Re: Practicing or Appearing?
acha ziyadah ahmiat kis ki hai. jiskay darjat ziydah hian. 
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
sure dude, I am exaggerating and everyone else is sticking to the point.
Thanks for pointing that out
dil par na lain bhai, it was about that particular post.
everybody is doing this, thats why i said above, meri murghi ki aik taang
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
I am sure you are either joking or avoiding the practicality of my question.
I heard a story from Mufti Saeed, who talked about some ruler of old Russia was looking for the true religion. He asked some Molvis what I need to change to become Muslim. They gave him a long list of no pork, no wine, no adultery, this and that and what not. He asked the same to Christians who replied that nothing but to believe in Lord and Jesus. The guy with all his followers became a Christian.
When we put together a not-to/to do list in front of a non-muslim, that shows everything with the same importance, we intimidate people. Even Allah SWT did not ask prophet to have people stop drinking and ribah and all from the day one. Prophet made these things enter slowly into people's life. Our problem is that we want a new person to be momin from day one. We are not ready to give him/her a learning time.
But the question was not phrased like that response ... In your question the person had already accepted Islam. Just like with kids we do not expect them to do everything ... But clothing them is actually the most apparent and easiest ways to "feel" Muslim. Although the most vital aspect in the afterlife is for to die in Tawhid, the most effective way to ensure that is be protected in every way ... I'm not saying that we expect them to be leading prayers and giving sermons on day 1 ... But prayer has a premise ... So we teach them wudu, first by imitation, we get them to recite Shahadah, by imitation, if they want to pray we show them the adab for it ... I.e. wear clean clothes ... For a starter ...
My point was for a rookie Muslim there is a certain level of attire, sulook, and ritual expected, then each of these increase ... We don't isolate any one of these areas and focus on them.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
You can do namaz without any clothes on if you dont have any clothes to wear (condition: it should be dark and you need to be alone).
Allah did not say that oh I understand your situation, why dont you not do Namaz also because you have nothing to wear.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
jumping from namaz without hijab to praying while one is nanga patanga? 
if the hijab for woman or topi for men is available and one do it without it by choice then, it becomes issue of chosing as it pleases you not as it is commanded to you.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
As someone mentioned.
Namaaz without Hijaab/Daarhee is permitted (yes Allah may not be as happy, but still permitted).
Hijaab/Darhee without Namaaz is useless.
Ab aap logon kee marzi hai iss issue ko kitna complicated kar lain, its not going to change the definition of the foundation of Islam, which is practice and not appearance. Practice is an independent variable, appearance is a dependent variable.
Peace TLK
We never teach prayer to be done without hijab ... Prayer has the precondition of hijab, but hijab does not have the precondition of prayer ... Hijab for hijab sake will be rewarded for hijab, but if prayer is done without hijab thinking it is okay to do that ... I'm not sure this is okay at all.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
You can do namaz without any clothes on if you dont have any clothes to wear (condition: it should be dark and you need to be alone).
Allah did not say that oh I understand your situation, why dont you not do Namaz also because you have nothing to wear.
TLK ...lets agree wid u
namaaz zaroore.. apperence khuwah hijab ho ya beard ho ya mukmal dress hee ho ya sirf farz satar chupay ..is main say kuch imp nahi
namaaz kay muqablay main
acha ab app k nazdeek jub practice or apperence jo bhi farq app ker rahay hain IMP or LEss imp ka ...is ka result kia hay ?\
k ik muslman saree zindgee in less IMP cheezon ki na neyat keray na irada ..mutlub ik terah say woh yeh sooch lay coz its less imp to main kerta hee nahi
us ka imaan baaqe hai ?
ik sawal hay ..masoom say .complicated bhi nahi : P
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
See this is the problem. No matter how I show the comparison, someone has a problem with my approach.
I am just saying that in majboori, Allah has allowed to do without hijaab, but even if one is fully paralyzed, namaaz is not maaf. That shows right there what is more important.
aap logon ko baal kee khaal utaarni hai to utaarain shouq se.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
nahi ji, khaal k baal utarne hein 
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
See this is the problem. No matter how I show the comparison, someone has a problem with my approach.
