Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Okay, and U sounds like spokesperson for the average Indian and consider me as pacifist and caldle kisser. U must be putting elected government in the same shelve. isnt it?

And its us who will call the shots. Thats democracy my dear brother. Like it or dislike it like thackreys?

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

I didn't get the last sentence. Where do you call the shots? in a democracy its the majority that calls the shots, and I know for a fact that a majority of Indians including Muslims are sick and tired of Pakistan's shenanigans and the leeway that this UPA government cuts it. Most of us want nothing to do with that country, each time a terror attack goes off in India, it makes life for India's muslims a little more difficult, by association, if nothing else.

My sincere wish is that the NDA returns to power in the next elections.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Well right now its elected government who are calling the shots on our behalf. And what elected government do is wishes of the majority only.

Wait till ur sincere wish is answered by GOD. Than it will be ur ideology which will be taken care of by Modi. lets wait and see.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

General statements dont reflect on individual Indians... But there are Indians such as this Muffadil person and this Chief Shrine person who give you all a bad name. Just as certain segments of Pakistani society shame most Pakistanis with their antics, so should certain segments of your society.

You should have the courage to critisize the stupidity on your side of the border... Nationalism does not mean blind support for the nonsense of your countrymen. To truly honor your heritage means stepping up and calling out those who give your heritage a bad name.
Atithi Devo Bhava is only a hollow slogan if your allow people like this clown to trample all over it.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

If there is a reason to dislike India, you are it. Educate yourself.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

You should convert...

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Not very logical on your part..

Even if he had come ten years hence, he still would have been the PM during the time of the LOC skirmish. so if in your twisted mind he is responsible for the deaths of Indian soldiers, then he would be equally culpable then, as he is now.

Your politicians met him, but not his counter part, which is what would normally happen when a Prime Minister visits on an official visit. And, I suspect your govt isnt mentally retarded, so they know the issue is over blown and not one to cut relations over. What they do is for appearances, in order to appease people like you during election time.

Honestly, you sound really desperate... Who are you trying to impress with your hyper nationalist BS?

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Indian Tax payers or Pakistani? I am pretty sure we spent lot more tax payers money than what pakistan did, and raja sahab didnt even offer $1Million donation like mr president. :(

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

in what way pal, do you think I subscribe to the 'Aaa bail, muje maar' theory. I dont and neither do I have a death wish...

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

convert to what? I am a secular Indian Muslim and see no reason to change or convert. I believe that all religions are equal and personal. (I dont happen to be a big fan of organized religion by the way, but I respect another individuals right to practice his / her religion the way they see fit)

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

No he would have been an ex PM, and our FM or anyone else in govt would not have been obliged to meet and greet him. Mush has visited India on a couple of occasions as ex Prez and no one from Govt sees the need to meet him, same with ex US Presidents such as Clinton and Carter who visit India often on Private visits. In their case our Govt need not meet them officially but does so out of respect and friendship. I'm sure Kurshid had better things to do than have to fly to Jaipur and host a freeloader to lunch yesterday.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Convert to what? lol. Convert to whatever religion that your fellow Indians dont associate with Pakistan. Why even bother with the formality of declaring yourself a Muslim.

If you were a Hindu i suppose, you wouldnt be associated with Muslims in pakistan... Its a win win for everyone. You dont have to associate with us, and we wont have to associate with you... :)

The problem isnt with u and Pakistan, its between you and other Indians not accepting you as an Indian. That they associate everything that Pakistan does with you, is not Pakistans fault, its your fellow Indians. Your just to brainwashed to put the blame where it belongs. As far as me and most Pakistanis are concerned, you could pray to the moon god for all anyone cares. As long as you get of Kashmir, you can do what you like.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Yeah, well kudos to your govt for understanding that good relations require that you meet a visiting PM. But your logic is still as idiotic as before.

If Raja saab is resonsible for the deaths of your soldiers (which he isnt, your soldiers started it), then he would be equally culpable after he is out of office.

Is hurling abuse at Pakistan your way of proving to your fellow Indians that your an Indian AFTER ALL, despite your religion?

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer…all’s well at home

By the way, for a Secular Indian Muslim who wants nothing to do with Pakistan, I hope you realize you have actually registered to post on a PAKISTANI forum…

So you signed on to a PAKISTANI forum just to tell Pakistanis you want nothing to do with them… :hehe:
Or did your righteous fury get the better of you, so you decided where better to vent then on the internet where you can stay anonymous and post whatever bs you like.

We got the message. Thanks.

Now please realize, we want nothing to do with you either, and so thank you for visiting us.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home


what do you mean it hasn't been proven? are you waiting for a video tape and photographs? the army and foreign office said that they did not possess the head of one of the soldiers after recovering the bodies...i don't know how much clearer they could have been. these are official statements from the highest authorities, not a random media report. if you believe that it's a grand lie then might as well question whether or not any soldiers were killed in the first place. pakistan did not acknowledge killing any soldiers (let alone beheading) so from your perspective there is actually no proof of soldiers being killed at all.

i don't know why it's hard to believe. pakistan has done it before (most notably during kargil). frankly india has probably done it too.

