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YUSUFALI: And have patience with what they say, and leave them with noble (dignity).
PICKTHAL: And bear with patience what they utter, and part from them with a fair leave-taking.
SHAKIR: And bear patiently what they say and avoid them with a becoming avoidance.
Man, you might have the patience to put up with someone who insults Prophet Mohammad :saw:. I do not.
-Salman
I will answer your question from first post by asking you a question.
Since when we have a perfect sharia that can make an unbiased decision, wihout coming under the pressure of the governments ?
Yes I will NOT miss a chance to kill that person who plays with the respect of prophet Mohammad :saw:.
Does that answer your question, or is it also waste of time to talk about any such thing ?
-Salman
Do you have Hadith and Koranic Ayaah which says Kill a guy
who disrespect a Prophet. One more thing are you referring to
muslim or people of any other faith.
This is how i see it . When i see Muslims going against the
teaching of Rasool Allah(SAW), this is the REAL DISRESPECT.
Like people going to Mazars, Shrines,doing all kind of Biddahs,
not praying 5 times. What's your verdict on that. The Muslims
who pretend to be Muslims.
Just to let you know, FITAH Makkah ke baad, Rasool Allah(SAW)
ne sub ko maaf kardia.His actions were against the tribal culture
of that time. And people were amazed when he forgave them.
If he can forgive his worst enemies, WHY CAN'T you.
Assalam o alaikum dear members and comrades!
i never really expected that the response to this topic would be of such extreme nature. Here is what i have concluded from this conversation:
There are some events in which a person insulted the Prophet(PBUH) and he was killed by someone and Prophet(PBUH) ordered that he was not to be punished.
But Prophet never himself gave such an order to kill a person for insulting him. (Correct me if i am wrong).
I know a lot of people respect the Holy Prophet (PBUH) and every muslim should but i have seen people who don't even go to Friday prayer and they claim that they are true lovers of Prophet (PBUH). So ofcourse there should be punishment for insulting our beloved Holy Prophet but this punishment should not be given by a person!
I think a broad-minded group of Ulemas should get together and they should classify insulting the Holy Prophet into levels of intensity. This is my proposal:
1. For a very light insult there should be a fine
2. For level 2 there should be prison of some time period in jail
3. For level 3 both jail and fine
4. For Level 4 there should be death penality.
in each case the person should be allowed to take his comments back. The punishment would be given by a group of judges appointed by Islamic Government which would first order a comprehensive investigation into the matter.
What do you people think? And plz keep your tempers down! Talking in a cool way is a lot better than talking in a rude way.
very well said.. i agree with you.
-Salman
Dear Brother Rehman, I am not a prophet or even the dust of the feet of my beloved prophet Mohammad :saw:. He was RehmatallilAlameen, I am not. You have your way of loving him :saw: i have my way of loving him, whether you like it or not. I have something for you that would draw your attention. I didnt even have to pull this off hadiath one of my very dear friend here on gupistan looked it up for me. Please read.
**As for the punishment or ruling on the one who abuses or insults the Messenger, sallallahu 'alayhi wa salam, then he is to be killed without repentance, by consensus of the scholars of this ummah, as can be found in as-Saarim al-Maslool 'ala Shaatim ar-Rasool (The Raised Sword Upon the One Who Insults the Prophet) for Shaykh al-Islaam Ibn Taymiyyah.
- He ordered the killing of Ka’b bin al-Ashraf, and he was someone who was mocking him in al-Madeenah, and he was killed.
