Girls are meddling, gossipy, fickle creatures in my experience.
why would you say something like that? its so unislamic, you know.
now guy bashing…well, that’s been approved :k:
I didn't mean to offend. I haven't had much experience with young desi kids but with older men and women, it has always been the women making comments about my skin or something personal. I said they meddle and gossip because they don't wait for me to answer, just go on with their inane comments. Older men are much more tactful and if they do bring something personal up, they've done it in a nice manner. As for the younger generation, again, haven't had good experiences with girls.
PCG, what is so unislamic about what I said? and anyway, even if it is, i don't have a monopoly on what's Islamic or not. I never claimed to be Islamic.
Forgive me people but I'm going Bright BLUE
*Aalhan. You can say whatever you want to culture but that won't change what is and what will remain. Your venting out on the effects of culture is useless. If you are so against it then I would personally suggest that you apply your ideas and concepts to the women in your own family and 'liberate' them from these shackles. Another point which I think should be made here on the topic of marriage which has nothing to do with culture but everything to do with the male mind: Guys aren't ready to marry a girl who is 35 40. Whereas they won't find a dearth of girls willing to marry a guy who is even 50+. Maybe that girl will not be very educated maybe she will. Point is that they can pick up any girl of required age at any point in their lives. Women don't have this liberty. They have a "marriage clock" and it begins ticking when a girl reaches her twenties. How do you respond to that? *
*We have to live in this world and with the people in it. You can't dance to your own tune, not always. No matter how educated a girl can get, how independant, in the end everyone wants to send out roots and have a family. Girls or Guys. Sad state of affairs is such that for girls, there's a decreasing probability of that happening as years go by. *
^ Man, you said that so well! :k:
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by sadzzz: *
doesnt islam promote marriage? every wedding i go to, some elder male stands up and tells us the importance of being married young
[/QUOTE]
Thanks Sadzz. I was wondering how to send that message across. And Aalhan, at the risk of sounding feminist, it isnt culture we should blame. Its the male mentality. Backward male mentality which shuts unmarried girls over a certain age out of the arena. Im not saying all men have this or do this, Im just saying it is there regardless of which culture you are from. You say that we should follow Islam and not some culture, I totally agree. But "duniya mey aa hi ngaye hen to duniya walon key sath rehna paray ga"(If we've come into the world we have to live with its inhabitants)
One does not break Islam if one marries. Or worries about getting married before a certain age. Islam in fact would have that teenagers get married. Teenagers. And the logic behind that is to make sure that the mind remains pure and dedicated to a single person. ie the partner.
So when culture * is promoting early marriage,*Islam is stressing (early) marriage, what am I being? Pakistani or Muslim?
^ exactly :)
Too many times people are confusing religion and culture. Sometimes they say "Islam says do this this and that...." when its culture that says it... and in this situation, people are saying we should blame our culture. Its kinda wierd, people are always blaming one thing or another..
personally, i dont see why there is a problem with people discussing marriage issues... sure, whether uve kissed someone or not is an unnecessary discussion, but marriage is someting thats discussed everywhere u go..
hehe Sadzz humari khoob banay gi
hahaha.. lets hope so :k:
Awww bless you people Go on, let it out, let it all out :k:
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Demesne: *
Forgive me people but I'm going Bright BLUE
*Aalhan. You can say whatever you want to culture but that won't change what is and what will remain. Your venting out on the effects of culture is useless. If you are so against it then I would personally suggest that you apply your ideas and concepts to the women in your own family and 'liberate' them from these shackles. Another point which I think should be made here on the topic of marriage which has nothing to do with culture but everything to do with the male mind: Guys aren't ready to marry a girl who is 35 40. Whereas they won't find a dearth of girls willing to marry a guy who is even 50+. Maybe that girl will not be very educated maybe she will. Point is that they can pick up any girl of required age at any point in their lives. Women don't have this liberty. They have a "marriage clock" and it begins ticking when a girl reaches her twenties. How do you respond to that? *
*We have to live in this world and with the people in it. You can't dance to your own tune, not always. No matter how educated a girl can get, how independant, in the end everyone wants to send out roots and have a family. Girls or Guys. Sad state of affairs is such that for girls, there's a decreasing probability of that happening as years go by. *
[/QUOTE]
Why would a guy wanting to have kids marry a woman who's 35 or 40 or older and thus puts her kids and herself at risk by having babies? And why is that a man's fault? That's just the way nature works. If a guy doesn't wanna marry a girl who can't give him healthy kids then, please, that's his fault? Sure they can adopt, but a woman won't marry a guy who can't give her kids either but nobody will blame her for it. Just goes to show you the double standard.
