Virginity..

[moin.ul.atiq]

Re: Virginity..

@Terrible_Guy

You remain virgin until you get married, period. Nobody said you have to wait until you’re 30 though. I myself got married in my mid to late 20’s.

Maybe you can’t avoid some people in your life, but that doesn’t mean you have to associate with them more than is necessary. You don’t need to worry about how acceptable people think your reasons are for being a virgin or for following any part of deen. You’re giving yourself a headache for nothing. Hanging around these people and trying to please them will get you nothing except for more non-issues to worry about. If hanging out with these people is getting you to even contemplate pre-marital sex, then being called anti-social by them is a much better alternative.

Remember that our success lies in following the orders of Allah. These people whose opinions you’re getting worked up about cannot benefit you or harm you. You need no justification whatsoever for following deen.

The closest I came to dealing the peer pressure you’re going through is that I avoided alcohol in university, even if all my peers were consuming it. I was not the least the least bit ashamed by it. Some people would say stuff like “What? you don’t drink?” and I would confidentally tell them I don’t. Some might I have seen it as strange but I didn’t care.

Be brave and do the right thing. If youngsters like you will make the right choices in these matters, not only will you benefit, inshAllah you will also be a means of hidayah for others.

Thanks a lot, brother for your comments and advise :k: kep them coming

[Orpheus]

Re: Virginity..

...keep em coming?

Is all the above not enough.

[moin.ul.atiq]

Re: Virginity..

@Raatkirani

You’re about to get yourself in very hot water here, moin. I was born and raised in the west with the highest standards. And I have many friends and relatives with the same good values. None of us ever dared to have boyfriends out of respect for our parents and our fear of Allah. And our parents were very involved in raising us, and they did tell us plainly who we couldn’t hang out with.

I married a shareef Pakistani born and bred man who couldn’t believe his good fortune since all of his friends back in Pakistan (both male and female) dated, fooled around and were even sexually active before marriage (many many stories of girls from respectable families who had their boyfriends sneak into their rooms after everyone had gone to sleep, or the classic “I’m going to Saba’s house” but in reality were going to Shan’s.) So you see, you really can’t stereotype either place–it’s more about individuals and their limits. Not “You’re from America, so you must be a slut.” It doesn’t work that way. Learn this lesson now before you make another mistake.

Yes, there is more pressure in the west to become sexually active before marriage, but at the same time, there are plenty of people out there who are God fearing (even goray) who do wait until marriage. Your mistake is that you were very bewakoof in telling everyone you were a virgin. Just why were you spilling your personal business in front of everyone? Get more chalak, and next time, just say you aren’t interested or you’re with someone else. End of story.

aap tu naraaz ho gaye! See, I am not saying all Pakistani girls are slut or anything like that since I dont really know what do they do behind close doors. I am saying what I have heard about Pakistani girls from people who they were friends and sometimes girlfriends with. There’s an Iranian kurd guy in my batch and he had a Pakistani american girlfriend in high school and he tells me that his gf would only give him oral since its not “techincally sex”- she wanted to be “virgin” till her marriage and he was ok with that given her self-defined Islamic values. There might be some good girls too like you point you in your post- who remain virgin(abstenance from any kind of sexual activity incl. oral). He was telling me most of the “virgin” Pakistani girls in the west are like that- I donno since I’ve come fresh from Pakistan. I dont I am bewakoof in being brutally honest since I consider virginity to be one of my assets Alhamdullilah I never have heard of pre-marital sex as you describe in your post.. Bottomline, don’t worry about Islam- How can Pakistani American girls be completely Islamic when they dont do hijaab completely and 5 times prayer:confused: Leave Islam to us, the Pakistanis and you grab X-Box or Playstation console- that suits on you

[moin.ul.atiq]

Re: Virginity..

in the future....when such a proposal comes your way just refuse...no need to explain or get into details.

OR

If you feel like you have to explain.......simply say "I dont believe in premarital sex" and/or "premarital sex goes against my beliefs".....most people wont tease you about it if you tell them it goes against what you believe in.

at this point...since what's said and done....just move on and try not to care about what others think. These people arent going to help you get anywhere in life and they surely wont help you get to the hereafter. Be proud of what and who you are and what you believe in......also... try to hang out with people that share the same beliefs that you have...it'll be better for you.

Thanks a lot sister, those were very well written words. I really appreciate your valuablel inputs:)

[SolarOceans]

Re: Virginity..

