A man can have sexual pleasure from a child as young as a baby. However, he should not penetrate; sodomising the child is OK. If the man penetrates and damages the child then he should be responsible for her subsistence all her life. This girl, however, does not count as one of his four permanent wives. The man will not be eligible to marry the girl's sister.
Ayatollah Khomeini
It is better for a girl to marry in such a time when she would begin menstruation at her husband's house rather than her father's home. Any father marrying his daughter so young will have a permanent place in heaven.
Ayatollah Khomeini
A man can have sex with animals such as sheeps, cows, camels and so on. However, he should kill the animal after he has his orgasm. He should not sell the meat to the people in his own village; however, selling the meat to the next door village should be fine.
Ayatollah Khomeini
(Quotes above are from Khomeini's book, Tahrirolvasyleh, vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990, Source: Homa)
If one commits the act of sodomy with a cow, an ewe, or a camel, their urine and their excrements become impure, and even their milk may no longer be consumed. The animal must then be killed and as quickly as possible and burned.
Ayatollah Khomeini
(From The Little Green Book: Sayings of Ayatollah Khomeini, Political, Phylosophica, Social and Religious, with a special introduction by Clive Irving, ISBN number0-553-14032-9, page 47 Source: Homa)
Eleven things are impure: urine, excrement, sperm...non-Moslem men and women...and the sweat of an excrement-eating camel.
Ayatollah Khomeini
(From The Little Green Book, Source: Harwood's Mythology's Last Gods, 175)
Commentary on the Koran and Islam
Mohammed promised his followers seven heavens in which:
They are to cohabit with demure virgins...as beauteous as corals and rubies...full-breasted maidens for playmates...in the gardens of delight.... They're to lie face to face on jewelled couches, and be serviced by immortal youths...young boys, their personal property, as comely as virgin pearls.... We created the houris [dancing girls] and made them virgins, carnal playmates for those on the right hand.... We are going to wed them to dark-eyed houris. [The Koran 55:56; 55:58; 78:33; 56:12; 52:16-17, 24; 56:35-38; 52:20]
Each Muslim man, in exchange for a lifetime of mindless obedience, was to be rewarded after death with an unspecified number of pretty boys to bugger, plus eight heavenly houris, each more phallus-raising than the others and each endowed with the capacity to grow a new hymen after each bout of sexual recreation. The male chauvinist Muslim could thus satisfy his virginity fetish by deflowering them over and over again, for eternity. When one compares Mohammed's gardens of delight with the Christian heaven of harps and celibacy, it becomes apparent why significant numbers of Christian men turn Muslim while conversions the other way are almost non-existent.
William Harwood, Mythology's Last Gods: Yahweh and Jesus, 248
Ibrahim says: Hey sundaram, can you give the exact references for your post on
Ayatollah Khomeini
[quote]
1) (Quotes above are from Khomeini's book, Tahrirolvasyleh, vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990, Source: Homa)
2) (From The Little Green Book: Sayings of Ayatollah Khomeini, Political, Phylosophica, Social and Religious, with a special introduction by Clive Irving, ISBN number0-553-14032-9, page 47 Source: Homa)
3) (From The Little Green Book, Source: Harwood's Mythology's Last Gods, 175)
4) William Harwood, Mythology's Last Gods: Yahweh and Jesus, 248
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: can you tell me how many books are these and are they the page numbers and what does the source Homa suppose to mean?? Is there a URL for this ?
Also the correct ISBN Numbers and their publishers Please. Thanks.
Could it be that an important textbook is proselytizing American 12-year-olds to convert to Islam?
The book in question is “Across the Centuries” (Houghton Mifflin, 2nd edition, 1999), a 558-page history that covers the millennium and a half between the fall of Rome and the French Revolution. In the multicultural spirit, about half of its eight sections are devoted to the West, and the other four deal with Islam, Africa, Asian empires, and pre-Columbian America.
“Across the Centuries” is a handsome artifact, well written, packed with original graphics, and generally achieving the publisher’s goal that “students learn best when they are fascinated by what they are learning.”
At the same time, there is much in it one can argue with, such as its idiosyncratic coverage of subjects (sub-Saharan Africa gets four times more space than India?). But the really serious problem concerns the covert propagation of Islam, which takes four forms:
Apologetics: Everything Islamic is praised; every problem is swept under the rug.
