None of the attacks you listed targeted a particular group for their faith. You combine the state persecution with these attacks and it is hard to blame Ahmedis for "overplaying" their situation.
Shias were targetted specifically for their faith.
There have also been attacks against some sunni groups due to their faith alone. For example, the blast in the ijtema of Sunni Tehrik in Karachi. This attack wiped out the whole top leadership of Sunni Tehrik.
You know that for a fact? You think Amir Liaqut, among many others, who sanction the murder of Ahmadis are also murdering Sunnis and Shias? Many of those people who consider killing Ahmadis as being Islam sanctioned, have no record of ever having attacked any other community.
Its this endorsemnt by TV "pundits," and the govts own recognition of this discrimination as legal and valid which promotes violence.
I don't know about any TV pundit endorsing killing of anyone. May be some did. And if they did then they should be condemned.
But people who go and commit violence are the ones who actually need to be stopped and punished. Such people are the root cause of this terrorism.
Hence Mirzai attempts to link 2nd amendment with this massacre make no sense.
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You have such a two dimensional mind Khoji...
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Well, your three-dimensional mind does not seem to help you anyway.
Khoji Bhai Sahib, I agree that simply making Laws will not help if no one follows them................
But using America as an example will not work either.............their solution for minorities is putting them in "Reservations".............you know all the Indian Reservations...............that is an Original American solution!
seems to be working for over hundred years now!
Do you think it will work in Pakistan too?
You mean quota system?
There are some good points about this system and some bad points. Depends on where you are coming from.
I am not sure if America actually follows this system in general. They have it implemented in very few areas.
Ok lets say it is true for the sake of your argument that Ahmadis are using this incident as an excuse against the 2nd amendment even though the amendment had nothing to do with the attacks.
bas itni si baat pooray thread mai kisi ko samajh mai nahi ayee, I congratulate you to be the only one getting the topic everyone else seems to be beating about the bush.
bas itni si baat pooray thread mai kisi ko samajh mai nahi ayee, I congratulate you to be the only one getting the topic everyone else seems to be beating about the bush.
Did you read my entire post?
Re: Qadianis use Lahore massacre as excuse against 2nd amendment
I agree that ahmedis might be using the sad mishap to highlight the need for change in the constitution. I do think this is not the right time to raise the issue at a time when Pakistan already is going through so many other threats, negative propaganda. Maybe they could have talked to the government about this issue privately or not create much hype because int he end it is more of negative hype for the country serving those who want to benefit from it.
On the other hand, maybe ahmedis should discuss their concern privately with authorities.
One thing I do not understand though is how does the 2nd consitution make it discriminatory for ahmedis more than other minorities? Could the reason Pak government had to make this a part of the constitution because ahmedis have been used in the past by the anti pakistan elements against the state? I dont understand why they would have to include a seperate clause related to ahmedis alone? Are those rumours of ahmedis conspiring with anti Pakistan elements have any truth to them??? Im just wondering now.
Re: Qadianis use Lahore massacre as excuse against 2nd amendment
There is a related news.
IG Punjab gets move over to Grade 22
Re: Qadianis use Lahore massacre as excuse against 2nd amendment
^^ How is it related to the topic? I dont understand?
On the other hand, maybe ahmedis should discuss their concern privately with authorities.
One thing I do not understand though is how does the 2nd consitution make it discriminatory for ahmedis more than other minorities? Could the reason Pak government had to make this a part of the constitution because ahmedis have been used in the past by the anti pakistan elements against the state? I dont understand why they would have to include a seperate clause related to ahmedis alone? Are those rumours of ahmedis conspiring with anti Pakistan elements have any truth to them??? Im just wondering now.
Are you HIGH? Privately discuss with the government? The same government who caters to the Islamic Parties and their allies, whose votes they count on to stay in power? Do you think Ahmadis sit idly in Pakistan, not doing anything to advance their rights? When all facets of government from local to provincial to federal consider anything having to do with Ahmadis taboo and uncomfortable, how do you suppose we have these discussions?
Can you let me know when anti Pakistan movements have made use of Ahmadis against the state of Pakistan?
Dont make assumptions about something you have no knowledge over. Please research how much Ahmadis have contributed to the formation of Pakistan. Please read about Mizra Bashirudin Ahmad and Chaudary Zafrullah Khan and their contributions to Pakistan.
This is a forum filled with anti Ahamdi sentiments, so please do your research elsewhere. Please do some scholarly research, and use facts in your arguments next time. Hearsay and assumptions cant get one very far.
Re: Qadianis use Lahore massacre as excuse against 2nd amendment
^^ heyhey, relax, I was just asking a question. I wish to know why this seperate clause in Pakistan's consitution for ahmedis alone? What is so different about this clause & other minorities? Can you answer?
Reading post number 52 below, I have edited my post as it answers my question:
qadianis are serving in israeli defence forces.what for???? spreading terror in Pakistan
Are you HIGH? Privately discuss with the government? The same government who caters to the Islamic Parties and their allies, whose votes they count on to stay in power? Do you think Ahmadis sit idly in Pakistan, not doing anything to advance their rights? When all facets of government from local to provincial to federal consider anything having to do with Ahmadis taboo and uncomfortable, how do you suppose we have these discussions?
Can you let me know when anti Pakistan movements have made use of Ahmadis against the state of Pakistan?
Dont make assumptions about something you have no knowledge over. Please research how much Ahmadis have contributed to the formation of Pakistan. Please read about Mizra Bashirudin Ahmad and Chaudary Zafrullah Khan and their contributions to Pakistan.
