I am not convinced your assumption is correct that ethics and morals can be derived only from religion.
its not an assumption.
Islam talks about from Fard to Mashara (an individual to an entire society).
Re: Intellectual show offs.
actually its the other way around. many religions r based on morality, morality is not based on religions.
theres a difference between arrogant asthiest and an asthiest. anyone can be arrogan and jst to burst every1's bubble many religious ppl i knw r arrogant. all astheists r not arrogant stop generalizing. its a matter of morality neither astheism nor religions!
actually its the other way around. many religions r based on morality, morality is not based on religions.
theres a difference between arrogant asthiest and an asthiest. anyone can be arrogan and jst to burst every1's bubble many religious ppl i knw r arrogant. all astheists r not arrogant stop generalizing. its a matter of morality neither astheism nor religions!
Make sense of this. Morality came from Religion, although Religion is based on Morality".
Re: Intellectual show offs.
so which religion is behind the current melt down
Muslims, naaaaaaaaaa
Catholics may be 
or what is that new religion worshiping owls aka NWO ppl
Re: Intellectual show offs.
i am yet to see hareem back up any of her claims about religions and morality, or on how atheism is a mockery of religions. plenty of low blows though.
Peace queer
I am here to support the stance of Mirch bhai and Hareem01 of course you would expect no other stance. I am not interested in debate antics with you or anyone. First of all to all extents and purposes Atheism is a religion. However, it is a religion the denies the existence of a supernatural Creator.
Whereas all traditional religions in the world are based on ‘belief’ atheim is itself grounded in ‘disbelief’.
To call or pass itself as a religion or even an order of morality is a mockery because it denies the essence of morality which is our sense of duty to God.
Then for all the wisdoms that have been revealed in scripture we see today a summation and borrowing of them and rebadging and passing off as “up for the picking” When religions attribute that we are at loss if we did not have prophets sent to us, that we if did not have God to Guide us then we would be lost that all the morals you find in our Books we attribute to God atheists you come along take them and pass them off as something people made up and then have the audacity to deny the very Entity that revealed those wisdoms to us, is a mockery.
And I am not impressed with atheism anyway and soon even atheists will themselves be unimpressed with atheism. I have a friend who used to call himself an atheist and now he says only fools call themselves atheists that he is now agnostic. Well he affiliates somewhat to pagans anyway. He understands more than anyone the shortfalls of atheism not because he believes in God, but rather because he cannot deny God. There is a subtly there that you may not see just yet.
Calling atheism a mockery of religion is not the words I would have chosen because to be honest it does not threaten me like some people are threatened by it. Rather it is the quickest way to realise that certain follies are made in belief. Many atheists are actually evolution supporters and like to call themselves athiests, but that is a whole new can of worms and a mockery in itself.
No, atheism is a mockery on the athiests not to religion … This can turn out to be a long debate but I’m not going to have one here on All Views so get it off your chest give me a “damn good” reply and feel good for yourself and let life move on.
actually its the other way around. many religions r based on morality, morality is not based on religions.
Peace kali billi
I'm not interested in the arrogant this and that at this stage because it causes too many factors for consideration.
What I am interested in is that you have interpreted "morality coming from religion" to mean that "morality is based on religion" ... these are two different things.
Morality would not have been discovered had it not been for religion. Once it was discovered it was then turned into a subject for study and it can then be shown in retrospect that all religions harbour success because they are 'based on morality' ...
To be based on morality it does not mean that the morality is pre-existent of religion. Rather religion came first revealed through scripture and prophet and people analysed the revelations to arrive at what was understood to be morality. To prove this morals are found in all religious works but there is no such thing as morality outside of religion if there is then please show me. Oh, by the way the condition is that the morals have to be totally outside religious circles for them to be counted and pre-historic or older than current scripture for you to be correct ... can you meet the challenge?
pysah,
while i don't want to make this into a why atheism appeals to some people, let me address a few of the points you bring up.
Whereas all traditional religions in the world are based on 'belief' atheim is itself grounded in 'disbelief'.
false. every religion is grounded in disbelief or every other religion and god(s).
[quote]
To call or pass itself as a religion or even an order of morality is a mockery because it denies the essence of morality which is our sense of duty to God.
[/quote]
as an entity the atheist is convinced does not exist, he has no sense of duty towards your concept of God. just as you do not have any sense of duty towards Zeus or Brahma or Thor. Such circular logic arguments are directed not at the atheist, but at your own flock.
[quote]
Then for all the wisdoms that have been revealed in scripture we see today a summation and borrowing of them and rebadging and passing off as "up for the picking" When religions attribute that we are at loss if we did not have prophets sent to us, that we if did not have God to Guide us then we would be lost that all the morals you find in our Books we attribute to God atheists you come along take them and pass them off as something people made up and then have the audacity to deny the very Entity that revealed those wisdoms to us, is a mockery.
[/quote]
once again, just because scripture claims itself to be holy does not make it holy to anyone but the believer.