I am just saying that in majboori, Allah has allowed to do without hijaab, but even if one is fully paralyzed, namaaz is not maaf. That shows right there what is more important.
aap logon ko baal kee khaal utaarni hai to utaarain shouq se.
I get your point. Some people will never though. :/
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
TLK ...lets agree wid u
namaaz zaroore.. apperence khuwah hijab ho ya beard ho ya mukmal dress hee ho ya sirf farz satar chupay ..is main say kuch imp nahi
namaaz kay muqablay main
acha ab app k nazdeek jub practice or apperence jo bhi farq app ker rahay hain IMP or LEss imp ka ...is ka result kia hay ?\
k ik muslman saree zindgee in less IMP cheezon ki na neyat keray na irada ..mutlub ik terah say woh yeh sooch lay coz its less imp to main kerta hee nahi
**us ka imaan baaqe hai ?
ik sawal hay ..masoom say .complicated bhi nahi : **P
That is another issue. But yes eeman baaqee hai. Aap or main kon hotai hain yeah kehne waalay ke baghair darhee walas shaks, ya baghair hijaab wali aurat, jo namazi hai, oss ka eeman baqi nahi
I am giving you a gift for your birthday. Gift is more important than wrapping paper. But out of love and respect, I buy a beautiful wrapper and warp the gift in that and buy ribbons and cards and all too. None of the stuff can replace the original gift and gift is more important than the packaging.
So yes, we can all pray ke iss shaks ke dil main allah aur rasool kee mohabbat aur barhay, lekin to think ke oss ke pass eeman nahi is little awkward.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
Not keeping beard and offering Namaz without hijab is ok if done unknowingly (about its importance). But if done knowingly and consistently for a long time, it becomes gunnah-e-kabira.
We don't know which night is our last. If we have already been practicing it 'knowingly' for quite sometime now, better to stop taking this risk further, before its too late for correction. Then the angels won't let us come back.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
thank you : )
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
Hijab is a fard ... And it is part of the Salat pillar ... Khimar or how hijab is interpreted is a fiqh matter ... And we should not introduce extremes, or exception rulings to demonstrate this topic because it will cause confusion.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
Namaz without hijab/beard is ok if done unknowingly. But if done knowingly and consistently for a long time, it becomes gunnah-e-kabira.
We don't know which night is our last. If we have already been practicing it 'knowingly' for quite sometime now, better to stop taking this risk further, before its too late for correction. Then the angels won't let us come back.
Where do you get this stuff from?
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
I get your point. Some people will never though. :/
TLK bhai made the same point what he had made earlier which I had agreed to in my first ever post here. But this is like back to sqaure one.
If one does not have anything to wear, salah is still fard and can be performed without wearing any clothing. That is a conditional matter where clothes are unavailable at all. But you can not apply circumstancial conditions to normal daily behavior and say that since it is allowed to pray while being nanga patanga, I can still pray without clothes as appearance is not important but my prayer is.
You see the problem here?
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
Hijab is a fard ... And it is part of the Salat pillar ... Khimar or how hijab is interpreted is a fiqh matter ... And we should not introduce extremes, or exception rulings to demonstrate this topic because it will cause confusion.
Why don't you argue with RAW? he said praying namaz without beard is gunnah kabirah.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
BUNCH OF PROUD AND JUDGMENTAL PEOPLE...ACTING AS GOD.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
See this is the problem. No matter how I show the comparison, someone has a problem with my approach.
I am just saying that in majboori, Allah has allowed to do without hijaab, but even if one is fully paralyzed, namaaz is not maaf. That shows right there what is more important.
aap logon ko baal kee khaal utaarni hai to utaarain shouq se.
Peace again TLK
You see we can't use that argument ... We know that Salat is more important than Fasting, but for a woman who has periods the Salat is maaf, but the Fast is not ...
I'm trying to explain we can't isolate things through rulings of fiqh and start concluding what is more or less important.
Re: Practicing or Appearing?
selective reading all around the thread, makes me laugh. everyone picking one line or one sentence of their choice and bashing others with that : D lagay raho