Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

[X2]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

btw…there is a lot of asinine comments I read about how someone would not be bothered to do ‘menial jobs’ in Pakistan but is glad to do it in other countries, or that someone will not want to respect rules in Pakistan but will do so in other countries

so lets take the issue of this ‘menial job’ business

1- lack of stigma…or less social stigma
2- its often means to an end…
3- its not the same individual, the individual who has the drive to work 16 hour days at a gas station or fast food joint and go through school and finish and succeed or save enough to start his own business…however small or large it may be…is NOT..the same person who chose to not attempt to do that

now to talk about rules, much simpler

1- societal expectations…you are expected to obey the rules..varying acceptance to not doing so in various countries
2- laws are enforced
3- the individual observing is usually is a person who would try to observe rules everywhere

[Sheeda_Pistol_1]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@X2

PS: can pakistanis not use the term cojones especially if they can’t spell it right… and just use the term tattaay …shukriya…I mean Gracias

made me chuckle

[khattichic]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@X2

cojones amigo…cojones grande’

yes…accepting is the first step…for everyone involved

PS: can pakistanis not use the term cojones especially if they can’t spell it right… and just use the term tattaay …shukriya…I mean Gracias

[Jolie]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

These types of debates are getting ugly and outlandish. I couldn’t care less about what someone decided to write in their blog, sometimes we all just need a good old vent and this is exactly what I the gentleman was aiming for, too bad he wrote the disclaimer right at the end. Other than that, I would like see Pakistani media, in fact a proper journalist addressing the strengths, weakness and limitations of the overseas Pakistani’s contributions in a proper and composed manner. It’s okay to have this debate, let’s cut the chase and spell out the do’s and don’ts, the good and the bad and separate disdain from discourse. Between the two extremes of “Yes I know everything” and “no you have no idea”, we need to find a healthy balance, a consensus instead of having both sets of group trying so hard to outscore the other group in a race to come up with charged up and outrageous generalisations to gain a point.

[X2]

I just sit back and watch the two groups duke it out. I ain’t got a dog in this fight.

But I can’t see Spanglish get butchered !!!

[diwana]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

This person spoke about those who do not do the right thing…such as finding excuses to not go and visit their ill parents and too much involved in making money etc. etc.

This article should not make those get annoyed who are doing good and have sincerity towards Pakistan and Pakistanis.

Different social classes/groups do exist outside Pakistan or social stigma is present.

There are groups of ex-pats based on various criteria and one powerful factor is social class/money,…besides those like job levels and education background etc.

I think the writer is nice in delivering the message.

[system]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

Seemingly bad spellings tho but maybe the guy sure has some class.
Nobodys spanglish was butchered, the guy knew what he was writing. But thanks to him we know some clowns are terrible clowns.

[X2]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@diwana

This person spoke about those who do not do the right thing…such as finding excuses to not go and visit their ill parents and too much involved in making money etc. etc.

This article should not make those get annoyed who are doing good and have sincerity towards Pakistan and Pakistanis.

Different social classes/groups do exist outside Pakistan or social stigma is present.

There are groups of ex-pats based on various criteria and one powerful factor is social class/money,…besides those like job levels and education background etc.

I think the writer is nice in delivering the message.

Diwana..but if we start taking it as is.. like ask expats how much tax they pay, and that is one of the ‘criteria’ to have a voice…then majority of Pakistanis in Pakistan should not have a voice either.

For my own benefit, do Pakistanis have to pay taxes on income not generated in Pakistan? I didn’t think that was the case. if that is the case..oyr you hadd haraaam bhagoray ppl… pay your damn taxes.

[diwana]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

One can write Kahuna to mean what he meant.

BTW:

Kahuna is also used for anything large or important. Anyone expert in his field. A Priest in Hawaii.

A big or important objective can also be described in terms of kahuna… spelled as such.

Example: Big kahuna= Big boss

[diwana]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@X2

Diwana..but if we start taking it as is.. like ask expats how much tax they pay, and that is one of the ‘criteria’ to have a voice…then majority of Pakistanis in Pakistan should not have a voice either.

For my own benefit, do Pakistanis have to pay taxes on income not generated in Pakistan? I didn’t think that was the case. if that is the case..oyr you hadd haraaam bhagoray ppl… pay your damn taxes.

But they live there and also suffer there.

BhagoRay just sit in comfortable rooms and criticize without discrimination anyone who belongs to Pakistan or lives in Pakistan. That is not fair.

