Can anyone enlighten me as to why the present day sect of ismaili not declared as non-muslim in pakistan ?
even ameer-ul-munafiqeen zia ul haq who allegedly started “islamic reforms” didnt declare them non-muslim
why ?
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
Do the Ismailis and Aga khanis have same aqeedah?
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
I believe they're the samething. Two different names.
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
I am just surprised at the question and how its been asked. Do pakistan have the authority to keep people in Islam and kick them out ?? For goodness sake, if someone call themselves Muslim, let them call themselves Muslims. And beside, what good would it be for Pakistan and for the people of pakistan if they declare them non-muslim.. then what?
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
Yep! Pakistani religious groups and current 'Ameerul Momineen' are the best muslims and they should have the ultimate authority on Islam...lol
While at it, why not make Shia, Bohri and the likes, non-muslims......great!
We will be left with 'pure muslims' then, the best of the best!!!!!!!!
The thread has absolutely no sense.
I am just surprised at the question and how its been asked. Do pakistan have the authority to keep people in Islam and kick them out ?? For goodness sake, if someone call themselves Muslim, let them call themselves Muslims. And beside, what good would it be for Pakistan and for the people of pakistan if they declare them non-muslim.. then what?
Yep! Pakistani religious groups and current 'Ameerul Momineen' are the best muslims and they should have the ultimate authority on Islam...lol
While at it, why not make Shia, Bohri and the likes, non-muslims......great!
We will be left with 'pure muslims' then, the best of the best!!!!!!!!
The thread has absolutely no sense.
Just a clarification, Pakistan is not the only nation to have declared Ahmadiyya Movement and its followers as non-muslims. The same has been done in some african nations which are secular (namely Cape Town), thus making it somewhat of an international verdict because now more than 1 nation has done it.
TO: sorry for going off-topic there, i too don't know the exact details but it would be interesting to learn more.
Just a clarification, Pakistan is not the only nation to have declared Ahmadiyya Movement and its followers as non-muslims. The same has been done in some african nations which are secular (namely Cape Town), thus making it somewhat of an international verdict because now more than 1 nation has done it.
TO: sorry for going off-topic there, i too don't know the exact details but it would be interesting to get a hold documents of hearings that took place before Supreme Court resulting in the decision that was taken.
Still the question is inflammatory, useless and Pakistani must stop being the Pangay Baaz and implement goodness among themselves instead of trying to become authority over religion.
This is not the issue for Pakistani govt. or religious people to tackle at all.
Theft, robbery, cheating, bribery, corruption, healthcare crisis, energy crisis, pollution, noise and number of dirty roads is surging and we should just declare groups non-muslims?
If you believe hadeeth: Safai Nisf Iman Hai. (Cleanlines is half faith) Then the country and its people are living on less than 'other half Iman'....... which religious groups don't even talk about.
Very impressive 'brotherly' act between Pakistan and Cape Town. Really marvelous!
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
Those are all political steps, and should be discussed in Pakistan affairs. the TO has a valid question, and there is no harm in shedding light on the issue. as for “brotherly” act or not, i just stated a fact, because people seem to forget Pakistan isn’t the only country to have done it, so it’s not fair to constantly name one nation while totally ignoring the rest who have done the same.
carry on :k:
Just a clarification, Pakistan is not the only nation to have declared Ahmadiyya Movement and its followers as non-muslims. The same has been done in some african nations which are secular (namely Cape Town), thus making it somewhat of an international verdict because now more than 1 nation has done it.
TO: sorry for going off-topic there, i too don't know the exact details but it would be interesting to learn more.
I wouldnt even talk about capetown.. its not even an islamic country.. and btw.. capetown is the capital of south africa, so you cant take capetown as a whole nation. As far as Pakistan is concerned.. its pretty much the only country which first declare a community as non-muslim and then FORCE them.. i repeat, force them to act like non-muslims.... I mean , come on man.. its like you calling someone a donkey/dog ( in a fight or watever ) and then forcing them to actually act like one. You are free to declare them non-muslim ( since sunni's are the one ruling the country ) but forcing them to act like non-muslims ( its the case with jamaat e ahmadiyya in Pakistan.. laws which forbid them from saying adhaan, pray , say assalam o alaikum etc ).. this is pretty ridiculous. Pakistan is the only country in this sense..
Pakistan has no authority over who is Muslim and who is not.
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
i am ismaili.. n why should ismailis be declared non-muslims??? why not wahabis n deobandis??? or others?? n i'd say why was it even started in 1974??? to please the wahabi mullahs??? the constitution of pakistan really is a joke sorry to say.....
Can anyone enlighten me as to why the present day sect of ismaili not declared as non-muslim in pakistan ?
even ameer-ul-munafiqeen zia ul haq who allegedly started "islamic reforms" didnt declare them non-muslim
why ?
what makes u think ismailis (also known as aga khanis) be declared non-muslims... havent i alredy answered u in a thread i opened for questions about ismauilis/aga khanis???
calm down. i personally feel either state should enforce islam completely or not do a selective job. and yes i agree no one should force another to act a certain way, and all citizens should have their due rights.
now there’s a valid counter question. :k:
here’s one for you (genuine, cuz i’m not sure and want to know): don’t the followers of Aga Khan believe Quran to be a limited scripture that was specific to one time period, and can be amended? (I read somewhere)
Also, do Islamailis take Aga Khan as the walking/talking final verdict on religion and some sort of a prophet?
thanks.
re: Are Ismaili declared as non-muslim in pakistan?
hw can something be declared something which is already declared non muslims. So no new news here.
ismaili are declared non muslims on the basis of their aqeedah, in realtion to things like qadr i.e fate, sajda of mazaars ( i ve seen personally), Ismaili are ONLY one of few sects from Amongst Shia who are Declared non muslim across the Islamic World.