Jabir, may Allah be pleased with him, reported:
The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Who will kill Ka’b bin Al-Ashraf? He has maligned Allah, the Exalted, and His Messenger. Muhammad bin Maslamah said: Messenger of Allah, do you wish that I should kill him? He said: Yes. He said: Permit me to talk (to him in the way I deem fit). He said: Talk (as you like). So, Muhammad bin Maslamah came to Ka’b and talked to him, referred to the old friendship between them and said: This man (i.e. the Holy Prophet) has made up his mind to collect Charity (from us) and this has put us to a great hardship. When he heard this, Ka’b said: By Allah, you will be put to more trouble by him. Muhammad bin Maslamah said: No doubt, now we have become his followers and we do not like to forsake him until we see what turn his affairs will take. I want that you should give me a loan. He said: What will you mortgage? He said: What do you want? He said: Pledge me your women. He said: You are the most handsome of the Arabs; should we pledge our women to you? He said: Pledge me your children. He said: The son of one of us may abuse us saying that he was pledged for two wasqs of dates, but we can pledge you (our) weapons. He said: All right. Then Muhammad bin Maslamah promised that he would come to him with Al-Harith; Abu 'Abs bin Jabr and 'Abbad bin Bishr. So they came and called upon him at night. He came down to them. Sufyan says that all the narrators except 'Amr have stated that his wife said: I hear a voice which sounds like the voice of murder. He said: It is only Muhammad bin Maslamah, his foster-brother and Abu Na’ilah. When a man of dignity is called at night even if to be pierced with a spear, he should respond to the call. Muhammad said to his companions: As he comes down, I will extend my hands towards his head and when I hold him fast, you should do your job. So when he came down and he was holding his cloak under his arm, they said to him: We sense from you a very fine smell. He said: Yes, I have with me a mistress who is the most scented of the women of Arabia. He said: Allow me to smell (the scent on your head). He said: Yes, you may smell. So he caught it and smelt. Then he said: Allow me to do so (once again). He then held his head fast and said to his companions: Do your job. And they killed him. Sahih Muslim 3359
- He praised the killing of a Jewish woman, by her husband, who was reciting poetry (or doing something similar) insulting him, and this is found in the books of hadeeth.
Amongst other evidences, and Allah knows best.
DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION ?
**
[QUOTE]
1) He ordered the killing of Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, and he was someone who was mocking him in al-Madeenah, and he was killed.
2) He praised the killing of a Jewish woman, by her husband, who was reciting poetry (or doing something similar) insulting him, and this is found in the books of hadeeth
[/QUOTE]
wot does this make him?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
wot does this make him?
[/QUOTE]
Dude i wouldnt ask you when your raam loved someone and went crazy for her. I wouldnt ask you what would make him because i dont have your religion. If you are a muslim you would understand these things but you are not neither i expect from you to understand.
-Salman
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
wot does this make him?
[/QUOTE]
Defender of the Sanctity and Honour of the 'Office' of the Prophethood!
[QUOTE]
Dude i wouldnt ask you when your raam loved someone and went crazy for her. I wouldnt ask you what would make him because i dont have your religion. If you are a muslim you would understand these things but you are not neither i expect from you to understand.
[/QUOTE]
Ram was a king some 5,000 yrs back...there is no evidence that all thats told and heard about him is factual...he only assumed a godly fig as late as in 10th century with tulsidas's Ram Charitya Manaas. And most of the stories that are woven around him are exarggerated.
So now you know what i think about him.
Camparatively, yor prophet is more recent, with proper historical evidences of each event evolving him.
and as you say, he ordered ppl to be mercilessly killed merely because they dared to critized him. Was it fair?
[QUOTE]
Defender of the Sanctity and Honour of the 'Office' of the Prophethood!
[/QUOTE]
by killing unarmed ppl!!
[quote]
*he ordered ppl to be mercilessly killed merely because they dared to critized him
[/quote]
*
man, Soul, what kind of books do you read? Honestly, if Islam is such an awful religion, then why don't you comfort yourself with that thought and leave us savage, ignorant heathens be? If you disagree with his teachings, that is your right and you are most entitled to hold that opinion. Just don't try to go around proving that we're all stupid or barbarians or intolerant.
[QUOTE]
Just don't try to go around proving that we're all stupid or barbarians or intolerant.
[/QUOTE]
No its no me..read salman...he is doing it perfectly well...
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by soul: *
**No its no me..read salman...he is doing it perfectly well...
[/QUOTE]
*
No, actually you are. There is no difference between this type of hatred and fanaticism than that practiced by other so-called religious groups around the world. And that's the pity.
Mr. Salman NY,
You wrote:
[QUOTE]
2) He praised the killing of a Jewish woman, by her husband, who was reciting poetry (or doing something similar) insulting him, and this is found in the books of hadeeth.