Another thing is really pathetic and funny. Women are up in arms here about how men have so many requirements for a woman like her having to be able to cook etc. The issue is posted here with much outrage. Well, cooking is nothing. A girl's family won't even consider the rishta if the guy doesn't have a place to live, a well-paying job and financial stability. Now that's real responsibility, giving your family a place to live and feeding, clothing, sheltering, educating them. Complaining about a guy wanting the woman to cook is stupid compared to that right? And then women go on to say that the man should help too and start putting the blame on all men but they never offer to help take up financial responsibility too and neither has any man ever come here complaining about that even though the man has a very legit reason to complain while the girl does not.
SS. It's a very nice and valid point you brought up that maybe its the biological clock which restricts the age of gi
SS. It's a very nice and valid point you brought up that maybe its the biological clock which restricts the age of girls for marriage and therefore puts them in the spotlight. Sure that isn't the guys fault. But the biological clock keeps ticking till around fifty minimum. So lets not completely exonerate guys.
Secondly, as far as financial helping goes, mashallah sey in this up and coming generation I do find see that more and more women are being given the opportunity to come into the work arena. And most are jumping at it. My mother was a housewife. But mashahallah she has so much inborn talent that she is able to pick up assignments and rake in loads of money whenever she sets her mind to it. Women who must be complaining about cooking surely are the ones who are actually doing something worthwhile and hate to be put in that ageold bracket where the inlaws come over and ask "beta kya pakana ata hay?". This is off the topic but since you touched it I am answering. How would you, an educated maybe even working woman like for prospective inlaws to come over and ask you to show them your walk, talk and cooking? As if we were still in the archaic period where women's sole responsibility was cooking and acting demur? As if there is no interest in what you have achieved through your strife and intelligence but only interest in how well you cook chinese and your looks?
Please. Think before remonstrating women. I did not bang about guys. I was forced to make a point which unfortunately involved them. I would be the first to accept that there are exceptional guys around. But speaking generally, if you speak of girls who are uneducated or not working, most of those know how to cook and have been raised knowing that they will get married off and have been polished for it. Those who have gone after an education and are working, it is legitimate for them to raise a hue and cry over such issues because maybe they do not have the time to worry about this as well as the other issues in their life.
there is a lot frustration being let out here in this thread. To play the devil’s advocate -in this case Aalhan’s- the fact that his topic received such a huge overreaction actually proves a great deal in favor of his theory. If it was total crap that he was saying then the girls here ought to have been indifferent to it…or at least not show such a big reaction as you did. This shows that Aalhan touched a sensitive nerve here 
Aalhan: perhaps the answer to your question should be sought in evolutional processes?
quickly leaves the thread
Sarah, you are in the wrong thread. This comment belongs in Shinoo’s thread since it’s directed at that. Anyway, you seem to have missed Demesne’s point altogether. I’m glad she clarified it for you.
You are right though. I have not seen a single male guppy open up a thread about how they would never consider a girl who did not contribute financially to the family household. You are absolutely right! I do, however, remember threads being opened by some male Guppies about how they would never consider a ‘dark’ skinned girl or ‘ABCD’ girls simply cause they’ve been raised in the West.
Pathetic, sad and funny indeed.
Like they say, women are their own worst enemies. 
Like Demesne says, there are exceptional guys in every culture, including Pakistani guys. For any of you to think that girls here ‘hate’ all men … well think again. The fact that girls here continue to meet Pakistani guys, be it through family/parents or on their own, goes to show you that ultimately, a ‘nice’ Pakistani guy is basically what many girls are seeking. No, I’m not talking about stupid shallow requirements either.
Regardless, if you like it or not, GS is a place where people come to discuss different topics … yes, including marriage. Many of us have shared very similar experiences. What in the world is the harm in talking about it? Quite frankly, I’m quite glad that girls are opening up to the idiotic things that have been said to them by various rishtas and the things they have been asked about/made to do by potential rishtas. We’ve been told to shut up and put up with it for far too long. The way I see it, many people read these boards including men who are out there themselves ‘looking’. They can learn a few things from what’s written here, and yes, I’m well aware of the fact that it works both ways.
I used to think that I was the only one who was meeting people who would turn around and make nasty, superficial, comments. Of course, automatically I would think I was the problem. Maybe I am! At least NOW after reading these threads on GS, I know that I’m not the only one who is facing these types of issues and believe me, it is very comforting knowing that I’m not alone when it comes to this. I guess this something many of you who are already married simply cannot comprehend. Instead, you all sit there and ask, “oh, why are you complaining?” Whatever!
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Sarah Splendor: *
Why would a guy wanting to have kids marry a woman who's 35 or 40 or older and thus puts her kids and herself at risk by having babies? And why is that a man's fault? That's just the way nature works. If a guy doesn't wanna marry a girl who can't give him healthy kids then, please, that's his fault? Sure they can adopt, but a woman won't marry a guy who can't give her kids either but nobody will blame her for it. Just goes to show you the double standard.