We say that they are non muslims, but at same time they have the same beleif that that we are right and those calling us non muslims are non muslims themselfs, its like calling an animal but to an animal we are animals to them.
they are non muslims i say once more just because of their Aqeeda, and if anyone wants details i will provide to those who will understand. :)
calm down. i personally feel either state should enforce islam completely or not do a selective job. and yes i agree no one should force another to act a certain way, and all citizens should have their due rights. .
Im all calmed. So, Pakistan is the only country in that regard?..do you agree? if not, please name any other muslim nation.
Do you agree with me when i say that Pakistan has no authority to declare anyone Muslim or non-Muslim?
Im all calmed. So, Pakistan is the only country in that regard?..do you agree? if not, please name any other muslim nation.
Do you agree with me when i say that Pakistan has no authority to declare anyone Muslim or non-Muslim?
ofcorse it has authority, obviously pakistan it self not gonna do it, pakistan has its wise scholars who provide the suppport and help in terms of Islamic Law and if required when it comes to extreme deliver a fatwa. and to declare this fatwa it needs a platform- the pakistani government, which it also did previously for the Ahmadi's-Qadyani alsoknown as Mirzaei.
btw, why dunt Ismaili pray Namaz - which is one of the main pillar of islam, do sajda to mazaars - ive seen with my own eyes Ismaili do sajda to the mazaar of Imam Hussain in cairo at Imam Hussain Mosque yet As a whole Islamic Ummah belives sajda is only for Allah swt, these two things could anyone clarify for now which are basic and if we go deeep, whats the aqeedah of ismaili on fate, good, bad etc.
here's one for you (genuine, cuz i'm not sure and want to know): don't the followers of Aga Khan believe Quran to be a limited scripture that was specific to one time period, and can be amended? (I read somewhere) Also, do Islamailis take Aga Khan as the walking/talking final verdict on religion and some sort of a prophet?
thanks.
im aga khani... n we believe that quran is NOT a limited scripture.. its for all times.. the one who can interpret the quran best is the imam of the time who is our 49th imam now... u guys know him as aga khan(the fourth). QURAN CANNOT BE AMENDED.. you r wrong, we only believe in him as an imam just like we do in hazrat ali A.S n all his successors... he is the final verdict as hazrat Ali A.S during his imamat was.. Hazrat Muhammad S.A.W called Hazrat Ali A.S as Quran-i-Natiq meaning talking quran.. it doesnt mean that hazrat ali A.S n all following imams r quran (nauzobillah) but it means that they have the final authority to interpret the quran because they r the succsssors of Rasoolullah S.A.W not as prophets but as imams.... DO U GET ALL I WROTE??? IF NOT, THEN ASK MORE..
hw can something be declared something which is already declared non muslims. So no new news here.
ismaili are declared non muslims on the basis of their aqeedah, in realtion to things like qadr i.e fate, sajda of mazaars ( i ve seen personally), Ismaili are ONLY one of few sects from Amongst Shia who are Declared non muslim across the Islamic World.
name one country in which ismailis r declared as non-muslims... how r u gonna name one, coz there isnt any in which ismailis r declared non-muslims... its not that easy bro....
there r no ismailis in iraq or egypt… i mean why r u lyin man??? why??? n no we dont do sajdah to anyone except ALLAH 
ofcorse it has authority, obviously pakistan it self not gonna do it, pakistan has its wise scholars who provide the suppport and help in terms of Islamic Law and if required when it comes to extreme deliver a fatwa. and to declare this fatwa it needs a platform- the pakistani government, which it also did previously for the Ahmadi's-Qadyani alsoknown as Mirzaei.
btw, why dunt Ismaili pray Namaz - which is one of the main pillar of islam, do sajda to mazaars - ive seen with my own eyes Ismaili do sajda to the mazaar of Imam Hussain in cairo at Imam Hussain Mosque yet As a whole Islamic Ummah belives sajda is only for Allah swt, these two things could anyone clarify for now which are basic and if we go deeep, whats the aqeedah of ismaili on fate, good, bad etc.
my question as i asked above is.. what benefit will it be for Pakistan and for the people of Pakistan if they declare whoever they want as non-muslims?.. based on your beliefs, you have the power to declare anyone non-muslim, but the question is, will this declaration of them being non-muslim also mean forcing them to be non-muslims?
PS: is the whole point of declaring other groups as non-muslim in the effort to prove that Islam doesnt have 72/73 sects anymore?.. declare one group non-muslim, so it becomes 71/72 sects.. is this the reason of declaring someone non-muslim??
PS2: will declaring someone non-muslim bring peace in the nation? Also, will you take away the international human right to practice whichever religion s/he choose to follow?
Thank you.
I, as an Ahmadi Muslim have no problem whatsoever if someone openly says that He is Muslim. My chest expands with pride when someone says s/he is the firm believer of Islam and love the holiest prophet Muhammad (sallallahu alaehe wassalam)…Surely, we will have different opinions and some belief difference within Islam.. but declaring you non-muslim is something i have no right or strength of.