jesus as god?

Society Religion & Philosophy
41

Re: jesus as god?

As far as I know, there is no reference in the Bible that Jesus “worshipped” God. If you do have some, please submit it. If there is no reference, then the question has no meaning…

As to the discussion between Bob_chasm and Minah_pa, if they would accept me joining the discussion:

The Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit (people always tend to ignore the third person in discussing the Tri-une God concept) together form the Tri-une God. Each of the three have his own distinct characteristic and function in the Tri-une God. Each individually still represent God in their seperate entities and can therefor be worshipped individually as God.

In order to fulfill prophecy and to redeem mankind Jesus, for a short period only, became more human and less God when his Godlike abilities/nature was curtailed as stated in Phil.2v5-7 Your attitude should be the same as that of Jesus Christ: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness..

In short, both body and soul of a dead person (even though they are two distinct entities) are both called by the persons name even if the two entities are in two different places. No-one has any problem with that but most people have a problem with the seperate identities of the Tri-une God :slight_smile:

42

Re: jesus as god?

The question is, Is Jesus God for Catholics? According to minah he is not God.

ff asked:
One thing I dont understand is IF Jesus(AS) was God himself why He used to worship God????????????

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suroor said:

i dont think he is the God himself in any religion :-/

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Anwaar said: In christianity, he is son of God and treated as God... they ask in the name of Jesus.. :-)

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minah said: suroor has it right anwaar

bob said:
I used the quotation to demonstrate that the one God in the Bible is YHWH. I demonstrated that Jesus was fully God according to the Nicene creed, therefore YHWH, nothing less. The discussion is whether Jesus is God not whether he is the Father.

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minah said:
Allow me to point out to you that the begining of this creed sharply defines both as being seperate and continues to assert that through out. Surprise, surprise, it also actually asserts Jesus was a man. If you don't understand the English used, I can help you tomorrow after I wake up. Once again, I say to you to learn (or just try actually reading) before you preach.

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I post a defintion of consubstantial quoting the New Catholic dictionary, that states Jesus is truly God.

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Then minah posts a definition of consubstantial to prove Jesus is not God.

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Now minah posts this to prove Jesus is not God:

[quote]
The Trinity is one. There are not three gods, but one God in three persons. These divine persons do not divide out the one divinity among themselves, but each of them is God whole and entire.

The divine persons are really different from one another. Father, Son and Holy Spirit are not simply names for different roles played by the same person. The three persons of the Trinity have different origins:

It is the Father who generates,
The Son who is begotten,
And the Holy Spirit who proceeds.

The divine persons are related to one another. Even though they are separate persons, this does not deny their real unity. They still share one nature or substance.
[/quote]

Does this prove Catholics believe Jesus is not God? I dont think so, read the highlighted portion of your own quote. By the way your own link calls the Trinity a mystery too.

regards,

bob

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Re: jesus as god?

Bob - my own links calls it a mystery because no one can truly understand the nature of God. Do you?

Last person to answer this post wins!!!!
44

Re: jesus as god?

Isn't it much easier to just accept Jesus as another God and get on with it? That's why the Hindu tolerance of a trillion Gods make sense.

If you believe God is omnipotent, he/she/it is certainly capable of being one or many. Saying there's only ONE God is placing an arrogant limit on the capabilities of who/whatever you believe is God!

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Re: jesus as god?

man…if He AS was not used to “worship” God then how can we say that he was prophet in Islam, or even God for christians ? a prophet has to be really close to be God in order to get the title of prophet or sufi…

46

Re: jesus as god?

Man…God is just “1”. how many Gods do u believe?

47

Re: jesus as god?

just 1? do you know how arrogant you sound, trying limit God’s capability? Who are you to say God is incapable of anything?

Yeh shyr Kis ka hy..
48

Re: jesus as god?

Since I am not a prophet, I have my limitations.

49

Re: jesus as god?