Another thing is really pathetic and funny. Women are up in arms here about how men have so many requirements for a woman like her having to be able to cook etc. The issue is posted here with much outrage. Well, cooking is nothing. A girl's family won't even consider the rishta if the guy doesn't have a place to live, a well-paying job and financial stability. Now that's real responsibility, giving your family a place to live and feeding, clothing, sheltering, educating them. Complaining about a guy wanting the woman to cook is stupid compared to that right? And then women go on to say that the man should help too and start putting the blame on all men but they never offer to help take up financial responsibility too and neither has any man ever come here complaining about that even though the man has a very legit reason to complain while the girl does not.
[/QUOTE]
im dumbounded by some of the things mentioned in ur post...
the amount of girls i see around me who are marrying men who dont have jobs is far greater than guys marrying older women... if a women is expected to cook, clean, produce babies, be good to the inlaws, pray 5 times a day, wear a hijab.. (u get my drift) why on earth cant a woman demand a man that works!! for goodness sakes its not double standards.... its about women finally speaking up about what they want.. not being married off to a jerk who expects her to run the house and please him at the same time!
u know.. it was all ok a few decades ago when only a select few women raised their voices against men... and now that a few more are doing it... its labeled double standards... bravo!
**Previously stated by Demesne,
Its in female nature to revolve around such issues.
So irregardless of culture, society, norms blah blah it's in
women's nature to beat the bush with the same stick. According
to your statement, whether or not it had been culture, society or
anything women would still have pounded on the issue because
it's in their nature. Interesting.
Then you said
And in this society it is expected that girls will eventually be married off
So it's society...
We still havent moved out of that mindset because society hasnt let us
**Now it's mindset and society...
Because in this country a guy is put way up there on a pedestal and a girl is looked down upon.
**Now it's the country...
You seem to be hopping from one excuse to another.
I took your own logic and said that if that's what culture,
society, mindset whatever is teaching a person or bringing
out in a person shun it. But the whole mumbo jumbo about
'oh how you have to live in this world and can't dance to your own
tune blah blah..' Either don't complain or be willing to do
something about it. Just wanting to complain consistently doesn't
really help solve the problem. But maybe all people are interested
in is complaining. There's something much easier about
just complaining instead of actually having to do something
to change it.
In your process of venture you drifted to another male-bashing
issue that a person retorts to when all else has failed,**
Point is that they can pick up any girl of required age at any point in their lives
Then why do women accept those older men's proposals.
If absolutely no woman married an old guy then eventually
there would be no older men wanting to marry younger girls
because there would be none wanting to marry them. Again
just complaining is not going to do anything. I can pull up
quite a few threads where numerous girls here have stated
their fantasies about Richard-Gere types. I can also along the
same lines raise the issue of how a girl's family are looking
for doctors or engineers only, how much money a guy has,
how much is he making, what kinda car he drives (seems to
be a humongous one), do parents live with him, does he
support siblings or contribute to paternal housing and expenses...**
So when culture is promoting early marriage,Islam is stressing (early) marriage, what am I being? Pakistani or Muslim?
Islam promotes early marriage, but I would really like to see
where it says that women can talk about guys incessantly or
start believing and stating all men are jerks. Show me
which scripture, which chapter, which line says that. If it's forbidden
for guy to look at a girl, it's the same way for girls as well.
Promoting early marriage does not promote talking about guys
or even to guys. And that is to keep mind, body and spirit pure.
Nescio, finally someone caught on. Case rested.**
Aalhan... how many ads have u seen of men wanting "only medical professions pls apply", "fair girl only... mid 20's for 40+ man"
give me a break...
and tell me u havent seen guys continously opening hideous threads in Images 3 and fantasing about models and actoresses...??
just cus we say "oooh he's nice" doesnt mean we want to marry the lad.. geez
Of course he touched a sensitive nerve. You know, it’s hard enough as it is. The last thing we need is smug married people sitting on their pedastal looking down at us. We face enough of this kind of siht from smug marrieds when we attend desi functions. It’s not pleasant facing more of this crap here on GS.
i just wanted to say... what is it with desis once they get married? do they think they can go around judging those who are single?
ok, so we are partially at fault that we havent accepted the 2nd best person that might have proposed to us.. but why do we need to be condemned?? and if our useless annoying threads about marriage problems and loserfied men are troubling u... why read them???
maybe if we all stepped into each other shoes for about a day or two... we may learn something.. which is to be nicer!
MehnazQ: i understand your point of view, but I wonder why you let such statements (whether on GS or from desi uncles/anuties) get to you?
I've developed a technique to counter-attack such statements......often desis say such stuff about others, cuz they themselves face a lot of difficulties in their marriage. The trick is to strike back at them with this knowledge. result: They won't ever bother you again :D
sadz: why desis get overconfident when married? simply cuz they AT LAST found someone who agreed/was forced to marry them. Mind you, it's a big burden for a desi male to get married and gain some esteem from his immediate relatives. After having done that, he soon enuf realizes that there isn't any escaping the situation he is in..............only thing left is then lure others into the same mistake he made