@moin.ul.atiq

aap tu naraaz ho gaye! See, I am not saying all Pakistani girls are slut or anything like that since I dont really know what do they do behind close doors. I am saying what I have heard about Pakistani girls from people who they were friends and sometimes girlfriends with. There’s an Iranian kurd guy in my batch and he had a Pakistani american girlfriend in high school and he tells me that his gf would only give him oral since its not “techincally sex”- she wanted to be “virgin” till her marriage and he was ok with that given her self-defined Islamic values. There might be some good girls too like you point you in your post- who remain virgin(abstenance from any kind of sexual activity incl. oral). He was telling me most of the “virgin” Pakistani girls in the west are like that- I donno since I’ve come fresh from Pakistan. I dont I am bewakoof in being brutally honest since I consider virginity to be one of my assets Alhamdullilah I never have heard of pre-marital sex as you describe in your post.. Bottomline, don’t worry about Islam- How can Pakistani American girls be completely Islamic when they dont do hijaab completely and 5 times prayer:confused: Leave Islam to us, the Pakistanis and you grab X-Box or Playstation console- that suits on you

How very pakistani-islamic of you . . .

[Croquet]

Re: Virginity..

this is so full of crap what is a good muslim, pakistani doing hanging out in paaaaaaaarties where he receives such purposal?

[Spanishgirl]

Re: Virginity..

[XGamer]

Re: Virginity..

@moin.ul.atiq

…Leave Islam to us, the Pakistanis and you grab X-Box or Playstation console- that suits on you

You’re saying that she should go play XBox or Playstation and leave Islam to pakistanis who go to parties where there are girls, some of which ask you to spend the night with them? I don’t know about you, but I think people who play XBox or Playstation and don’t attend such parties, are a much better representation of Islam than someone who goes to such parties and then makes excuses that he needs to go otherwise he’ll be labelled as anti-social.

[Kaleem]

Re: Virginity..

Confucius says: Virginity like a balloon, one prick all gone.

[Raatkirani]

Re: Virginity..

@moin.ul.atiq

aap tu naraaz ho gaye! See, I am not saying all Pakistani girls are slut or anything like that since I dont really know what do they do behind close doors. I am saying what I have heard about Pakistani girls from people who they were friends and sometimes girlfriends with. There’s an Iranian kurd guy in my batch and he had a Pakistani american girlfriend in high school and he tells me that his gf would only give him oral since its not “techincally sex”- she wanted to be “virgin” till her marriage and he was ok with that given her self-defined Islamic values. There might be some good girls too like you point you in your post- who remain virgin(abstenance from any kind of sexual activity incl. oral). He was telling me most of the “virgin” Pakistani girls in the west are like that- I donno since I’ve come fresh from Pakistan. I dont I am bewakoof in being brutally honest since I consider virginity to be one of my assets Alhamdullilah I never have heard of pre-marital sex as you describe in your post.. Bottomline, don’t worry about Islam- How can Pakistani American girls be completely Islamic when they dont do hijaab completely and 5 times prayer:confused: Leave Islam to us, the Pakistanis and you grab X-Box or Playstation console- that suits on you

What are you talking about? Pakistani American girls aren’t Islamic?! Honey, you’ve been hanging out with the wrong crowd. Most of my friends are religious, many of them wear strict hijab, all of us pray 5 times a day, fast, even go to masjid on a regular basis, and all of us were chaste until marriage. I wouldn’t let some Kurd dictate to me what a Pakistani girl is or isn’t. In general, Arabs and Persians love to put down desis, and it reflects poorly on the Kurd that he participates in premarital activity (it takes two to tango.) You’re probably just trolling to get me all riled up, but if you truly believe that Pakistani Americans aren’t shareef, you’re sorely mistaken. We are the ones who struggled to keep Islam alive in a kafirkhana and I think we did a darn good job. In Pakistan, you’re Muslim by default. Everywhere you go, it’s bismillah here, adhaan there, peer pressure to pray or fast, etc. Here, the odds are stacked against you, and you should be ashamed that you disparage those who struggled to have Islam be established in America. Yes there are bad apples in every bunch. But like I said, just because some girl is from Pakistan, that doesn’t mean she’s shareef, and I know plenty of desi girls living in Pakistan who behave as “western” as it gets and I also know plenty of girls who have immigrated to America and they too, get very western very quickly. I remember when I put my son in an Islamic preschool here in the US, there were quite a few mothers (maybe 10 years older than me) recently immigrated from Pakistan. They couldn’t believe that I was born and raised in America because of my traditional demeanor and my ability to speak Urdu fluently. One of them went so far as to say, “Gosh, when girls your age come from Pakistan, they get out of control and lose themselves. Bahut loosh-loosh karti hain. I never knew that people can raise such good daughters in America.” I really suggest that you stop hanging out with the badmash crowd and find the your way into the majority of desi-Americans who are good people.