Students learn about Islam’s “great cultural flowering,” but nothing about the later centuries of statis and decline. They read repeatedly about the Muslims’ broadmindedness (they “were extremely tolerant of those they conquered”) but not a word about their violence (such as the massacres carried out by Muhammad’s troops against the Jews of Banu Qurayza).
Distortion: Jihad, which means “sacred war,” turns into a struggle mainly “to do one’s best to resist temptation and overcome evil.” Islam gives women “clear rights” not available in some other societies, such as the right to an education? This ignores the self-evident fact that Muslim women enjoy fewer rights than perhaps any other in the world. (“Across the Centuries” implicitly acknowledges this reality by blaming “oppressive local traditions” for their circumstances.)
Identification as Muslims: Homework assignments repeatedly involve mock-Muslim exercises. “Form small groups of students to build a miniature mosque.” Or: “You leave your home in Alexandria for the pilgrimage to Mecca. . . . write a letter describing your route, the landscapes and peoples you see as you travel and any incidents that happen along the way. Describe what you see in Mecca.”
And then there is this shocker: “Assume you are a Muslim soldier on your way to conquer Syria in the year A.D. 635. Write three journal entries that reveal your thoughts about Islam, fighting in battle, or life in the desert.”
Piety: The textbook endorses key articles of Islamic faith. It informs students as a historical fact that Ramadan is holy “because in this month Muhammad received his first message from Allah.” It asserts that "the very first word the angel Gabriel spoke to Muhammad was ‘Recite.’ " It explains that Arabic lettering “was used to write down God’s words as they had been given to Muhammad.” And it declares that the architecture of a mosque in Spain allows Muslims “to feel Allah’s invisible presence.”
Similarly, the founder of Islam is called “the prophet Muhammad,” implying acceptance of his mission. (School textbooks scrupulously avoid the term Jesus Christ in favor of Jesus of Nazareth)
I’ll get to a zillion depraved hadiths after this from hadith reference sources.
[This message has been edited by sundaram (edited March 14, 2002).]
A comphrehensive list of Muhammmad’s wives & concubines and the validity of scrapping the labia in the name of circumcission. The reason given would tickle a gynec. to lunacy. http://www.light-of-life.com/eng/reveal/r5405et7.htm#p123
Ibrahim,read the reason and lets argue.
[This message has been edited by sundaram (edited March 14, 2002).]
A comphrehensive resource guide to female genital mutilation.3/4rths of the countries are Islamic. Again read the reasons given by the word of god. Absolutely hilarious. http://www.religioustolerance.org/fem_cirm.htm
I asked you a simple question in simple english, now answer me with exact info
** let me repeat**
Ibrahim says: Hey sundaram, can you give the exact references for your post on
Ayatollah Khomeini
[quote]
1) (Quotes above are from Khomeini's book, Tahrirolvasyleh, vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990, Source: Homa)
2) (From The Little Green Book: Sayings of Ayatollah Khomeini, Political, Phylosophica, Social and Religious, with a special introduction by Clive Irving, ISBN number0-553-14032-9, page 47 Source: Homa)
3) (From The Little Green Book, Source: Harwood's Mythology's Last Gods, 175)
4) William Harwood, Mythology's Last Gods: Yahweh and Jesus, 248
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: ** can you tell me how many books are these and are they the page numbers and what does the source Homa suppose to mean?? Is there a URL for this ?
Also the correct ISBN Numbers and their publishers Please. **
The title & author of the book is given.Search with it even if the given ISBN no. is wrong. They have mentioned Ayatollah’s book
Khomeini’s book, Tahrirolvasyleh, vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990,
"The world holds two classes of men - intelligent men without religion, and religious men without intelligence." - Abu'l-Ala-Al-Ma'arri (973-1057) Syrian poet.
Ibrahim says : huh!! are you mad already sundaram?
I asked you for info on the books you have mentioned and the source you have given and you come back and ask me references on puranas???
Where have I mentioned purana in this thread? and why is it difficult for you to establish the credibility of your source, after repeated requests, you keep posting more nonsense!!
** Lets me expose your EVIL dissemination of FALSE information on this forum. **
Ibrahim says: ** Dear Readers **
since sundaram has been trying to hide without giving me a reply by posting more and more nonsense like the above .
I made a search for the books as mentioned above and this is what I have noted so far.
