re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
There are not more than ten - fifteen thousand people in Islamabad and there could not be more than twenty thousand with TuQ , If we can count some ten thousand more participant from Islamabad at last moment than too it can not exceed fifty thousand any way . Actual participant can be much lesser .
re: Tahirul Qadri’s long march
I think … that is wrong and misleading statement.
I believe, once not-so-neutral and politically biased caretaker government is formed (by consensus of prime minster and opposition leader), than to change that set-up would be almost impossible. Caretaker government would do what they want and no one can stop them other than army taking over or intervention of Supreme Court in limited way.
Time is now, when present government is on verge of appointing caretaker government, that they appoint a neutral set-up or risk chaos and military takeover.
Same is about election commission, that if they are left tooth-less by present government than they would stay tooth-less under caretaker government, as caretaker government would have limited powers and could not substantially increase or decrease investigative, enforcing, or administrative powers of election commission.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
I think ... that is wrong and misleading statement.
I believe, once not-so-neutral and politically biased caretaker government is formed (by consensus of prime minster and opposition leader), than to change that set-up would be almost impossible. They (caretaker government) would do what they want and no one can stop them other than army taking over.
Time is now, when present government is on verge of appointing caretaker government, that they appoint a neutral set-up or risk chaos and military takeover.
Same is about election commission, that if they are left tooth-less by present government than they would stay tooth-less under caretaker government, as caretaker government has limited powers and could not substantially increase or decrease investigative, enforcing, or administrative power of election commission.
The line is very thin, if he takes some action now and brings the government down. This would be taken as an extra constitutional step with the help of 'establishment'. Would destroy his political credentials. As far as rigging the elections is concerned, if that takes place there would be a movement like PNA as people are fed up now with all those who are ruling.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
This time voting is with NADRA computerized card and voting lists and if the poling agents work properly , Bogus voting is impossible .
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
These are dangerous times, considering the anger that people have. Lets hope we come out stronger after the chaos/mayhem.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
I think nothing will happen. lol
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
The line is very thin, if he takes some action now and brings the government down. This would be taken as an extra constitutional step with the help of 'establishment'. Would destroy his political credentials. As far as rigging the elections is concerned, if that takes place there would be a movement like PNA as people are fed up now with all those who are ruling.
How can demanding neutral care-taker government set-up and strong election commission is unconstitutional or extra-constitutional step?
Present government would only fall if they stay adamant of appointing bias caretaker government and keeping election commission tooth-less ... and thus continuous protest against government would bring in armed forces or make Supreme Court enforce quality of caretaker government and election commission.
Another thing is rigging of election but no one is saying that next election would be rigged with 'Jali' voting as all voters would be NADRA computerized ID card holders.
This time voting is with NADRA computerized card and voting lists and if the poling agents work properly , Bogus voting is impossible .
You are right that bogus voting is impossible, but no one is talking about bogus voting.
One is talking about eligibility of candidates wanting to contest election. Voters do not know, rather, can not know, what is the character of candidate or that the candidate is corrupt or not, or they were involved in fraud, misuse of power, misconduct, etc (as such is not written on anyone's forehead).
No voter can tell about candidate personal life, their financial dealings, their frauds, their lies, their work, etc. Many did not even met the candidate they may vote. All such can be determined by investigative agencies of state, who do investigation using state power and access to candidate's financial and other information to know if candidate qualify for contesting election.
Thus, demand is that election commission with help of caretaker government, should use state investigative agencies to determine if candidate is eligible for contesting election or not before allowing anyone to contest election ... because ...** if election commission would overlook candidates' credentials allowing everyone to contest election (regardless of their corruption and other wrong doings) then most who would enter the parliament would be undesirable thugs (as usual).**
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
To challenge the eligibility of candidates contesting election is right of every opponent candidate , Election commission and courts are more powerful now and a third party PTI is also taking part , There are more parties also so more fair election are just close but the problem is only that US is not happy with any democratic force and they need puppet like Ayoub ,Zia or Mush .
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
wasn't the march supposed to be today?
