is number two and will be acting CM in non availability of Akhilesh
Muslims are not group they also vote as hindu castes in UP where they are majority.Prosperity of Hindu barber and muslim barber is same. Hindu weaver is OBC just like Muslim Weaver. Syeds among muslims are most of the leader be it Imam-e-Jama Masjid or Syed Shanawaz Hussain of BJP, only prominent Pathan is Azam Khan. Querishi and Ansari are looked down upon by Syeds. Caste discrimination is muslims is as tough as Hindus. A syed never marries her daughter in Ansari in Kanpur. A Hindu Jamadar is same as Muslim Jamadar.
This is why no commision will be successful unless they study muslims caste pyramid, and none of commssion be it Sacchar or Rangnath misra commission explains why Ahemeddiyas have less than 5% in population have100% literacy and 90% of muslims who are sunni are less than 30%, I am sure Syed literacy would be more than 80%. similar to 100% literate brahmins, 65% graduates but still Hindu society is just 60% literate.
Financial position of Ashrafs is different from Ajlafs, Ashrafs are twice more richer than average Ajlaf. Now hindu Kasai and querishis are not different in prosperity. With such a consolidated vote in adverse situation, institutional discrimination is not even possible, in fact minorities have different institute where they are inducted in majority be it St Stephen's delhi,AMU, Khalsa Collage.
As for beef ban on Gandhi Jaynthi. Gandhiji would have been against it. Why bring religious practice into this.
Even liquor is banned on Gandhi Jayanti, so if deepawali on that day would be dry day, it hurts hindu celebration, hence proved Gandhian principles are anti thesis to religious sentiment and blot on India secular credentials:D
So Gandhi ji was not against the act of cow slaughter?
Gandhiji was against any type of killing, that is why Indians haven't killed mosquitoes in 65 years even though it kills us:D