The search was made through amazon .com for the titles and ISBN number sundaram provided as his source.
I searched for ** ISBN number 0-553-14032-9** as mentioned by sudaram, I get 0 result
I searched for ** The Little Green Book** as mentioned by sundaram I get o result
Ibrahim says: This book is about Christianity and the pages he gives as containing info on Islam seems FALSE, since only 4 pages ( from page 371 to 375 and clearly marked as appendix A) at the end of book is with regards to the Koran and the rest of the info is about Christianity as mentioned in the table of contents ( visit above link for verification)
THUS IT GOES WITHOUT SAYING THIS FILTHY AND VILE HINDU IS TRYING TO SLANDER THE SHIA UNJUSTLY.
** So sundaram, unless you can proof me otherwise and redeem your credibility before you get banned for spreading falsehood and mud slinging in this religious forum , please do so. **
regards
Ibrahim
** When you sling mud, only your hands get dirty **
lie,
Same thread, message no 4, pg 2.you quote the matsya purana.
DEAR READERS,
THIS GENTLEMAN LIES ON THIS TRIVIAL ASPECT.A FACT SO EASILY VERIFIABLE,HE LIES UPON WITH ELAN.
Please provide verifiable links from theology sites to I conclusively trash each one of youe “quotes” on the puranas & Upanishads until you can even come up with a semblence of a source leave alone a credible one at that.
The first reference provided is this Quotes above are from Khomeini’s book, “Tahrirolvasyleh”, vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990
A man of minimal intellect will realize that a book need not be available with Amazon to exist. Its a deliberate twist to provide make believe evidence. Have I claimed it exits in amazon. By that yardstick none of the vernacular classics say in Tamil would exist. Why , because Amazon does not have it. And nowhere does it claim that Clive Irving wrote the book.
The book may exist but I did not base the conclusion on just this.
Does this book “Tahrirolvasyleh” pruportedly written by Khoemeni exist. Goto google and type the search string “Tahrirolvasyleh”.Look at the number of citations you get to you.
Are all these sources lying in quoting from this book leave alone its existence. All the authors have simply quoted from it. If this is not enough sources in justifying my claim, how in the world is a person who has simply quoted stuff without providing a whit of evidence to back his quotes credible.
[quote]
Originally posted by sundaram:
. Yes they have gotten their ISBN number wrong but that in no way takes out the truth of what has been said.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: sundaram dear, it is not only the ISBN problem , there is no such book called the The little green book (according to Amazon .com) so tell us where we can get this book and who published it??
Second Clive has no such title to his name either, so who authored it?
[quote]
lie, Same thread, message no 4, pg 2.you quote the matsya purana.
DEAR READERS, THIS GENTLEMAN LIES ON THIS TRIVIAL ASPECT.A FACT SO EASILY VERIFIABLE,HE LIES UPON WITH ELAN.
Please provide verifiable links from theology sites to I conclusively trash each one of youe "quotes" on the puranas & Upanishads until you can even come up with a semblence of a source leave alone a credible one at that.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says LOL! You must be indeed a very silly person, since Matsya Purana and the rest of the books I have quoted is a part of Hinduism, but if hindus do not place them on the web that does not mean, it does not exist. It should be obvious why they do not place many parts of hindu scriptures on the web . but hindus will have little knowledge to comprehend such matters.
** Now show me a Hindu theology web site , which hosts all the contents of all the hindu scriptures in their entirety and I will show you the verse I have quoted in them. ** IF you cannot find all the scriptures of Hinduism on the net, ask the hindus WHY, since they are 800 million hindus and they are very well versed with IT knowledge to place all of them on the web??
BTW ask the hindu theologians why only a few of their books have complete English translations without any search capabilities on the web ???
[quote]
The first reference provided is this Quotes above are from Khomeini's book, "Tahrirolvasyleh", vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990
[/quote]
Ibrahim says; with regards to this title, you have to ask the shia’s since as far as I know I have never heard of it and if there is such a book, obviously it has nothing to do with Islam, for in Islam we have the Qur’an and the Hadiths. These two are the Primary and secondary source for Islam.
[quote]
A man of minimal intellect will realize that a book need not be available with Amazon to exist. Its a deliberate twist to provide make believe evidence. Have I claimed it exits in amazon. By that yardstick none of the vernacular classics say in Tamil would exist. Why , because Amazon does not have it. And nowhere does it claim that Clive Irving wrote the book. The book may exist but I did not base the conclusion on just this.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: hey sundaram do you ever read and understand what I said??? Try reading my post again!!