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
^ It is taking place at the moment
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
^ It is taking place at the moment
lovely.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
To challenge the eligibility of candidates contesting election is right of every opponent candidate , Election commission and courts are more powerful now and a third party PTI is also taking part , There are more parties also so more fair election are just close but the problem is only that US is not happy with any democratic force and they need puppet like Ayoub ,Zia or Mush .
Allowing thugs to contest election ... and/or electing thugs is not democracy.
Election commission at present can only act if opponent candidate challenges the eligibility and it becomes duty of challenger to provide proof of ineligibility, that also within a short time available.
But this should not be the case as corrupt and ineligibly candidate contesting election affects every Pakistani regardless of wherever that Pakistani lives and whatever constituency that Pakistani votes. Thus, it should be duty of election commission to make sure that all candidates contesting election are illegible to contest election, and that means, they should do investigation on all candidates using state machinery and make sure no ineligible candidate contest election.
Above can only happen if care-taker government is completely neutral and election commission is powerful.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
Pakistani society (forget the higher class..I am talking abt the middle class and lower class ) is corrupt to it core...I have been making this point for a long time....from a doodh wala to an inspector to a shop keeper to a riksha driver, everyone is corrupt or has become corrupt in his own way in last 30 years or so.....and more importantly a common person today legitimizes his corruption by giving self-constructed moral theories...
we guppies tend to think of "pakistani maases" as educated middle class but that is only 2% ..majority that lives in rural and urban areas is uneducated, driven by petty benefits, governs and likes to be governed on bradarai and caste system and has no idea of what fairness means.
so stop living in a dream that it is just the leadership that is corrupt...bring a fair leadership and see people's reaction when that govt will try to collect tax or start punishing for malawat......
I am not suggesting that we need a social revolution at the grass root level or blah blah....just pointing out the obvious and I don't see this situation abnormal either...every third world country is like this including india ext door... but a continuous democratic system keeps filtering some mess...and yes for that we need at least an independent judiciary and an Independent election tribunal...
all i am saying that the real grass root level change is an evolutionary and generational process and will come after centuries and we Pakistanis shd be ready for that....nothing will change over-nite even if we somehow have a " fair & just" govt so to speak...mark my word, our masses will destroy such govt!
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
..but I have seen a positive change....
..most of the change has come from peaceful , and relentless , concentrated efforts ... from the CJ's restoration to the change in Balochistan govt just yesterday .. to perhaps ...this .... Qadri's Antics ...
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
..and to me Pakistanis are going through a crash course of everything ..... these days...
how much have they learned , and what will be the outcome of this hastened crash course is yet to be seen ...
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
..and to me Pakistanis are going through a crash course of everything ..... these days...
how much have they learned , and what will be the outcome of this hastened crash course is yet to be seen ...
I agree there's a lot of awareness in the masses now, if harnessed properly the country could take off.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
I agree there's a lot of awareness in the masses now, if harnessed properly the country could take off.
I have to disagree..there is no take off or take it down....it is a slow process....real masses that constituent 90% or more that live in rural and urban areas are uneducated, driven by petty benefits, govern and like to be governed on bradarai and caste system.. and have no clear idea of equitable, democratic and civilized society and they careless .... that will change very very slow...after hundred of years maybe ....it is an evolutionary process....
again india being a prime example where after 60 years of continued democracy, we still see so many social evils plus masses still vulnerable to exploitation in the name of religion/cast/regionalism/languages ... although years of economic growth and strengthened democrat institutions have put country on the right path...
we need to the same...get your institutions in place..media, judiciary and election commission...and yes i agree we are making progress towards that....but dont expect any sudden take off...come back after 100 years and the basis social mix of Pakistan wont be dramatically different but people will be more aware of their rights..hopefully!
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
Pakistan's does not need more saviors...what it need is a strong leader. Someone like Mahathir Mohamad or Tayyip Erdogan...someone who is not afraid of cracking some skulls to get things done.
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
Did he addressed to the the public in the march yet
re: Tahirul Qadri's long march
We cannot sit back and aspire for great leadership to rescue us from our problems. The leaders are a reflection our collective self. Unless we change and better ourselves and our thoughts we will continue to get the leaders that we desrve.