[/QUOTE]
This tradition is most unreliable, to say the least. The truth of the matter is that the Holy Prophet (Peace be upon him) never ordered the execution of a woman on account of her apostasy. The well-known treatise of jurisprudence, Hedayah, sets out the following:
[QUOTE]
The Holy Prophet (Peace be upon him) forbade the killing of women for apostasy, because the principle of punitive regulations is that in such cases the penalty should be left for the hereafter, as a penalty imposed in this life would contravene the purpose of apostasy, being a trial calling to account what pertains to God alone. This can be departed from only when the object in view is to restrain the person concerned from continuing hostilities (during times of war). As women, by their very nature, are not capable of fighting, a woman apostate cannot be punished in any case.
[/QUOTE]
Then you wrote:
[QUOTE]
He ordered the killing of Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, and he was someone who was mocking him in al-Madeenah, and he was killed.
[/QUOTE]
Mocking Holy Prophet (peace be upon him) was not the only crime of Ka'ab bin al-ashraf. He was the same person, who after the victory of Badr, went all the way to Mecca to rouse the Quraish against the Holy Prophetsa. He played on the Arab weakness for vengeance:
[QUOTE]
Badr’smill ground out the blood of its people.
At events like Badr you should weep and cry.
The best people were killed round their cisterns.
Don’t think it strange that princes were left lying
How many noble, handsome men,
The refuge of the homeless, were slain,
Liberal when the stars gave no rain.33
[/QUOTE]
Don't you think that his lists of crime also include treason and abetting the enemy and for that he was punished and blasphemy was not the only crime for his punishment
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
No its no me..read salman...he is doing it perfectly well...
[/QUOTE]
Soul, at least forget about everything just one question to you. Why 99.9% of your posts are anti muslims ? I have asked you this question many times but never got a response. You MERELY contribute in any other forums but even when you do that you always wana make rediculous remarks about muslims. Wuts up with that ?
[quote]
No, actually you are. There is no difference between this type of hatred and fanaticism than that practiced by other so-called religious groups around the world. And that's the pity.
[/quote]
Well said Nadia.
Brother fatehahmad, There are many other Hadiath that are very week. This might be one of them i agree with you. I have alot more to write but i am out of time rite now. I will come tonight and address what you have said. Till then take care.
-Salman
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
Ram was a king some 5,000 yrs back...there is no evidence that all thats told and heard about him is factual...he only assumed a godly fig as late as in 10th century with tulsidas's Ram Charitya Manaas. And most of the stories that are woven around him are exarggerated.
So now you know what i think about him.
Camparatively, yor prophet is more recent, with proper historical evidences of each event evolving him.
and as you say, he ordered ppl to be mercilessly killed merely because they dared to critized him. Was it fair?
by killing unarmed ppl!!
[/QUOTE]
Mohammed The Prophet
By Prof. K. S. Ramakrishna Rao, Head of the Department of Philosophy,
Government College for Women University of Mysore, Mandya-571401 (Karnatika).
Re-printed from "Islam and Modern age", Hydrabad, March 1978
In the desert of Arabia was Mohammad born, according to Muslim historians, on April 20, 571. The name means highly praised. He is to me the greatest mind among all the sons of Arabia. He means so much more than all the poets and kings that preceded him in that impenetrable desert of red sand.
And more wonderful still is what the reverend Bosworth Smith remarks, "Head of the state as well as the Church, he was Caesar and Pope in one; but, he was pope without the pope's claims, and Caesar without the legions of Caesar, without an standing army, without a bodyguard, without a palace, without a fixed revenue. If ever any man had the right to say that he ruled by a right divine It was Mohammad, for he had all the power without instruments and without its support. He cared not for dressing of power. The simplicity of his private life was in keeping with his public life."
he was a very very very clever man, amongst the gullible arabs. I have no doubts.
like pope and ceasar?? is the writter trying to say, he was a powerful religio-political dictator? i agree!
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by soul: *
he was a very very very clever man, amongst the gullible arabs. I have no doubts.
like pope and ceasar?? is the writter trying to say, he was a religio-political dictator? i agree!
[/QUOTE]
the point is have a look at the name of the author.
By Prof. K. S. Ramakrishna Rao, Head of the Department of Philosophy,
Government College for Women University of Mysore, Mandya-571401 (Karnatika).