Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
LOL. Hope that made you feel happy.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
sala punzabi bohat jada pani pita haey :)
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
the thread's on the verge of being closed...
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
No one wants to discuss the water issue?
Can anyone tell me why Thal canal is good when it turns deserts in Punjab into arable land, but when Sindh complains of its farms turning into desert, it's treachery? Sindh’s agriculture is struggling to survive while enough water can be found to make new farms in Punjab. How else is one supposed to interpret this but as obvious bias?
And there is a myth among Punjabis that water flowing downstream is being "wasted" This is false. Flowing water is essential for maintaining the ecological and environment health of the Indus delta and to stop the Arabian Sea from reclaiming coastal land.
And then we have the dramabazi of Kalabagh and Bhasha Dams that is bought out by Islamabad and fully backed by Punjab, despite it being the wrong thing to do at the wrong time. 60% of Pakistan’s sweet water is lost due to poor irrigation systems and canals before it can be used in agriculture. It would make sense to fix this problem before talking about expensive dams that will produce very little water for agriculture. 68 MAF water is wasted through bad irrigation, while Kalabagh will give us a maximum of 14 MAF more water for agriculture. Even from this 14 MAF, only 4.7 will be usable for agriculture, as the rest will be lost due to poor distribution. A more efficient system of irrigation that controls all this wastage would be cheaper and more beneficial over the long term. It will also not stop the free flowing water of the Indus that is needed for maintaining the ecology of coastal regions. Majority of water in Kalabagh and Bhasa dams will be used for electricity, but that can also be accomplished with a damn that allows the water to flow through downstream. Right now any storage dam on Indus will be a waste, except for Punjab who can always browbeat IRSA in releasing more water to for its use, while Sindh has very little means of doing so. Not only is environment of Sindh going to be further destroyed through such storage dams, but the water available for irrigation will be negligible. The balance of sweet water from the river system is needed for fishes and other marine life to survive in the Arabian sea, it is not a waste! Likewise, we also need to increase productivity in water usage in farms through drip and other methods before talking about dams.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
And this is why we don’t trust Punjab. It’s nothing personal against Punjabis, but your elite are stealing from us since Pakistan was created.
http://www.dawn.com/2006/03/28/local27.htm
HYDERABAD: ‘Sindh being deprived of water share’
Bureau Report
HYDERABAD, March 27: The secretary general of the Sindhu Agricultural Forum, Mr Nazeer Memon, has accused Punjab of taking away 48,000 cusecs of Indus water despite orders to the contrary by the Indus River System Authority.
In a statement issued here on Monday, he said that the theft of Sindh’s water confirms Punjab’s arbitrary attitude as to how it deprive Sindh of its water share.
He said that it strengthened Sindh’s position on the Kalabagh dam that no matter what constitutional guarantees were offered, they could not deter Punjab from stealing Sindh’s water.
He said that the supporters of Kalabagh could not read the writing on the wall that IRSA was also a constitutional forum, but it could not deter Punjab from stealing water.
He said that President Musharraf who on TV and other media offered constitutional guarantees also appeared to be helpless before Punjab.
He said that 48,000 cusecs of water taken away by Punjab should be given to Sindh and the federal government should stop Punjab from water robbery in future.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
Which is why i said that arm struggle is the only way now!
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
TMX305
The main culprits were bhutto,tikka khan , niazi , rao farman and yahya khan.Z A bhutto was sindhi ,Gen Yahya khan was born in punjab and was persian speaking, Lt Gen niazi was from mianwali, a seraiki/punjabi speaking area and he was of pashtun/afghan origin.Gen tikka khan was a punjabi.rao farman ali khan was punjabi or mohajir.bhutto was backed by the west pakistani establishment(military and civil) which had majority of punjabis.Obviously non punjabis were also part of that setup and they are also responsible who is denying this.But you wanted to know that if "any " punjabi was involved and if you somehow read the hamood ur rehman commision report you will find "many" punjabis.
It is unfortunate that events of 71 are not known by many because it is not part of our "masharatee ullom" or "mutalaey pakistan" books and people like you who only read these books dont know much.Thats why i advise you that you should read some HISTORY.
Antibol
English is the official language of pakistan.I always support regional languages read my earlier posts. urdu is the mother tongue of around 8% so for the last 59 years it is a language spoken in urban sindh
Punjab having a secular culture.I cant comment on that because at the time of partition sikhs and hindus murdered muslims.
Yeah punjabis didnot accept muhajirs and sindhi accepted them thats the difference
No language has a religion so we cant link urdu and islam.
I wanted to post something on the topic but our friends from punjab think that it is anti pakistan to comment anything on the water problem.If the smaller provinces have reservations about the water issue why dont take steps to solve the problem.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
The thatta and badin districts of sindh are in the worst condition and face severe shortage of water.
India has opposed the construction of bhasha dam as it claims that it is in the disputed area.The baghliar dam project will further increase the water shortage in pakistan
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
Amazing discussion. Stealing rather robbing of 4000 cusecs of water from Indus System has led to explore almost every incident dividing the ethnic mix in Pakistan. Did anyone notice that the issue raised has been put to back burner?
I think most of us know what lay behind the fall of Decca. Even if we believe that Wadera Bhutto abhored Mujeeb's rightful claims to rule, we know the story didnt begin in that era's (1970?) election. Its roots were far behind the scene and long-debated in previous Parliaments. Even then if some of you want to derive pleasure of bashing Bhutto, you are welcome, thats your democratic right. Let others have such rights too. If it is not the stealing and mismanaging water, why have we made so many committees? Anyways, like most of you have tried to make your points home quoting from miscellaneous historical events, I wish to give my two cents too.