I listed the way I tried to track down the info you gave me, because you failed to respond after repeated requests and even after that I gave you room to clear your name.
second you mentioned clive not me!!
Read what you posted and STOP telling lies.
2) (From** The Little Green Book** : Sayings of Ayatollah Khomeini, Political, Phylosophica, Social and Religious, with a special introduction by ** Clive Irving, ISBN number0-553-14032-9** , page 47 Source: Homa)
I also asked you your source homa , and I see no answer??
[quote]
Does this book "Tahrirolvasyleh" pruportedly written by Khoemeni exist. Goto google and type the search string "Tahrirolvasyleh".Look at the number of citations you get to you. Are all these sources lying in quoting from this book leave alone its existence. All the authors have simply quoted from it. If this is not enough sources in justifying my claim, how in the world is a person who has simply quoted stuff without providing a whit of evidence to back his quotes credible.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says : Hey sundaram, a name coming up in google does not mean such a name has Validity or was NEVER invented by those who wanted to invent them but only a fool will believe the spiritual leader of the shias would talk nonsense.
Now ask this question to the shia, ask them why their leader said such and such and you will get your response.
On my part I only searched for the English titles you mentioned and not books of other origin…get it???
[quote]
And in creating make belive evidence Ibrahim has conveniently side stepped the fact that the specific reference to Ayesha's status. I reproduce it:
Scriptural Evidence Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64: Sahih Bukhari
Could you please reproduce it for me and comment on it.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says You mean I must entertain you again and again, when I had already explained what was practiced in the past and given evidence from hindu scriptures to proof that such were the traditions in the past which are still being practiced in India to this day.
[quote]
A mistake with an ISBN no. in no way hides the truth of assertions. At best its a temporary aberration
[/quote]
Ibrahim says : Do us a favor, show me where the “The little Green book” can be viewed, or purchased , so that we can be sure it is only a temporary aberration!
Then show us in what page of the Book “Mythology's Last Gods: Yahweh and Jesus” , 248, was your earlier quotes excerpted from??
Sundaram, ** OVER 90% of the Muslims are Sunnis** - so please try quoting from a Sunni source. It doesn't matter what Khomeini said because ** I know Khomeini said and did a lot of nasty things**. You will hardly find an ethnic African Shia, or a European Shia (with the exception of Azerbaijan and some Turks), or a Chinese Shia or a Shia from the far-east.
** If you are quoting Khomeini, then you are only attacking Shias, not mainstream Islam, because (1) You are leaving out over 90% of the Muslims and (2)Shias usually call themselves Shia Muslims, while Sunnis usually call themselves just Muslims. **
Try harder next time. !
[This message has been edited by Indian_Muslim (edited March 14, 2002).]
indian muslim shia represent more persian
nationalism and sunni arab if you scratch
the surface.pakistan more punjabi sunni.
despite the religen strong pre-islamic
ethnic racial factors still play a major role.
Ibrahim says: sundaram dear, it is not only the ISBN problem , there is no such book called the The little green book (according to Amazon .com) so tell us where we can get this book and who published it??
Second Clive has no such title to his name either, so who authored it?
SUNDARAM>>>The ISBN no. they had mentioned correlated to another book. Does it mean the book they have mentioned should not exist. And you are lying again. The site simply never said clive authored it,it just says he wrote a special introduction to it. So searching for it under his name is kind of stupid.
quote:
lie, Same thread, message no 4, pg 2.you quote the matsya purana.
DEAR READERS, THIS GENTLEMAN LIES ON THIS TRIVIAL ASPECT.A FACT SO EASILY VERIFIABLE,HE LIES UPON WITH ELAN.
Please provide verifiable links from theology sites to I conclusively trash each one of youe “quotes” on the puranas & Upanishads until you can even come up with a semblence of a source leave alone a credible one at that.
Ibrahim says LOL! You must be indeed a very silly person, since Matsya Purana and the rest of the books I have quoted is a part of Hinduism, but if hindus do not place them on the web that does not mean, it does not exist. It should be obvious why they do not place many parts of hindu scriptures on the web . but hindus will have little knowledge to comprehend such matters.