[quote]
Now i dont see how this could possibly reflect well on this so called Shrine chief at all. Lest he forget, Indian soldiers actually initiated the supposed aggression, and more Pakistani soldiers ended up dying then Indian. So for anyone to support this moronic chief, in my eyes at least, belittles the deaths of those Pakistani soldiers as somehow less worthy then their Indian counter parts.
[/quote]
the uproar was never about deaths so this is an irrelevant point. indian soldiers have been killed by pakistan in similar border firings regularly for decades and nobody ever cares or protests. life is cheap in india. the reaction was entirely a function of the beheading/mutilation which is rightly seen as a different category of offense.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Well, first of all, we havent seen any evidence of any soldeir with his head cut off. And if he exists, then it would still remain to be proven that a Pakistani soldier committed the deed. As you yourselves claim, there are militants all along the LOC just waiting to get their hands on an Indian. Did India admit to killing Pakistans Soldiers? Obviously someone killed someone. Beheading is a bit much. Seems to follow the narrative of other Indian prejudices in the context of Pakistan, you know, the one about all Pakistanis being extremists, being taught to shoot anything that moves and blow up anything they cant. Im sorry if im a bit skeptical of Indian accounts. You can believe Indian narratives if you like, but i havent seen anything of India that gives them any added credibility.

I dont say its impossible, i say its highly unlikely. If there is evidence, why should India not provide it? I would be first to demand punishment for who ever committed the act, but without any evidence, i dont see why we should just simply assume Indian accounts are accurate. Now you could assume they dont make it public out of respect, but then again, thats still an assumption.

Exactly, life is cheap on both sides of the border, and so the issue seems to be blown out of proportion. The Indian media and some of your intelligentsia latched on to this issue and sensationalized the entire thing. Its an election year over there apparently. The accusation of beheading can be read within this context. A means of making it into a bigger issue then it is. What better way to shock the public then by demonizing the big bad Pakistani bogey man.

Lets have evidence, show it to the world, lets punish the culprit. But if India isnt going to give evidence, isnt going to go after the culprit themselves, then we can either assume it never happened or Indians are simply nice enough to drop it..

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home


expecting some sort of display of the mutilated bodies and photographic evidence is just insane. surprised to see you think this would be even a remote possibility. even if it was, pakistan denies the killings entirely...so to whom is the evidence to be presented and for what? such a display didn't happen during kargil with capt. saurabh kalia which was an indisputable case and far more gruesome. again i don't understand how this is difficult to believe...it's not the case of one "narrative" vs. another. it's a binary proposition: head or no head.

[quote]
Exactly, life is cheap on both sides of the border, and so the issue seems to be blown out of proportion. The Indian media and some of your intelligentsia latched on to this issue and sensationalized the entire thing. Its an election year over there apparently. The accusation of beheading can be read within this context. A means of making it into a bigger issue then it is. What better way to shock the public then by demonizing the big bad Pakistani bogey man.
[/QUOTE]
whether it was blown out of proportion is a different matter. it's also easy for you to say it was but the context in india is post-26/11 without retaliation. your reading of this is an election year issue is just wrong - elections were mostly finished very early in 2012 and there is nothing special about the handful of 2013 state assembly elections. more importantly it was not utilized in any meaningful way by politicians. you are speculating about what might theoretically make sense - the problem is that it's just not what happened. in reality it was politically damaging to the ruling administration's peace-at-all-costs approach to pakistan and was very embarrassing for manmohan singh. in fact, they had every incentive to lie and say there was no beheading...not to lie and say there was.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Well, at the end of the day, you cannot expect justice if you dont present evidence. The Pakistani side denies it. In fact, the suggestion was made to appoint a neutral third party to ascertain the actual facts on the ground. Now im fairly certain a neutral third party would be able to decipher between a body with and one without a head, so you wouldnt need to advertize it to the world. But we are made to believe that the Indian narrative is accurate, your premise is based on the Indian narrative being the true, yet India seems to have refused a third party investigation. Even if nothing comes of it, at the very least, Indian position is vindicated. If they are now trying to hide the truth of the matter, well that makes no sense either, as they have already made the accusations.

Perhaps your right about India post 26/11. But hyper aggressive nationalism isnt a recent development post 26/11, its simply that now it has a voice in your many cable networks. Where before this sort of goading of the public was limited now its perfused.

So, post 26/11. I dont think it justifies anything, hurt feelings arent a rare commodity in Indo-Pak relations. if you can point to such and such as rational, we can quote numerous examples of our own. For some reason, we don't seem to share in the acrimony that the Indians as a nation display toward us. For all the faults faults of the Pakistanis, you do not get this level of vitriol towards Indians, Zahid Hameed, a clown by most standards notwithstanding.

I doubt this could have ever helped the ruling govt, as it happened under there watch but then there is the opposition. And peace at all cost would have meant far more then a few platitudes. So if this is what you call "peace at all costs" I would hate to see what your real hawks are like. I should think the motives of the govt arent always clear. Perhaps they felt demonizing the Pakistanis would take attention of other issues, such as the economy? Election time or not, its not unheard of for a govt to try to divert attention from news that isnt all that palatable. i don't know, but until there is an actual investigation, its hearsay.

At the end of the day, both sides lost men. If Indians are upset, then so are we, but we understand it with in the context of the conflict. Such is the state of affairs. and thats why the Indian reaction is over the top. It does not acknowledge its own role in what happened and adopts victim status for itself.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Thats were you are wrong, there are millions of Indian Muslims and what you do in our country affects us all out of association, what you do in your country is your problem and does not interest us.

Re: Raja rental off to Ajmer....all's well at home

Well, this would not be a forum if there wasnt a counter view, would it. and what good would a forum which discusses India be without Indians on board. (Not that this forum only discusses India, but a good portion of the topics here do)