If being greater in number is the sole criterion to live in federation, you never listened to it prior to 1971. Oh yes, Wadera Bhutto did all that by himself. There can be no relevance of playing Sindhi with a Pathan to hold back a Bengali from power! No, the ruling elites could not be fool. Bhutto is to be blamed.
And I am particularly amazed at a reference that Punjab's one blunder was to promote Urdu and let the urban Sindh slip in the sole hands of Muhajirs. What a fallacy making it happen and sustaining it till date and all the more a fallacy to feel for it to have been made to happen. I fail to find any wisdom in selling out someone else's plane in the first place? There was no scheme of migration when the sub continent was divided after independence. If that became inevitable, it could have been steered it in a wiser manner leaving millenia old cultures preserve their identity! Let me make it clear here that Sindh never had reservations on the settlement of Muhajirs in its urban centres until Sindhis were butchered by their permanent guests. I guess there is no other example to quote when it comes to aiding and owning Muhajirs but that of Sindh. Sindh equalled the spirit of Medinites, if not ecxelled them. 59 years later today, all policy-making is dictated by Muhajirs in Sindh. Excuse me if anyone has any reservation on this statement! So I question: One of your blunders have costed Sindhis their lives, properties, honour and right to rule. Could you repent on this?
Yeah UP Elitist can take their turn too. You mean you were the brain behind modernism and development? Karachi, Hyderabad, Shikarpur, Sukkur, Larkana and Dadu were far more developed prior to partition than they are now. Dilapidated buildings are living proof to it. Its not fair to claim your supremacy in art and culture and administration. Local expertise in building and planning and the local open-minded, assimilating, absorbing culture are admired internationally.
Coming back to Muhajirs themselves, I would just ask if they would let their guests take over the control of their homes? Sindhis did that. Call them morons for that matter or reward them with honours of being filled in love of their fellow brethern in faith, they actually surrendered their Port City to Muhajirs to make it their home and stay there in groups and feel comfortable. What's your problem with Sindhis now? Shouldnt the 65% of their elected representatives in Provincial Assembly be allowed to plan for 98% of the Rural Sector or a minority of 35% should concentrate on a couple of two cities comprising 2% of the land? Do you know that whatever developmental budget there is in the Provincial Coffers is mostly spent in Karachi? Injustice in NFC apart, the remaining sum never goes to Rural Sindh where Sindhis have been holed up! And no, we do not have any problem with speaking Urdu. Why are you biased against Sindhi? Bare statistics suggest that 98% of Sindhis can speak Urdu while less than 1% of Muhajirs can understand Sindhi, lest speak it.
Still today, there is a chance to co-exist if only we identify what divides us. Vested Interest Groups, if you depend on Political Economy themes, have to be focussed here. If a new Punjabi Agrarian Class of retired and serving army officers requires more water to irrigate their allotted lands and their demand is fulfilled come what may, the right of the end users of water to keep irrigating their lands can not be denied to them. The arrangement should never be discriminatory! If a slum in Karachi belnoging to Muhajirs has to be given the top-most importance for lease rights, similar treatment is required for Old Villages gulped by the Mega City! Think!
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
Sindhi language should be compulsory in Urban Sindh in particular and should be an optional subject in the rest of the Pakistani schools.
This is the only way to stop the hatred. It is time to move Urdu from its compulsory status to an optional one. This is a language foreign to the whole Pakistan so it should be treated as such.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
This was done some 6 months ago. Ishrat-ul-Ibad unilaterally defied to implement the decision of the cabinet and the decision died down.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
I speak as a proud Punjabi, and say that we should indeed treat all the provinces fairly, each getting its fair share of the resources.
But:
As the biggest province my population, Punjab's will is the will of the majority. This is democracy.
2) We cannot allow Sindhi's to run things, the men are too busy getting manicures and pedicures and acting like women. Perhaps Pathans would be acceptable if people really want to see Punjabis lose there (democratic majority based) grip on power, but the Pathan people are a bit dim. :)
So its US by default. :)
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
I would advise you to read about Federal structures of the State. I feel sorry for your typical mindsets.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
You know we are the majority, thus we rule by majority rule. Thats perfectly democratic.
Moreover, what typical mindset?
No one can deny that "men" from Sindh, and I really mean Karachi here-no real interaction with rural sindhis-are embaressing to the nation.
Where is the masculinity in them?
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
Punjabis ARE now the majority. Thus we rule. Thats democracy.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
^ Go back to school.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
Been and finished. Graduated from uni and start an MA this september. So there!
Listen, are we or are we not the majority ethnic group in Pakistan?
Yes or no.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
I was talking about 71.bengalis were the majority then but they were not accepted by the west pakistanis.No where in the history you will find a majority group being separated from a minority.They could have ruled the whole pakistan why bengal only
so who is ruling the country now.do you think that any government can neglect punjab???
Fine punjab is the majority with 48 to 50 % population(excluding seraiki and hindko).But the bureaucracy is 75 to 80% punjabi.Army is 90% punjabi.Is this democracy??
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
Refer to my post on page 3 of this thread. Its not the right to rule thing which we are discussing. You are deflecting the theme.
Re: Punjab gets 4,000 cusecs more water from Indus
No one wishes to see a prosperous pak more then me. But these other groups, no one stops them from joining the forces or the CI. They must apply, and want access.
I stated in my first post that all provinces should share all resources equally, according to there needs.