SUNDARAM>>>You tend to laugh & give yourself away. First you were nailed for a imminently verifiable lie. You are trying to cover it by laughing. As I told you in one of my previous posts,its a sure sign of mental weakness.
Now show me a Hindu theology web site , which hosts all the contents of all the hindu scriptures in their entirety and I will show you the verse I have quoted in them. IF you cannot find all the scriptures of Hinduism on the net, ask the hindus WHY, since they are 800 million hindus and they are very well versed with IT knowledge to place all of them on the web??
BTW ask the hindu theologians why only a few of their books have complete English translations without any search capabilities on the web ???
SUNDARAM>>>
DEAR READERS THIS GENTLEMAN HAS JUST SAID THIS
“I QUOTED STUFF CLAIMING ITS FROM HINDU SCRIPTURES. BUT I WILL CANNOT GIVE A WHIT OF VERIFIABLE EVIDENCE FOR THE VILE SLANDER. NOW SINCE HINDUS DO NOT HAVE WEBSITES TO THESE SOURCES ALL I SAID IS MORE TRUE NOW–THEY ARE ASHAMED. I WILL CONTINUE TO CONCOCT MORE AND ITS OBSVIOUSLY TRUE.WHY, BECAUSE HINDUS HAVEN’T PUT UP WEBSITES WITH THE ENTIRE TEXT OF THE SCRIPTURE.SO MY HEADY CONCOCTIONS ARE INDEED REALITY,SILLY”
This is negative IQ stuff and beneath me to attempt an explanation.
I do not know of any specific theology sites for the puranas but here are my favoutites: http://www.valmikiramayan.net/—6 kandas,537 chapters. http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Bridge/1771/Desh/Mb/mb.html–Sweet beautiful rendition in Lakshmanan’s true simple style. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bhakti-list/–A dissection of Sri Vaishnava theology from the likes of IIM grads to the elderly . http://www.bhagavad-gita.org/–A rendition of the gita. Each verse is sweetly recited,the stuff from sanskrit is translated. I would urge all hindus to spend some time on it each day. http://www.san.beck.org/EC7-Vedas.html#2—A comphrehensive account of the spirit of the Vedas and Upanishads. Long,detailed and historically accurate with dates. http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/7348/–I highly recommend this. A fine collection of articles trying to correlate Para Brahmam to reality. http://www.msci.memphis.edu/~ramamurt/srk_phil.html—Radhakrishnan, gets my vote for the finest ambassdor of hinduism. Held the prestigious Spalding chair at Oxford,was President, General Conference of UNESCO from 1952-54. He held the office of the Chancellor, University of Delhi, from 1953-62. From May 1962 to May 1967, he was the President of India. Have a look at his collection of works on hinduism.Sadly, the it does not have links to the works itself but if you are intersted in works of scholarship on hinduism,these are the stuff to look into.
I read a funny claim of yours, that “You actively read scriptures”
Lets start. All hindu scriptures are in Sanskrit. Assuming you read the English translation, may I have the names of the authors who have translated it and their authentic credentials so that I can start to verify if they are individuals of any credit. Let me give you an example. One of the best renditions of the Mahabaratha in English is by Dr.C.Rajagopalachari. He translated each sanskrit verse of Veda Vyasa into English and submitted his work for widespread academic scrutiny to check if the translations/interpretations were indeed correct. The Indian Council of Historic research certifies to the authenticity of the translation from the original. Give me such equivalent authors to the puranas.
quote:
The first reference provided is this Quotes above are from Khomeini’s book, “Tahrirolvasyleh”, vol. 4, Darol Elm, Gom, Iran, 1990
Ibrahim says; with regards to this title, you have to ask the shia’s since as far as I know I have never heard of it and if there is such a book, obviously it has nothing to do with Islam, for in Islam we have the Qur’an and the Hadiths. These two are the Primary and secondary source for Islam.
SUNDARAM>>>Cool,the proclaimed spiritual leader of Islam whose only duty is to correctly interpret the Quran for the masses has written a book. But that’s irreleant. Readers make your own conclusions.
quote:
A man of minimal intellect will realize that a book need not be available with Amazon to exist. Its a deliberate twist to provide make believe evidence. Have I claimed it exits in amazon. By that yardstick none of the vernacular classics say in Tamil would exist. Why , because Amazon does not have it. And nowhere does it claim that Clive Irving wrote the book. The book may exist but I did not base the conclusion on just this.
