Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
I can bet this person never ever read or understood Quran.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
**Actually Arabic is the language of the Quran. Translations are fine, but they should always be looked upon as a secondary reference and nothing more. Reason being...there are many words, hundreds of them, for which there are no exact words available in English. Hence translators choose the closest word for it and when they do that they loose part of the meaning of the word.
Compare different copies of the English translations and you would find that there is absolutely no uniformity. The sentences, though, still having the same meanings are constructed differently in each copy. Thats not the case with the Arabic copies. This is the sole reason why so much emphasis on Arabic, to preserve the Quran, word by word as it was revealed.**
If this is true, then we need to build in our curriculum a place for learning the Arabic langauge. Which Pakistanis really haven't done. If this was true, then why haven't we done that? :o
Here's what I understand - in order of the wisest things to do depending upon if a person has the resources to do this:
Learn the Quran in Arabic - having knowledge of Arabic (which means either you speak it as a native language, or you learn it as a language)
Learn the Quran in Arabic with a translation next to you as you read. USE the translation.
Read the Quran in Arabic not knowing one ounce of the knowledge that you are reciting.
Option number 3 is pretty ignorant, and unfortunately, its been the encouraged option in OUR society.
Governement never made it mandatory for muslims to learn Arabic - which is what Pakistani gov't really should have done in the first place. So option one went out the window because of the "intelligence" of our buzurkh.
Option 2 is not encouraged by families as much, except as Suroor said, its not becoming a "trend". A positive trend, which is great. I think its been partially fueled by programs like Aalim Online and private channels bringing in Islam into educated public-viewed discussions via various programs (Alif is another example).
Option 3 is what is what you widely see today. It breeds only ignorance and dogma, which is the opposite effect of what reading the Quran SHOULD have.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
It makes me worried that people as dumb still present on this earth and are able to promote an ideology of hate.
This person has not provided anything which is even remotely uselful for anyone in practical sense to get to the truth.
Islam came in Middle East.
Quran was revealed in Arabaic.
Islam gave mankind relief from evil deeds.
No matter what Arabic haters say, as muslims no one can get away from Arabic.
As I mentioned earlier, Arabic needs to be learned at least on basic level and that's all.
This has nothing to do with a Mullah, and whatever.
There is no shortage of disgusting, mentally retarded and sick minded, '**mullah bashing people'** on this site so keep ranting.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
Islamic History tells us that such has actually been the case till the end of last century; however, with the advent of colonialism and muslims under such rule lost their values and gradually stopped doing that.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
^ The people who lived in the last century are dead. Unless if there are some that are over 105 years old, but how many are in their senses?
Muslims are no longer under colonial rule.
There are no more excuses.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
hey Muslims, quick question: do you prey so God hears you or so you "understand:, whatever that means?
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
That is what my point is. And that is why, all of us who realize that learning Arabic is necessary always reiterate for such a need. for 1400 years, all Ajamies (non-arabs) learnt the Arabic to understand Quran more closely. It’s only our fault that we don’t realize such mistake.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
I pray so that God hears me but at the same time, I want to know what I am praying.
.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
^ is that such a mystery? you're praying to God. you better not be praying 'for' anything ...I have it on pretty good authority that God does understand the prayers whether it's said in Sanskrit or Hindi.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
hey Muslims, quick question: do you prey so God hears you or so you "understand:, whatever that means?
Hey I have a quick question. Did God reveal the Quran (the prayers then are used in our namaz) so he can hear us recite it, or so that he can guide us with wisdom? If the former, then why don't the words just not mean anything? Why do they have a meaning? Why is there guidance?
Why can't it be something not-understandable like made-up words like:
Argoooseha gilon siilleng lsiitntn siiileng?
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
Praying as Offering Salah in that context, Dr. Watson:halo:
you can talk to God in any language but when it come to offer salah, it has to be in Arabic..
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
Which brings us to the same argument - how good is your salah when you have no idea what you are saying?
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
That is why, I want to know what I am praying.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
You see its a shame we dont know Arabic. Ok apart from the guidance and the sawaab and everything, if you look at the issue solely from the literary point of view, the Quranic text is so beautiful and inspiring...no prose or poetry ever comes close. Jimmy Swaggart once said that the Quran is the greatest literary work of all time but he does'nt believe its the book of God, of course thats why he's still a christian.
People start crying when reciting the Quran. However the same effect is not experienced when reading a translation of the text, its because, even though meaning and the message survives, the beauty of the words dies.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
^ I wouldn't be so quick to say that. I read the translation, and there are times that I break into tears.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
That was a quote from poster above,hence the quotation marks…
…Learn to read.
Muslims cannot even afford schools let alone arabic teaching schools.
only a minority can afford education of any level.
The majority are brainwashed by mullahs and conditioned to sit around and WAIT for God to do everything for them.
no innovation or invention.
God is gonna feed them,cloth them build houses for them,make them rich…
Hence “Inshahalah=God Willing.”
Hey! folks dont do go to work tomorrow ,just sit at home and God willing it will be ok…
mullahs are a menace and cause great suffering by making people DEPENDENT on God instead of people helping themselves.
WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THAT?
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
When people translate the Quran, it is no longer the EXACT words of Allah, but instead just a translation of it. And what is the quran? The words of Allah... so when translated to a different language, it is no longer the "quran" but just a translation of it. The translations can come close, but never fully are the same, and if an arab looks at the quran and the tranlation, he will find that they sometimes leave something out. Insh'Allah I must study my arabic harder. I learn to read the quran, but understand little and have to go to the translation, insh'Allah oneday I will be able to fully understand it by just reading it out of the quran itself.
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
Well if you want to get into a philosophical debate about it...
Technically a translation is the written out interpretation of the Quran. Its what someone was "understanding" when they read the Quran in Arabic, knowing arabic...
So, if you were to learn arabic, and become a master in the language, you would also have ideas formed in your head that you deem are equivalent to the meaning of the words. If you set down these ideas in your head, your version also becomes a translation.
So in a way, even if you're reading it in Arabic, knowing the Arabic, you're relying on your own personal interpretation. In which case, if you were a smart person, you'd cross-check your interpretation with those done by scholars that were much more learned than you anyway.
;)
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
From, what I have read of Sufism, they take the phrase there is no gog but god to mean there is NOTHING BUT GOD.. So then they are able to understand that all comes from god, and this can lead to all kind sof other enlightened thoughts.
You only repeated the Phrase there is no god but god.. Thats like using the same word that you are trying to define in the defintion…
And Sufi philosphy seems to make a lot of sense.. Muslims tend to be so mired in the basics, that they dont seem to see the real indepth truths that are apparently inherent in Islam. I know there is no God but god.. Ddi I really need a degree from some Madrassa to teach me that?!!?!
Re: Learning Islam Parrott Fashion
shouldnt it be 'there is no God except Allah?"....referring to the oneness of God?