John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

In last night’s presidential debate there was quite a bit of discussion between Obama and McCain about Pakistan. Obama was advocating a more aggresive policy towards Pakistan and McCain wants more diplomatic approach. Obama criticized US support for Musharaf and its reply McCain justified the support by claiming that Pakistan was a failed state in 1999.

His exact words were “I don’t think that Senator Obama understands that there was a failed state in Pakistan when Musharraf came to power. Everybody who was around then, and had been there, and knew about it knew that it was a failed state.”

Wow that is quite a slap on the face of Nawaz Sharif government of the time.

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

wow...You really believe in each and everything what a politician says and a journalist writes...lol

When it will be time to use your own little brain... :D

PS: Americans etc. talking about Pakistan a failing state...while at the same time America + Europe + Japan are facing a 'squeez' by China, India, Russia & Africa... :)

What did McCain say about the Musharraf era? Did he think Pakistan come out of "failed state"? Did US support of Musharraf make Pakistan "not-failed" state?

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

His implication was that Pakistan is not a failed state any more. I am not saying that I agree with his statement. Exactly what is a failed state is difficult to define. Somalia and Afghanistan come to my mind. These are the places with pretty much no central govenment and no central government control for several years. Pakistan is not there yet and was not in 1999.

OTOH it is an shocking comment on the state of affairs in 1999 Pakistan.

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

Namashkar Ajju,

So atleast you admit that Pakistan isnt a failed state anymore. Salaam/Namastey

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

Pakistan is a failed state even in 2008.

Baat darasal yea hay kay ... who one is and how one looks at things.

Before 2000 (pre-Musharraf period), Pakistan was a paradise state for corrupts, crooks, thugs, thieves, looters, plunderers, characterless and pariah of society. It was an era where people like Nawaz, Zardari and their 100s of thieves became billionaires and millionaires, regardless of what majority of Pakistanis were going through. These people were taking loans in the name of Pakistan and were filling their bank accounts and buying assets all over the world. This situation is considered by majority of honest people as condition of being failed state, though obviously, corrupts would not agree to it, as for them it was days of plenty.

Between 1999 and 2008, corrupts had bad time and it was failed state for these people. But then, for most Pakistanis, it was era of prosperity, progress, development and well bring. I know many Pakistanis who use to send me CVs before 2000 so that I could find them job in west started inviting me to Pakistan and telling me how good it has become. I also know many Pakistanis who migrated out of Pakistan during pre-2000 cursed years returned to Pakistan attracted with economical boom in Pakistan, and never regretted until now, when they are feeling sick. It was period when Pakistan became so proud of itself that Pakistan told IMF to get lost (2004) and stopped taking grants and loans from world institutions at concessional rates (known as AID). It was days when Pakistani leaders like Musharraf and Shaukat Aziz use to tell west that we do not want AID but we want trade. It was period that Pakistani debt papers were getting oversubscribed and people were willing to trust Pakistani government with their money at very low interest.

Anyhow, 2008 brought new era when we saw old corrupts and crooks back in the country. There entrance is so unwelcoming that most investors started running out of Pakistan as if they have seen Devil in Pakistan, a government similar to pre-Musharraf period. Within few months, Pakistan has started to see similar economical condition what Pakistan had before 2000, a condition described as being verge of failed state again, and that means, dancing and singing time of corrupts have started again.

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

Brother Saleem, that question was for the old geyser Mccain, not you. In any case since you answered it, may I remind you that the people running Pakistan from 1999-2008 were the same idiots from the NS and PPP party with switched loyalties, under a corrupt tyrant military dictator who has already been termed as a mistake by his American masters.

Brother, I would not argue with you as I did write that Pakistan was failed state before 2000 depends on who one is and how one looks at things.

As for a state to be failed or not, a person is not talking about things that is yet to come but things that has already gone, so records and figures are in front of people. Anyhow, to see the figures and truth also needs some knowledge and intelligence, as many devil thugs of corrupts have started propaganda of impossibility backed with ridiculous lies, and many Pakistanis with low intellect accept their propaganda, however ridiculous and illogical. Anyhow, for those with some intelligence and knowledge, state of Pakistan throughout different periods is well documented and one only needs to check things up to know everything, whatever happened to Pakistan during different periods.

Saleem Sahib, I can show you countless articles, AFTER 1999, and BEFORE 2008, where Pakistan was nationally cited as a failed state. That is no different from what they were saying before 1999, and after 2008. Infact, we might have been a poor economic state before 1999, but atleast things were peaceful, compared to the woes of suicide bombing, civil war, and chaos we have seen in this decade.

:k:

You are right, atleast there was peace. Look at where we have landed now.