The way Islam sees Jesus is for Islam to decide. As Christian I cannot accept that a person that lived centuries later has more knowledge as to Jesus’ life on earth than those who were there and were prepared to die for their believe/knowledge. Collectively they posted enough letters and books (taken up in the New Testament) for us to form a good idea of what Jesus did during his life on earth.

The Christian viewpoint: Jesus did not “worship God” because he is part of the Tri-Une God. How/why could/would God worship himself? No, according to my knowledge of the Bible Jesus did not worship God but frequently had communication with God through prayer.

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Re: jesus as god?

how many Gods do u believe…and really…do they have different role to play?..cant “1” God do all the things that other Gods can?

For me God is just “1” whether u think im trying to limit God’s capability.. becuz thats what Qur’an taught Muslims. Infact if ure muslim u should know surah Ikhlaq which clarifies that He is 1 with no partners and no siblings or anyone. He is “wah da hoo la shareek” he is alone and has no partners

51

Re: jesus as god?

[quote]
As far as I know, there is no reference in the Bible that Jesus "worshipped" God. If you do have some, please submit it. If there is no reference, then the question has no meaning....
[/quote]
-OldMan

John 9:38Then the man said, "Lord, I believe," and he WORSHIPED him.

WORSHIPPED: Strong x 4352: proskuneo: means to kiss, like a dog licking his master’s hand, to fawn or crouch, to prostrate onself in homage

We find Jesus grovelling/ worshipping in the NT:

Matthew 26:39 And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, "My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as thou wilt."

Luke 22 (English-KJV)41 And he was withdrawn from them about a stone's cast, and kneeled down, and prayed, ...

So the issue is not the prayer but how he prays by falling down on his face and kneeling down, which, makes it worship.

regards,

bob

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Re: jesus as god?

OldMan - God was the father of Jesus. The have the same essence (as do you, Atlantis, bob and myself all do) but Jesus worshiped the Father (God). This is shown throughout the New Testament.

Maybe it is the way the terms are used. In refering to the Father - he is God. Even though Jesus has the same essence, to myself, he is not God (the word, not the essence) because that term is how I refer to the Father. Perhaps that is a failing of understanding on my part, but it is also the way most christians refer to the Father also (with the term God, not the idea).

Hazrat Khizar(A.S) -- meeting people ?
53

Re: jesus as god?

I believe in many many many Gods - I will give you a very simple fact on this - do you believe God is omnipotent? If so, he is also capable of menifesting as 1 or many. Therefore for you to say you will believe in only one God is quite arrogant in that you are putting limits on what God is capable of.

^♥^ Happy Birthday Khummmmmar ^♥^ (merged)
54

Re: jesus as god?

Was Jesus God or son of God? How much difference would there be between the two? Think, people, think!

what do you think Jesus meant when he said,'I and my father are one'. 'What I can do you can also do (miracles)'. 'No one reaches God except through me'. This does not mean we have to become Christian, but live like Christ. kind, merciful, forgiving, humble.

There is no difference between God and Jesus. Jesus was the human manifestation come to teach us Godly qualities. he also tried to teach us that God was our Father just like he was Jesus' father, that is why the Lord's prayer starts with 'Our Father' and not 'Our God'.

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Re: jesus as god?

is god restricted not take any other form if he wanted according to islam?

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Re: jesus as god?

its not?

Question.
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Re: jesus as god?

Hello rvikz,

According to the Quran God has promised to stay invisible to our vision, pretty much like it says in the Old Testament.

regards,

bob

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Re: jesus as god?

now that u have already said that He is omnipotent why he wanna be 2 instead of just 1 ?.. if He is capable of doing everything… 1 God can do everything that thousands can..

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Re: jesus as god?

many many many is not what i was looking for… come on man… which God do you think is capable of doin everything out of those many many many?

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Re: jesus as god?

atlantis.....ure replies are not gonna change my mind about how many Gods there are ....However, it will be great if u just return to the topic here, before mods close it...