Ibrahim says: hey sundaram do you ever read and understand what I said??? Try reading my post again!!
I listed the way I tried to track down the info you gave me, because you failed to respond after repeated requests and even after that I gave you room to clear your name.
second you mentioned clive not me!!
SUNDARAM>>>I gave you the url. I reproduce it here http://anet.net/~acharya/truth/islamquotes.htm
its just trivialities you are hiding behind for two reasons. One to cover up your lie which I exposed and two to refrain from answering a specific question on Mohammad’s pedophilia.
Read what you posted and STOP telling lies.
(From The Little Green Book : Sayings of Ayatollah Khomeini, Political, Phylosophica, Social and Religious, with a special introduction by Clive Irving, ISBN number0-553-14032-9 , page 47 Source: Homa)
I also asked you your source homa , and I see no answer??
SUNDARAM>>>Read again my dear. Does is say clive is an author. It simply says he gave a special introduction.Readers make your judgement. He is reinforcing a trivial lie of his.
As reagrds to homa I first gave you a link from which this was extrcated. I reproduce it below http://anet.net/~acharya/truth/islamquotes.htm
When you click on it,the passage appears as part of this and Homa is in hyperlinks. What does that mean? You just need to click on it to figure out what it is. Do go ahead and do it now. A monkey at Cornell could recently click a mouse on a hyperlink. Give it a shot.
quote:
Does this book “Tahrirolvasyleh” pruportedly written by Khoemeni exist. Goto google and type the search string “Tahrirolvasyleh”.Look at the number of citations you get to you. Are all these sources lying in quoting from this book leave alone its existence. All the authors have simply quoted from it. If this is not enough sources in justifying my claim, how in the world is a person who has simply quoted stuff without providing a whit of evidence to back his quotes credible.
Ibrahim says : Hey sundaram, a name coming up in google does not mean such a name has Validity or was NEVER invented by those who wanted to invent them but only a fool will believe the spiritual leader of the shias would talk nonsense.
SUNDARAM>>>Cool. Here is Indian_Muslim degrading him and you say only a fool would believe the spiritual leader of the shias would say such depraved things. And the links that google returned were diverse and any any sane person would be convinced that the whole thing was not a concoction.
Now ask this question to the shia, ask them why their leader said such and such and you will get your response.
On my part I only searched for the English titles you mentioned and not books of other origin…get it???
SUNDARAM>>>And one of the books you did manage to find you petulantly dismissed as christian slander.Its the same story.Any scrutiny by Jews,Christians or Hindus if forbidden for the fear of pulling you down from the high donkey of self-importance.
quote:
And in creating make belive evidence Ibrahim has conveniently side stepped the fact that the specific reference to Ayesha’s status. I reproduce it:
Scriptural Evidence Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64: Sahih Bukhari
Could you please reproduce it for me and comment on it.
Ibrahim says You mean I must entertain you again and again, when I had already explained what was practiced in the past and given evidence from hindu scriptures to proof that such were the traditions in the past which are still being practiced in India to this day.
SUNDARAM>>>I puke on the scriptures that say child sex is legal. You have passed off what can be most generously described as concoctions as hindu scriptures. But I gave solid evidence to prove that the act of child penetration by Muhammad took place
AND BRAVO YOU ACCEPT IT.
Assuming even for a moment that child sex was condoned by hindusim, my response is get rid of that depravity. Its a disgrace on the religion. NOW SAY THIS ABOUT MUHAMMAD IF YOU EVER REALIZE WHAT A PEVERTED ACT PENETRATING A CHILD IS.
quote:
A mistake with an ISBN no. in no way hides the truth of assertions. At best its a temporary aberration
Ibrahim says : Do us a favor, show me where the “The little Green book” can be viewed, or purchased , so that we can be sure it is only a temporary aberration!
SUNDARAM>>>Hide behind more trivialities.Its your birth right.
I don’t intend wasting more time on your concoctions.Good luck and wish you the best in future.
Ibrahim says : which book did it co relate to??? And why are you not answering my questions, where did the little green book go to as mentioned by you??
WHO AUTHORED THE LITTLE GREEN BOOK??