[Umer]

Re: Virginity..

Moin,

When I was reading your initial post at the start of this thread, I was thinking that I have to change my opinion about you, which had been quite negative as a result of your previous posts. But this time you had brought up an interesting topic, which unfortunately is valid to a certain extent, because some Pakistanis do get involved in haraam behaviour of different kinds after moving abroad, especially when they start to mingle with the wrong crowd. Btw, you should avoid those Danish people you are hanging out with, if they are making fun of the fact that you stay on the right path.

But the following comment of yours reiterated my previous opinion about you:

@moin.ul.atiq

Bottomline, don’t worry about Islam- How can Pakistani American girls be completely Islamic when they dont do hijaab completely and 5 times prayer:confused: Leave Islam to us, the Pakistanis and you grab X-Box or Playstation console- that suits on you

It shows that you have no clue about the realities of Pakistanis abroad and that you generalize based on stupid comments from one of your Kurdish friends. This reminds me of the taxi driver thing, btw.

[Let_Uz_Chat]

Re: Virginity..

Umer bhai just nailed the whole thread.

[case_study]

Re: Virginity..

oh the heat in this thread, brethern calm down!!
issue is that some people unfortunately have double standards. bad company is always one of the reasons why men lose on good choices and decisions in life.
it is because their friends are jealous of them, this gets coupled with the wrong notion that whatever people, who know me, say about me and my choices, must be right.
as a male, being a virgin is a good thing because i am savving my love for a equally noble mate. simple as that. i've lived in london all long my life, but never it occured to me, that i should make a fool of my self, with gori women, or even bad pakistani women.
do you know how much danger there is in sleeping around with people?
you owe it to your future generations to keep yourself clean.
that is all i can say and i am a man. yes, brought up has a lot to do with this, and the way men and women think nowadays, in case of intimate relations for selfish reasons, is sickening.
it is for this reason that everyone who is on the right track, must get settled with one spouse and be married. my two pence.

[moin.ul.atiq]

Re: Virginity..

@Umer

Moin,

When I was reading your initial post at the start of this thread, I was thinking that I have to change my opinion about you, which had been quite negative as a result of your previous posts. But this time you had brought up an interesting topic, which unfortunately is valid to a certain extent, because some Pakistanis do get involved in haraam behaviour of different kinds after moving abroad, especially when they start to mingle with the wrong crowd. Btw, you should avoid those Danish people you are hanging out with, if they are making fun of the fact that you stay on the right path.

But the following comment of yours reiterated my previous opinion about you:

It shows that you have no clue about the realities of Pakistanis abroad and that you generalize based on stupid comments from one of your Kurdish friends. This reminds me of the taxi driver thing, btw.

Thanks for thinking of showing some respect to me, Umer bhai- Rajput or not, I have always admired you. Unfortunately, I can’t speak my heart out as Ehsan bhai has given me warnings ( I donno why??)- and any further warning lead to my membership being terminated- which I would not like. Guppies, let us all appeal to Ehsan bhai to revoke warning points.. I would be thankful. Umer bhai, I started a thread to highlight an important aspect of any Pakistani who comes over to the west and faces a very open society. I raised pertinent questions like what would a Pakistani guy do? Side with his culture/religion or side with prevalent and popular culture? The same applies to girls too.. but somewhere the whole thread got dreailed and things started getting personal . The Kurdish guy is a nice guy- he wasn’t’ lying, brother. He told me a lot more about Pakistani expatriates- if only you and other guppies and guppans are ears for it..

[picoico]

Re: Virginity..

@queer

moin pai, if you dont use it by the time you are 25, your body kills of your mojo. you are guaranteed a crappy sex life, with a partner who is equally horrible in bed.

It would require the discovery of time travel to prove such an assertion.

[moin.ul.atiq]

Re: Virginity..

