QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

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@jan leva

aawwwww, magarmuch ki ankh main ansooo

Practice so based on flawed logic and self torture CANNOT and SHOULD not be part of Islam... which is the reason why:

Prophet never did it... he had numerous oppurtunities to do so during his life time.

so all these things stsrted after about 300 years after karbala...these things have nothing to do with ahle-baits or imams..believe me..this is also written in shia historical references.... Ali never did it... same as above. Sahaba never did it... same as above! Tab'eeen never did it... Taba-tab'een never did it....

So, if none of the AUTHORITIVE people in Islam did this satanic ritual, where did the shias get it from? These same people who "cry" and "moan" and "mourn" and "beat themselves" and "cut themselves" and "cut their kids" and "spill blood" and "spill blood of their kids" were WATCHING while Hazrat Hussain and people with him were killed and murdered by cold blood killers and I hope those who WATCHED and THOSE who LIED to get Hazrat Hussain to come to Karbala (kufa people) burn in hell forever along with those who killed family members of the Prophet.

Brother believe me...no one had done this matam ...it was made *compulsory **by a shia ruler *"Muizzu-ud-dola" in 351 higri **when he took the control over baghdad..and he ordered that all women should come ot with thier faces black..with thier hairs open...and tearing thier shirts and shouting hussain, hussain....

in 352 higri..he ordered on 18 zilhajj **to close all the markets and decorated them to celeberate the **martyrdom of usman(ra) and celebrate Eid Ghadeer Khum... no one ever celeberated it before...

This person was the one who also written , for the first time in history , on the main gate of jamia mosque baghdad..the curse on 3 caliphs and muavia(ra) ......

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@Jan leva

There was no conflict between sahaba, nor were there any conflict between Abu Bakr, Ali, Usman and umer. It is something which was created out of Karabal event by the followers of Abdullah bin saba to keep muslims spinning in circle forever and they keep inventing new ways to celebrate matam and shia days each year...

I do not agree with you 100% but 200%..!!!!!

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@little human

Referring specifically to I Hussain a.s.

"Husain a.s. is from me and I am from Hussain a.s." Musnad Ahmad ibn Hanbal Vol 4, P172

Matam is done because of grief - what the muslims did to the family of the Prophet [Pbuh and on his family].

very beatiful saying ..who denies that ..but himself hussain(ra) forbade the zainab(ra) to weep loudly..now tell me which person you exactly follow ...????

the love of fatima(ra) , ali(ra) , hassan(ra) and hussain(ra) is due to its linkage **to prophet(pbuh) ... if prophet(pbuh) was not there ..then you still love these persons as much as you today love them ...certainly not ....so the most important thing is prophet(pbuh) and **everything related **to prophet(pbuh) then becomes dear so neglecting the sayings of prophet(pbuh) himself and then saying that we do it for love...what a kind of love is this ????????**

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@little human

QURAN

"Say: I do not ask of you any reward for it but love for my near relatives; and whoever earns good, We give him more of good therein..." (42:23)

Prophet Mohammad pbuh asked for nothing but that the ummah loves his near relatives. khatemul Nabageen said this. His rutba is above all mankind and he asked for NOTHING but love for his near relatives.

alhumdullilah..... i have never seen such a man who never loved or disrespect these bleesed people ..we all love them to the core of our heart...all 3 caliphs also did the same thing and the scholarships(wazeefa) of hassan , hussain and ali(ra) were the greatest of all...even greater then the **ashab-e-badars **in all 3 caliphs...they all had a great share **in mal-e-ghanimat **also they not took part in battles...ali(ra) got a woman from **banu hanifa **in **abu bakr(ra) **period from which the great personality of islam and son of ali(ra) **muhammad bin hanifa **born..... umar(ra) gave the **princess of persia , **sherbano to hussain(ra) ....

brother tell me from history... who ever denied thier love and respect....

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@y2k_zaid

You kind a crazy person .. Who told you Shia don't believe on Allah and We don't ask forgiveness from Allah. We all do but we have strong faith on Tawasal of Muhammad e Mustafa - Ali e Murtaza - Fatima e Zehara .. Hasan e Mujtaba and Hussain Mazloom e Karbala

Yaar plz..do not name the word Tawassul... it is far far thing as compare to which you believe about ali(ra) and 12 imams...in tawassul there is no concept that the person or wali himself do anythig...each and everything is done by allah...but yes sometimes the **means **will become a wali , or a person alive or allah can do the work himself wothout any mean ... as he is Qadir on everything....

but brother ..tell me why you need a tawassul as your imams are so high that it is useless to ask for tawasuullas they can do everything on thier own account ....then what a need for tawassul.......just have a bird eye view !!!!