I have recently heard US Govt make people pay Taxes for its citizens even if the money was earned outside. Need to check.

[X2]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@diwana

But they live there and also suffer there.

BhagoRay just sit in comfortable rooms and criticize without discrimination anyone who belongs to Pakistan or lives in Pakistan. That is not fair.

I have recently heard US Govt make people pay Taxes for its citizens even if the money was earned outside. Need to check.

US has laws that you pay taxes on income earned anywhere, many other countries dont. UK for example has different tax laws.

The term bhagoray was me being sarcastic. They can make a law that pakistani citizens overseas have to pay taxes and then go after those who dont but unless there is such a law … what taxes?

plus…not everyone who is not paying taxes in Pakistan is suffering…

There is a small number of expats compared to pakistanis living in pakistan. its not as if even if there were laws as such, that money will fix the country..even if each of them pays as much taxes as 50 avg Pakistanis…it will be less than if all Pakistanis in Pakistan paying taxes.

The people who live there can have a say and a right to yip yap when they pay their taxes…damn tax chors

[diwana]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@X2

US has laws that you pay taxes on income earned anywhere, many other countries dont. UK for example has different tax laws.

The term bhagoray was me being sarcastic. They can make a law that pakistani citizens overseas have to pay taxes and then go after those who dont but unless there is such a law … what taxes?

plus…not everyone who is not paying taxes in Pakistan is suffering…

There is a small number of expats compared to pakistanis living in pakistan. its not as if even if there were laws as such, that money will fix the country..even if each of them pays as much taxes as 50 avg Pakistanis…it will be less than if all Pakistanis in Pakistan paying taxes.

The people who live there can have a say and a right to yip yap when they pay their taxes…damn tax chors

People everywhere evade taxes. Some get caught most do not.

In Pakistan, unless laws are stict people will not pay.

We cannot blame average people not paying taxes when few rich elites who rule have no intention to pay taxes even on huge lands they own.

If laws were not so strict outside Pakistan, no one would be paying taxes just for being honest. And they wouldn’t mind suffering through basic problems as long as they get to save taxes.

I know you were sarcastic and so was I.

[Ghost14]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@diwana

This person spoke about those who do not do the right thing…such as finding excuses to not go and visit their ill parents and too much involved in making money etc. etc.

This article should not make those get annoyed who are doing good and have sincerity towards Pakistan and Pakistanis.

Different social classes/groups do exist outside Pakistan or social stigma is present.

There are groups of ex-pats based on various criteria and one powerful factor is social class/money,…besides those like job levels and education background etc.

I think the writer is nice in delivering the message.

His message about people who ignore Pakistan is fair. So is his point about people who go above and beyond to contribute. The problem is that he also lumps in the people in the middle, who do give back in their own way, would like to be able to visit more often but can’t, with those who **choose **not to go back.

He could also criticize a lot of Pakistanis *in Pakistan *for the things he only criticizes the people abroad, who purposely sever their ties, for. He doesn’t do any of that though. Doing so would severely weaken his argument because if the guy in Pakistan isn’t doing the right thing, why should the guy in America, who happens to be from Pakistan?

[sadzzz]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

^ if only money could fix Pakistan’s problems

Other than what many have already pointed out, I have one other grudge against this person’s opinion… the fact that you mentioned that we sit here in our cooled/heated house (whatever season we are in), and have no right to speak what we speak about Pakistan… firstly, we work our butts off to live in such a dwelling. Cooling and heating aint cheap. I know people who wont turn their heating/cooling on because they dont have the means to pay for it… even if they have it at home.

The other thing, if the building industry in Pakistan actually built proper insulated homes, you wouldnt have the problems you have with your heating and cooling… but woops, bad me, I shouldn’t be talking yeah? The fact is, we got out of Pakistan.. we see better things… things that can help Pakistan as well… but when Pakistanis sitting in Pakistan do not accept the help, help the advice, what is one to do? We get left bitter, bitter enough to sit in our cooled/heated homes and give unfruitful advice. Point is, we have become frustrated to the point of not caring any more. Emotionless, to an extent.

Then a Pakistan match happens, and we are patriots again.

[diwana]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@Ghost14

His message about people who ignore Pakistan is fair. So is his point about people who go above and beyond to contribute. The problem is that he also lumps in the people in the middle, who do give back in their own way, would like to be able to visit more often but can’t, with those who **choose **not to go back.