Fail or pass you are nowhere without peace. Fruits of 8 years of tyranny,

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

yaar saleem bhai..itnay lambay post kartay ho yaar..lagta strike kay din paisa hoay thay tubhie sub ko apni awaz sunana chatay ho..


So the only qualifier for "failed state" is that looters/thugs are in the government? Failure of law enforcement has nothing to do with that? Failure of providing security has nothing to do? Failure to provide basic services like "electricity" has nothing to do? Come'on Sa1eem bhai, in the hate for PML-N/Nawaz don't get blinded, thanks.

Brother, it is fact that major reason for a state to become failed state is economical and major reasons for economical misery is corruption, nepotism, discrimination and mismanagement, nothing else. Whatever reasons you mentioned is secondary. I am not saying that because of love or hate of anyone, rather personally, I do not love or hate anyone anyhow. If I would put all the reasons why I believe that, you would complain that my post is long, but nevertheless, there are valid logical reasons for what I mentioned.

Failure of law enforcement and failure of providing security: This happens when there are excessive crimes in the country and government has little fund to control or deal with that ... because government has inadequate manpower and supply of law enforcement apparatus ... thus problem is economical.

Excessive crimes could also be related to lack of Jobs, lack of education, lack of amenities, lack of infrastructure, lack of opportunities ... and so on ... all related to lack of funds or resources with the government ... economical problem again.

Another reason for lawlessness could be discrimination and nepotism in the country that creates grievances ... thus this part is to do with discrimination and nepotism but discrimination and nepotism happens because there are inadequate opportunities in the country, again reason is mostly economical.

Another reason for lawlessness is misguided people wanting change, cause of that is inferior or no education, lack of opportunities or suppression. All can be tackled if economy of the country is strong. Hence problem is basically economical.

Unless a group of people within the country wanting and fighting for separation or independence ... something that normally does not happen in financially rich country, most law and order problems are related to country’s economy ... but if it happens that a group of people want independence or separation, I believe, independence or separation should be given to these people.

Failure to provide basic services like ‘electricity, other amenities and infrastructure’: That is also due to financial restrain in the country, again economical problem, else economically strong country should not have such problems.

Failure to provide Justice: Here also, cause is mostly corruption, injustice and lack of fund (economical).

Most law and order problems in west are due to corruption and injustice ... that could get sorted out as economics of these countries are strong, but then nepotism and discrimination are other factors that could exist even when economics are strong. Though in rich economy, something that could also cause law and order problem is greed ... that we abundantly find amongst corrupt rulers in third world countries. Greed is backbone of corruption.

Just think and you will find that most problems of a country are linked to economics of that country. Good economy itself takes care of problems, but a country could not have good economy when country has corruption, nepotism, discrimination, and mismanagement. Corruption, nepotism, discrimination and mismanagement in a country can never go if people who rule the country have these traits, that is, they are corrupt, do nepotism, do discrimination, and have no ability to manage the country effectively. Any of these elements could hinder economical progress of the country.

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

^ Sa1eem bhai: even after getting $billions nation was facing same problems even after 2000 so there was no difference due to "economic boom", all the problems are still there and just going up.... means the failure continues till today.

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

Pakistan's plight has been much worse in the last 8 years. The only things that have brought Pakistan in the headlines in the last 8 years has been negative, be it terrorism, incompetency of the Govt, corruption or the curbs on politicians, judiciary and abduction of its own people. Atleast there was peace in the last decade unlike now.

both obama and mcains chips guys, they just trying to score some points just making some hawkish and luring comments about any nation of the worlds in order to please voters. both actually doesnt know about Pakistan that much anyway.
Pakistan has never been a failed state, and never it will be Inshallah.

This wet dream of many countries around Pakistan and few others will never be true, they have tried in the past and they still trying and also trying to sell this to whole world

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

^ yeah I agree, not to mention the old geyser mccain thinks we share a border with eye-raq!

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

Recently debt rating has been lowered against pakistan fearing that pakistan may not be able to repay foreign debt.

Bloomberg.com: India & Pakistan

In that case be prepared for multi-nation companies to take over the economy and open trade with all world just like India. I’m not an economist but this happened in India after 1991-92

Re: John mcCain: Pakistan was a failed state in 1999!

“The nation is running short of money to repay state debt, as foreign-exchange reserves have almost halved to $9.16 billion in early September from $16.5 billion a year ago”
Bloomberg.com: India & Pakistan

this is very serious condition.. general public should ask government to cut on expenses and save countries pride before ‘western’ countries. Also boosting local economy is very much required to reduce import and exporting more goods. Non-resident pakistani’s can contribute by way of remmittance. People might jump their guns at me if I say reducing defence budget can also be a way to make economy stable. Taliban is not worth spending billions $. See the US economy after war with afganistan and iraq…