This is a forum filled with anti Ahamdi sentiments, so please do your research elsewhere. Please do some scholarly research, and use facts in your arguments next time. Hearsay and assumptions cant get one very far.
qadianis are serving in israeli defence forces.what for????
spreading terror in Pakistan
Re: Qadianis use Lahore massacre as excuse against 2nd amendment
^^ sadly they closed your thread .... and i could nt agree with you more ma frend.
bringing a change in constitution is not a joke.we are not rogue state.we have laws here.2/3 majority is required and above that 170 million muslims.
^^ sadly they closed your thread .... and i could nt agree with you more ma frend.
thankyou
"when truth is heard against falsehood ,falsehood perishes for falsehood is by its nature bound to perish."
Quran
thankyou
"when truth is heard against falsehood ,falsehood perishes for falsehood is by its nature bound to perish." Quran
Sada Qallah hul Azeem.
Did you read my entire post?
Rest of your post was related to other threads found on the forum.
Re: Qadianis use Lahore massacre as excuse against 2nd amendment
Ok, though I donnot support 2nd amendment but 2nd amendment is not the cause of this attacks. Talibans have attacked, shias, sunni, christians, hindus, women, children, schools, hospitals, recreation places, etc. Their hate and barbaric actions are not targeted to a certain group of people only but everyone despite of race, religion, ethnic group, gender, status, etc.
Yes, state has no right to decide who qualifies to be a Muslim and who doesn't. The 2nd amendment should be repeal even if these attacks hadn't taken place but more importantly our country needs to find a way to bring an end this talibanism/jihadisim.
Well there is no dearth of individuals who claim murdering Ahmadis is sanctioned in Islam…
The most famous recent example is Amir Liaquet..
Now my point was in regards to your statement that those saying the killing of Ahmadi’s is sanctioned by Islam, have no compulsion in killing others aswell. Yet Mr. Liaquet and many others like him have never been known to attack or mureder anyone else. He targeted Ahmadis specifically…
Another words, those who call for the murder of Ahmadis are not you run of the mill terrorists, but average idiots of the street. This mentality is common in Pakistan.
And the sad fact is that no one will ever punish Amir Liaquet or anyone else who calls for the murder of Ahmadis.
And honeslty man, im still wondering what the point is of opening this idiotic thread.
You have still to prove to me that the 2nd amendment is not a violation of Jinnahs own statements. Did your balls fall off, or do you honestly not have a reply?
I agree that ahmedis might be using the sad mishap to highlight the need for change in the constitution. I do think this is not the right time to raise the issue at a time when Pakistan already is going through so many other threats, negative propaganda. Maybe they could have talked to the government about this issue privately or not create much hype because int he end it is more of negative hype for the country serving those who want to benefit from it.
On the other hand, maybe ahmedis should discuss their concern privately with authorities.
One thing I do not understand though is how does the 2nd consitution make it discriminatory for ahmedis more than other minorities? Could the reason Pak government had to make this a part of the constitution because ahmedis have been used in the past by the anti pakistan elements against the state? I dont understand why they would have to include a seperate clause related to ahmedis alone? Are those rumours of ahmedis conspiring with anti Pakistan elements have any truth to them??? Im just wondering now.
Why should we have any clause at all that pertains to any religion? Like I was discussing with Khoji earlier, the 2nd amendment is a clear violation of the principles of which Pakistan was founded.
Besides this, the 2nd amendment does little but to sanction discrimination. There is no point to the law.
I mean why do we need the govt to declare anyone non Muslim? If the our esteemed Ulema have already made such a distinction, why then is the govts stamp needed? The govt is supposed to make sure we have education, basic infrastructure. They can barely keep street lights functioning, and now we look to them for the sake off religious affirmation?!?!
And the reason I believe they raised the issue now is because its times like these that people are reminded of their 2nd class status in society. Its understandable that after this huge attack, they should want to have their status changed, even if its only a cosmetic issue.
I’ve explained this in other posts, but I’ll summarize here too.
To put it bluntly, it was entirely an opportunistic move. The parties that actively supported the violence against Ahmadis and the anti-Ahmadi laws were the Jamaat-e-Islami and the Majlis-e-Ahrar. Both groups had vehemently opposed the Muslim League and creation of Pakistan, but moved their operations over to Pakistan after Partition anyways. However, because of their fierce opposition to Pakistan Movement, they did not have much of a political foothold in the country. The Muslim League was still very popular, and people were wary of parties that had spent the past several years calling Jinnah Kafir-e-Azam, and cursing Pakistan.
The Ahrar and the JeI needed some ploy to build up popular support in Pakistan. In Pakistan, as in many other Muslim countries, nothing mobilizes the masses like calls of Islam being in danger. Ahmadis were a convenient target - a small but very visible minority, with distinctly unorthodox views. They were well-educated, and tended to be well represented in the new government bureaucracy and military.
Inciting common hatred for a small, affluent minority has long been a common ploy for building up popular support. It’s why the Nazis targeted European Jews, why Idi Amin targeted (and ultimatelly expelled) the Indian/Pakistani community in Uganda, and (closer to home) why Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, in an effort to build up support in a nation fresh out of civil war, played up tensions between “ethnic Pakistanis” (esp. Sindhis) and immigrants from India.
Are they also spreading terror in Pakistan? Do you support a constitutional amendment against Sunnis now?