Ibrahim says: As you admitted before you are deranged (sorry no way to come to any other conclusion) , If I laugh it means, I consider your works silly or funny or was too easy for me, get it? It also means no matter how hard you try to annoy or anger me by slandering Islam by your repeated foul posts , it has NO EFFECT on me, get it??
** BTW where did you nail me and on what? **
Like I asked before have you gone mad, since when I ask questions you keep posting other unrelated stuff or repeat post the same message again or ask unrelated question, sort of tell us you have problems doesn’t it ?
Ibrahim says ; can you tell me where I said the above as you have written word for word or shall we say that, ** your brains was only capable of conceiving as such?? **
My reply to you as above was for your request on purana links , for which you yourself say below
I quote
Ibrahim says: Now explain to me why you do not know any purana links and why you do not have the ability to search for them or is there a reason why hindus do not want to host their Vedas, Upanishads puranas or smrtis in its entirety on the web???
Ibrahim says : LOL, can you tell me where in the above web sites** is the entire Vedas, Upanishads, smrti’s and puranas can be located,** as that was my question to you ??
Ibrahim says: Firstly how you know what I know and what I know not??? Second can you tell us as to your credentials so that we can be sure that you will know every hindu and other Sanskrit scholars on this planet??
Second I had indeed given some names to hindus ( when they tried this trick, so you are not the first and will not be the last) in the past and they came back and claimed no such person exists, even though the guy had authored books, seems as though you want to play this game with me, which your brethren had already played before, so you are late, but keep trying , sooner or later you might get lucky
Ibrahim says: First we will take your word for it that he is the best and you say he completed the entire mahabrata (100,000 verses, whgich BTW was less then 10,000 verses when its was in its original state as compsed by veda vaysa and known as JAYA) into English . can you tell us where we can view his works of the 100, 000 verses , give ISBN and link , where possible
Second you mean the The Indian Council of Historic research is an authority, which certifies scholars and only theu can translate hindu scriptures ? Kindly provide their authority.
BTW, just out of curiosity and who were the certified people who translated the other scriptures in Hinduism into English or does each hindu scholar may translate what he likes as he knows best ?
Third did he ONLY translated the Mahabarata and NEVER translated the VEDA or Upanishad or Purana??
Why was that??
Is the mahabarata more important than the veda, smrti or Upanishad in Hinduism???
Ibrahim says : This show how ignorant you are. ** When and where did the shia leader have or given authority to correctly interpret the Qur’an???** Islam does not have any spiritual leader, the Shia have it and that is their business, which has nothing to do with Islam . Go and find out more before you make a mockery of yourself.
Ibrahim says: you must be sick,** you did not give URL in the first instance and even after requesting for info twice on this thread, you kept posting more nonsense I got NO answer or URL , until I exposed you,** you came up with the above URL ( which I have yet to visit since that does not mean you have provided answers to my questions) , Thus it still does not solve the issue , does it,** I asked you who wrote the title The little green book and where in the other book, your excerpt was taken from **
CARE TO ANSWER??
Ibrahim says: GO above to the beginning of this post and read the words marked in bold!!. .UNDERSTAND now?? why I asked who is the Author and to be sure, I had checked out Clive and he did not Author any book jointly with any others which had any tile like the little green book or sayings of komeni , My search still came up blank …get it??
Ibrahim says you must be silly, why do you think I searched for the little green book and the ISBN first?? Which came up blank!!! Only after which I went to search under clive to see whether he jointly author any of the title you mentioned.
Ibrahim says : hmmm either you must be blind or deaf, since I asked at the very beginning who is the Author for the little green book, repeatedly and instead of giving an answer you keep twisting and turning!!!
Up till now you have by your hindu spin doctoring not responded to my question. Shall we say that you have a problem or shall we say that you are just a pathetic deceiver, who is trying your best to avoid giving the answers???
Ibrahim says: What Indian Muslim is saying is valid and I won’t disagree with him, which is based on what he knows about shi’ism with regards to Islam but what we are talking about and I am saying is with regards to what you posted concerning certain issues which has nothing to do with Islam which NO human being will have said. So If you do not understand what I mean or what Indian Muslim is implying , ask and I would have given answers according to context of what you posted not on other matters.