What are you talking about? Pakistani American girls aren't Islamic?! Honey, you've been hanging out with the wrong crowd. Most of my friends are religious, many of them wear strict hijab, all of us pray 5 times a day, fast, even go to masjid on a regular basis, and all of us were chaste until marriage. I wouldn't let some Kurd dictate to me what a Pakistani girl is or isn't. In general, Arabs and Persians love to put down desis, and it reflects poorly on the Kurd that he participates in premarital activity (it takes two to tango.) You're probably just trolling to get me all riled up, but if you truly believe that Pakistani Americans aren't shareef, you're sorely mistaken. We are the ones who struggled to keep Islam alive in a kafirkhana and I think we did a darn good job. In Pakistan, you're Muslim by default. Everywhere you go, it's bismillah here, adhaan there, peer pressure to pray or fast, etc. Here, the odds are stacked against you, and you should be ashamed that you disparage those who struggled to have Islam be established in America. Yes there are bad apples in every bunch. But like I said, just because some girl is from Pakistan, that doesn't mean she's shareef, and I know plenty of desi girls living in Pakistan who behave as "western" as it gets and I also know plenty of girls who have immigrated to America and they too, get very western very quickly. I remember when I put my son in an Islamic preschool here in the US, there were quite a few mothers (maybe 10 years older than me) recently immigrated from Pakistan. They couldn't believe that I was born and raised in America because of my traditional demeanor and my ability to speak Urdu fluently. One of them went so far as to say, "Gosh, when girls your age come from Pakistan, they get out of control and lose themselves. Bahut loosh-loosh karti hain. I never knew that people can raise such good daughters in America." I really suggest that you stop hanging out with the badmash crowd and find the your way into the majority of desi-Americans who are good people.

RKR, I wouldn't say anything since I have been issued a lot of warnings by fellow punjabi, Mr. Ehsan bhai- but read the highlighted parts of your own post.. Dont you think you are contradicting yourself? Why would be the moms be surprised at you if all Pakistani american gals are nice- if you would be a typical "sample" - so to speak.. wouldn't you be?? I can guarantee you about girls from Pakistan.. I have like cousins numbering close to 100 and among them girls are very very nice.. alhamdullilah. I guess we are just talking about out own experiences.. But just out of curiosity, I have a few questions for you(nothing personal)- 1) don't some Pakistani american gals like to have pre/extra marital relationships like goras? 2) Don't some dont like to say they have Pakistani origins?? 3) Is not it true that some Pakistani ameircan girls dislike their gusband for marrying another girl(which is very permissible in Islam)- who infact should be treated like a sister..

sister home?

[Croquet]

Re: Virginity..

1)some pakistani girls have pre/extra marital affairs or relationships whether they are brought up in pakistan or abroad.
2)yes there are those around who are ashamed of their origin but on second hand we have a breed that does nothing but criticise Pakistan and bad mouth it to any one visiting, even worse since they were brought up in the very land.
3)Believe me a whole lot of women find the idea of second marriage intolerable and this has nothing to do with being brought in america or pakistan.
now your turn why would a good virgin muslim pakistani boy be partying out where na mehrams are present?

[Khumar]

Re: Virginity..

^^ because he is a rajput gharanay ka chasm-o-charagh. he has the duty to do so

[Pathani]

Re: Virginity..

Moin:Obviously when the dane gal approached you, your response was very innocent and perhaps too truthful.
Living abroad lot of moroons will approach or step over our toes now and then... However, the thing is to keep your imaan strong. Dont wave the banners of your own chosen lifestyle, keep things simple by being diplomatic.
There are rotten apples amongst Pak born and western born too. However, it would be sad to think the few represents the majority, who wants to live a clean sober life with Islamic values.
Its a cute thing when a man/guy is virgin. I hope he gets the award, for his/her sabr.
Even in western society, being sexual active and having too many partners is surely considered very cheap. Goray mard do judge women they find being way out of line. Double standards...but thats how things are. Lot of goray men are curious about Muslim women. Some of them are introduced to Islam by knowing chaste women/girls.

Yup, I know it at first hand, when girls who moved to western countries go bananas. But even then, our men doesnt seem to judge them so hard as western borns..... Its still better to have a girl back from Pacland than chosing/arranging a marriage with girls living in same country. Well said enough.

[Krypton]

Re: Virginity..

@Orpheus

…keep em coming?

Is all the above not enough.