He could also criticize a lot of Pakistanis *in Pakistan *for the things he only criticizes the people abroad, who purposely sever their ties, for. He doesn’t do any of that though. Doing so would severely weaken his argument because if the guy in Pakistan isn’t doing the right thing, why should the guy in America, who happens to be from Pakistan?

Let me tackle your second para first:

The article seems one sided since it was focused on a specific group of people.

We do not know if he agrees with bad people in Pakistan just because he criticized few people outside Pakistan.

Simply speaking: the article is not meant to be all inclusive. he wanted to convey his message to only few people who have the audacity to criticize Pakistanis and Pakistan but don’t have any real contribution or intention to do help them…and simply ran away from the problems.

We should admit there ARE people like that.

(Separate discussion:Not to say the fake Pakistanis we see periodically on this forum who pretend to be well wishers of Pakistan or Pakistanis and use this mask to bash Pakistanis and Pakistan.)

Now for your first para:

He did try to be specific about those people who do not do good …WITHOUT separating those who have genuine intention but cannot do good.

I don’t think it is fair to criticize him for his lack of hair splitting argument or taking every minor aspect in to account.

[X2]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@diwana

One can write Kahuna to mean what he meant.

BTW:

Kahuna is also used for anything large or important. Anyone expert in his field. A Priest in Hawaii.

A big or important objective can also be described in terms of kahuna… spelled as such.

Example: Big kahuna= Big boss

so basically the sentence would then mean .

A- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the boss to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.
B- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the priest to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.
C- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the anything large and important to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.

but i think version D is what works well there.

D-A- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the balls to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.

PS: one can write kunwaaan too..spelling was the least of the problem with this blog that shamraz decided to give some hits to

[diwana]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@X2

so basically the sentence would then mean .

A- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the boss to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.
B- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the priest to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.
C- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the anything large and important to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.

but i think version D is what works well there.

D-A- "It’s for us who would never be ease at being where they are and would never have the balls to actually move back. Accepting is the first step my friend.

PS: one can write kunwaaan too..spelling was the least of the problem with this blog that shamraz decided to give some hits to

That is why, first I wrote what he really meant (balls-courage).. saying one can write Kahuna for Cojona.

Later I said BTW:… for different meanings as additional info. I did not mean other additional meanings could be used in his sentence.

[sadzzz]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@diwana

That is why, first I wrote what he really meant (balls-courage).. saying one can write Kahuna for Cojona.

Later I said BTW:… for different meanings as additional info. I did not mean other additional meanings could be used in his sentence.

what balls-courage are required to write a vent piece?

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

I used to agree with him, but after my recent trip to Pakistan, my viewpoints have changed.

Honest, smart, hard-working youth are just mentally dying and getting wasted there. Opportunities are scarce. Smart people even aren’t getting jobs. It’s all about who you know, and corruption is rampant.

Frankly, your allegiance with your country ends when you feel totally unsafe, and the country can’t protect you, and what’s worse, it doesn’t give a crap to protect you.

I had an episode or two in Pakistan recently which scared the crap out of me. It’s a different place now even Karachi is scary, and that too, in posh areas as well. People watch you. They watch your home, they know who is coming in and out of the homes, if there are visitors from abroad. I got off a rikshaw and he kept gazing at my grandmothers home. I asked him to turn around and we’re done with his services, and he stared right back at me with this look of “I know where you live now”.

Now who is gonna protect me and my family? We had a wedding in our home, and people watching probably saw there is a wedding in this home. We were scared daily that armed gunmen would come into the home and take our stuff and take our lives and our dignities.

Knowing there is no real police there. Knowing that you won’t get far if your family member gets kidnapped…

My cousins got lost and couldn’t find their way back home - another scare. Who do you call??? The police?

Some ways down the road a restaurant was blocked off with policemen. I would always point at that place, say, hey I wanna go here. What happened? The owner got a parchi. Parchi said “pay this much otherwise we kill you”. Owner took his son, fled country, kept the restaurant running, told the manager he is off for vacation, will be back.

Gunman showed up to the restaurant. Where is the money? What money? My money. I don’t know of your money? Gunshots fired - manager and 2 waiters dead. Restaurant shut down.

Another parchi “We mean business, so pay up”.

I mean if there is no law and order in the country and being successful means you get punished…then I don’t blame smart people for wanting to leave.

Your allegience ends when the allegience of that government to it’s citizens ends.

[Shamraz_Khan]

Re: Overseas Pakistani Syndrome

@X2

PS: can pakistanis not use the term cojones especially if they can’t spell it right… and just use the term tattaay …shukriya…I mean Gracias

hahaha