1.'All the Imams are infallible just like the prophets. The Shi'ites derive their religion from their immaculate Imams" *(Ibid, p. 22) *

2.By listening to the voice of a person, the Imams can tell if the person was destined to go to hell or to heaven; they would thus answer his questions accordingly" *(Usool al Kafi, p. 185) *

3.The Imams possess all the knowledge granted to angels, prophets and messengers" (Al-Kulaini, Al-kaafi, p.255.)

4.The Imams know when they will die, and they do not die except by their own choice" (Ibid, p: 258.)

5.The Imams have knowledge of whatever occurred in the past and whatever will happen in the future, and nothing is concealed from them" *(Ibid, p. 260.) *

6.The Imams have knowledge of all the revealed books, regardless of the languages in which they were revealed" *(Ibid, p. 227.) *

7.No one compiled the Qur'an completely except the Imams, and they encompass all of its knowledge' *(Ibid, p. 228) *

8.Signs of the prophets are possessed by the Imams" (*Ibid, p. 231.) *

9.When the Imams' time comes, they will rule in accordance with the ruling of the prophet David and his dynasty. These Imams will not need to ask for presentation of evidence before passing their judgments" *(Ibid,p. 397.) *
There is not a single truth possessed by a people save that which originated with the Imams, and everything which did not proceed from them is false" (Ibid, p.277.)

10.The Hujjat (Ultimate proof) of God can not be established without Imam. (Al Kafi, Vol. No. 1, Page No. 177)

11.Imam posses more attribute than a Prophet posses. (Al-Kafi, Vol. No. 1, Page No. 388)

12.All Imams are equal in rank and status to Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s). (Al Kafi, Vol. No. 1, Page No. 270)

13.No one possess complete knowledge of Holy Qur'an except Imams. (Al Kafi, Vol. No. 1, Page No. 228

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

now tell me ...is thier any need of tawwassul...mairai bhai everything your imams can do by a direct linkage !!!!!

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@jan leva

Don't bring Ali to the level of God. He was a HUMAN, he went to bathroom, he slept, he ate, he passed gas, he had morning breath, he is no longer with us, he is D E A D. He had no special powers, he was not even a prophet. You are bringing him to the level above the prophet and next to God... isn't that what Abdullah bin sabah did as well?

I 100% agree with you....infact when ali(ra) died and news came to ibne saba he said

" If someone brought 70 pieces of his body and 70 people saw him dead... i will not consider him dead as he cannot die until he rule the whole universe*.....(Farqu-us-shia by Nobakhti pg.43 ,44 printed in najaf , iraq...1959)*

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

And status of this shia scholar **nobakhti **is so **graet **that some other shia scholars write that;

1.Nobakhthi was a great scholar of ilm-e-kalam, philosophy and true shia believer....(Fahrish-ut-tussi pg.98 india ..1835)

2.Nobakhti was a great scholar of shia*.(alfaharist -al- najjashi pg.47 india 1317 hijri)*

3. nobakhi was great ilme kalam scholar ..the greats of shia religion and philosohy*....(Majalis-ul-momineen by Noor-allah-tustri pg.177 iran)*

and this same man , **nobakhti **writes in his book:

"""""""ibne saba **was a man who started **curse **on abu bakr, umar and usman(ra) and he said that ali(ra) ordered him to do this...when the news reached to ali(ra)...ali(ra) ordered him to arrest and when he brought to ali(ra) he accepted his crime .Ali(ra) instantly ordered that to kill ibne saba ...but the army men of ali(ra) which were mostly **iraqis and kufis started **shouting how can you kill a lover of ahle-bait ..so ali(ra) was **compelled **to expell ibne saba to **madyan...a city which is now about 40 km. of present day baghdad*.....(Farq-s-shia by Nobakhti)*

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

Infact you read above all great scholars saying the nobakhti **was a graeat **philosopher...this is the real point of consideration....

      The ancient concept of **sassanid empire **that the **ruler **is a God in the **human form**...godman...**Halooliat**...and this concept was also in **unani(greek) **philosophy of hundreds of **gods **and  **godesses **... like **cupid...pluto...mercury... hercules** ...so when in **Mamoon-ur-rasheed **period the greek books **translated **in arabic,,there was a great influence of greek philosophy on **arab literature **...and to some people it was so great that all we see about **ali(ra) **...his **super natural **characteristics...made of **noor**....after god and muhammad(pbuh) he was the **third one**... can do anything... leader of **jannah **and **hell **etc etc.......

        All these things are the same **complex theories **of philosophy which are the **favourites **subjects still today in great univeriteis of iran like **hauza-ilmia in Qum** and Najaf etc...the same **Dilemma of philosophy **..**logic **and **brain teasing **concepts of some irani sufia like **Mansur bin Hallag and Ibne Arabi** **....Wahtat-ul-Wujood.....Hama ooost** ......etc...etc  .....