[quote]
No, atheism is a mockery on the athiests not to religion ... This can turn out to be a long debate but I'm not going to have one here on All Views so get it off your chest give me a "damn good" reply and feel good for yourself and let life move on.
[/QUOTE]
haha. peace indeed.
Morality would not have been discovered had it not been for religion.
False.
Morality and ethics are not inventions or discoveries of religions. These are social concepts, not religious. Religions prescribe certain ethics and morals though. Ones that invariably over the passage of time turn impractical and unimplementable. eg., It used to be morally acceptable to stone people to death in public, or burn them at the stake, or to marry siblings. You will find people willing to live by these primitive morals are diminishing in number even though they have always been believers in religions, and not atheists.
False.
Morality and ethics are not inventions or discoveries of religions. These are social concepts, not religious. Religions prescribe certain ethics and morals though. Ones that invariably over the passage of time turn impractical and unimplementable. eg., It used to be morally acceptable to stone people to death in public, or burn them at the stake, or to marry siblings. You will find people willing to live by these primitive morals are diminishing in number even though they have always been believers in religions, and not atheists.
Peace queer
You are talking about a secular sense of morality ... this is not atheistic at all. People who are devout to religion will adhere to the rules of their religious penal systems ... it never has been considered moral to stone people to death in public for no reason. Rather you should have used the word 'stone criminals' ... yes today people are less inclined to do that because today they have started to follow their emotional senses than their sense of morals.
Every moral person will say that a criminal should be punished in equal to the crime he/she did or forgiven if possible. These values have been with us from the times when people were still stoning to death so please don't make it out that secular values have led to a greater sense of morality either.
Burning people at stake may be an immoral practice and I don't think it has ever been viewed by religious orders as a moral thing. For something to be socially acceptable does not make it immoral or moral ... Right and Wrong, are not subject to public opinion ... the Divine Rules such as "no fornication" is not subject to vote ... it is a Divine Rule that must be obeyed and it is moral to do so.
Atheism also is not a new concept it has always been around there have always been dissenters to religion because it is a trait in some people to do what they wish and not to submit their moral sense of duty to God verily they deny it exists.
thumbs-up
Psyah Bhai, why don’t you let hareem answer for herself..? :halo:
I want to read her take since she’s the one that called it a ‘disease’
Re: Intellectual show offs.
Peace Gina~
After stating her answers with explanation and those explanations are dismissed ... along with mine is there any benefit to continue? ... Instead of questioning the postulate seek inwardly to see if there is any truth in it. Disease? Well what is disease?
It is simple enough for us to answer for ourselves so why insist someone to continually justify themselves?
Peace queer
You are talking about a secular sense of morality ... this is not atheistic at all. People who are devout to religion will adhere to the rules of their religious penal systems ... it never has been considered moral to stone people to death in public for no reason. Rather you should have used the word 'stone criminals' ... yes today people are less inclined to do that because today they have started to follow their emotional senses than their sense of morals.
Every moral person will say that a criminal should be punished in equal to the crime he/she did or forgiven if possible. These values have been with us from the times when people were still stoning to death so please don't make it out that secular values have led to a greater sense of morality either.
Burning people at stake may be an immoral practice and I don't think it has ever been viewed by religious orders as a moral thing. For something to be socially acceptable does not make it immoral or moral ... Right and Wrong, are not subject to public opinion ... the Divine Rules such as "no fornication" is not subject to vote ... it is a Divine Rule that must be obeyed and it is moral to do so.
Atheism also is not a new concept it has always been around there have always been dissenters to religion because it is a trait in some people to do what they wish and not to submit their moral sense of duty to God verily they deny it exists.
succinctly put.
it’s a disease of heart, a spiritual disease that leads to pride and hedonism.
Mainly its the stress on scientific knowledge that makes people that way. They lose touch with the reality of al-ghaib. Things unseen that exist in a shifted realm that the human mind cannot comprehend.
Psyah Bhai it's an observation.. once hareem posts and is cornered with questions.. you come back to reply. Let her answer for herself.. if she's capable enuff to make bold statements, let her support her statements with logic too instead of picking on members and posting sarcastic and flippant replies.
Re: Intellectual show offs.
it's a disease of heart, a spiritual disease that leads to pride and hedonism.
one could claim equally well that it is blind belief in god(s) that leads to pride and hedonism. just the idea that i don't need to think actions through because it is divine commandment for me to seek the ultimate pleasures of heaven.
Psyah Bhai it's an observation.. once hareem posts and is cornered with questions.. you come back to reply. Let her answer for herself.. if she's capable to make bold statements, let her support her statements with logic too instead of picking on members and posting sarcastic and flippant replies.
yeah right....being harsh doesn't make me wrong. If you have something against what i've said then present your argument instead of talking about your observation which have nothing to do with the topic.
one could claim equally well that it is blind belief in god(s) that leads to pride and hedonism.
you can claim it but you can't justify it.
Re: Intellectual show offs.
how does hedonism coincide with religion?