            A ll are the gifts of the same philosophical speeches and debates  which are originally having roots in ancient **persian **and **greek **empires........

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@Y2k_zaid

Array yaar tu bilkul hi farig hoo ..

Imam was chosen by Allah ---- it is selection not election by folks like U

Who selected them ???? in in quran and hadees ... a single verse come in this reference...totally wrong and folks...

Ibne saba was the first **person who said ali(ra) is the **wasi and wali **of muhammad(pbuh) just as **yushaw bin noon **was a wasi **of moosa(as).....
(Rigal-Kashi ... pg.101 printed in karbala,iraq. )

and this rigal is so great scholar that shia scholars consider him **authority **on the shiaism.

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

So you all shias follow the thing which was first started **by the ibne saba as accepted by thier great scholar ..Kashi **

[khanbabax]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@Ripper

I am in fact refering to the ayats of the Holy Book. Now since, as you are asserting, that wives of the Holy Prophet (s) are also part of the Ahle Bayt they must be also free from sin. Am i right? correct me if I am wrong and then we will proceed.

How many times you want me to answer? I said only Prophet are masoom and infallable.

[Ripper]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@Iconoclast

Rasoolullaah saw approved of the love of Hz Awais but not the action. Had he approved of his action we would have seen other Sahaba following the action of Hz Awais, but we do not read of any other Sahabi who did the same. Hence its quite logical to conclude that this act of Hz Awais Qarni cannot be taken as example to be followed by ordinary people like us.

Really I am amazed! The Holy Prophet (s) when informed of the brutal act said : 'He is indeed our devoted friend'. This explicity points the approbation of the Prophet (s). Hz Ali a.s. not following the example of Awais r.a. karni itself does not invalidate the latter's case. Really, that would not hold up in any court of law. Please some sanity has to prevail.

[Sheraz_CT]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

ripper try ignoring the ignorant fools...they won't learn anything...they are not here to learn....i know its pretty hard thing to do but we should pray for everyone

[system]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@sheraz CT

ripper try ignoring the ignorant fools...they won't learn anything...they are not here to learn....i know its pretty hard thing to do but we should pray for everyone

When truth strikes against falsehood......falsehood perish ,for falsehood by its nature, bound to perish(al-quran)...

[Ma_Mooli]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

Folks, im sure you know that this thread was opened for anything but to seek answers to the Q. im not sure why some of you are rising to such obvious bait, but the more attention you pay these folks, the more fodder they have to go on. if i were you, i'd leave it be. They're not really worth you're time.

[khanbabax]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

Ok what do Shias think of Ummul Mumineed Hazrat Aisha r.a?
Do you guys accuse of her adultry?

How many daughters did Prophet s.a.w had?
Why are those daughters not part of the household?

[Sheraz_CT]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@khanbabax

Ok what do Shias think of Ummul Mumineed Hazrat Aisha r.a? Do you guys accuse of her adultry?

How many daughters did Prophet s.a.w had? Why are those daughters not part of the household?

whats ur deal? who told you we accuse her of adultry? thats absolutely not true....Quran told her to stay at home yet she went out and fought our first Imam (a.s.)..khalifa of the time....you know all about it..what else do you want to know?

i think i showed u a hadith from two of your sahih sittah and it clearly tells you who the ahle bait are...it even gives you the names of those 4 people...Quran talks about them as well

[Kaka_MaNNa]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

So, rest of the people are not the BLOOD of the prophet?

Shiraz, is your wife not part of your family? What about if you have kids?

Quran talks about them... post the verses, buddy.

Hazrat Aishah's protest with Hazrat Ali was for the right reasons: Catch the damn criminals that killed Hazrat Usman... is that unfair to ask?

[khanbabax]

Re: QUESTIONS TO A SHIA

@Sheraz CT

whats ur deal? who told you we accuse her of adultry? thats absolutely not true....Quran told her to stay at home yet she went out and fought our first Imam (a.s.)..khalifa of the time....you know all about it..what else do you want to know?

i think i showed u a hadith from two of your sahih sittah and it clearly tells you who the ahle bait are...it even gives you the names of those 4 people...Quran talks about them as well

I showed you an ayat of the Quran where wives of Prophet s.a.w are referred as Ahal bayat, now do you accept this ayat of the Quran or deny it? As far as the hadees, Sunnis dont deny it and we considere all of them to be part of AhAL Bayat.

So tel me, if your wive (if you are married) part of your household? Or let say your mother part of the household of your father, or only son in law, daughter and grandsons are part of his Ahal Bayat?

Shia defination of Ahal Bayat is against the Quran, logic and dictionary.