Ibrahim says : man you have a dirty mind for sure! What I said and asked was in which page of that book was the excerpt written in that book, since it was all about Christianity and not about Islam and it only contain 4 pages concerning the Qur’an as an appendix at the end. ** Show me where I said that book slandered Islam??? **
FOR WHICH I HAVE NO REPLY BUT THIS ADDED TWIST…man you are one sick person. Totally vile and deceptive in character.
Ibrahim says : You must be a mentally retarded person since I had not quoted any scripture saying child sex is legal except the hindu scriptures which I as a Muslim do not accept and consider it as nothing less then trash but study it in order to realize why the hindus have ended up so vile in nature.
Now when a person reaches puberty, it mean that person has reached adulthood in many traditions
In case your brains have little capacity to comprehend this , let me help you by quoting what the dictionary says
puberty
1 : the condition of being or the period of becoming first capable of reproducing sexually marked by maturing of the genital organs, development of secondary sex characteristics, and in the human and in higher primates ** by the first occurrence of menstruation in the female **
2 : the age at which puberty occurs often construed legally as 14 in boys and 12 in girls
Now only a month back, I witnessed on TV a marriage conducted in Nepal, in Hindu family where a girl reaching puberty married 5 boys ranging from 15 to 5 years old and according to that custom , the girl will take turns amongst the boys.
KISHANGARH (AJMER), NOV 28: At a small village in this marble township of Rajasthan, a wedding is in progress. The ceremony is about to begin ** when the groom raises a demand and throws a tantrum.** The worried relatives of the bride rush around trying to get what he wants. ** Thankfully, there’s no problem; an ice-cream bar is easily found.** Content, ** the four-year-old gets up, sucking the bar,** ready to take the pheras. The wedding ceremony begins, him leading the way and ** his child bride following, carried in someone else’s arms.**
All this only happens in India, now IF you can show me something like this is other cultures feel free to enlighten me.
Child marriages are an indication of underdevelopment,** the chief culprits being the Hindi speaking states,** since underdevelopment and the influence of religious rituals go hand in hand. Thus, ** a large number of child marriages were solemnised in Madhya Pradesh,** in violation of the law,** on a day that is considered particularly auspicious by Hindus.** The reason why the institution of ** child marriage is less prevalent in the monotheistic tradition ** is because it is not seen only as a sacrament, that is, as something that must be supervised and controlled by the community in order to preserve its values and its hierarchy. In the monotheistic tradition, marriage is seen also as an instrument of happiness.
** Both in Christianity and in Islam, people marry when they are able to provide for a family ** since there are no joint families to provide quasi-absolute economic security. The concept of emotional maturity is also important because of the peculiar destiny of the notion of love in the Islamic and European world where sex is inevitably linked to emotional bonding. ** Hinduism, laying an overwhelming emphasis on procreation and whose entire social ethos is founded on the family, sees to it that the sexual act is socially legitimised at puberty, ** not only so that female fertility can be exploited to its full potential, but also to avoid misalliances. It should be evident that simply passing laws is not going to solve this problem. ** The police could do nothing about the mass child marriages which were solemnised on the occasion of Akshay Tritia.** This is a cultural issue with religious overtones which means not only social and economic initiatives, but also a dogged ideological battle to be fought by the local administration.
ADHOGARH, India – If a wedding is supposed to fulfill a girl’s earliest dreams, Hansa’s in this tiny hamlet in Rajasthan state seemed more like a nightmare.
Early in the starlit evening, the smoke from the sacred fire began searing her eyes. The rituals pushed the ceremony deep into the night, in a crucible of heat and haze. After the first two hours, Hansa was quietly sobbing. ** By midnight, with Hindu priests leading Hansa and her new husband, Sitaram, in the climactic ritual, involving seven purifying circuits of the wood-burning fire, Hansa’s wailing was drowning the rhythmic mantras of the priests.
“I want to go to bed,” she cried. “Please, Mama, Papa. Let me sleep!” **
Bafflement can only have worsened the ordeal, since Hansa, the youngest of six sisters being married in a joint ceremony to boys from other villages, ** was only 4. Her husband was 12. **
Snipped….
In Rajasthan, ** a survey of more than 5,000 women conducted by the national government in 1993 showed that 56 percent had married before they were 15. Of those, 3 percent married before they were 5 and another 14 percent before they were 10. ** Barely 18 percent were literate, and only 3 percent used any form of birth control other than sterilization.
Ibrahim says : keep dreaming, all your slanderous remarks and insinuations without knowledge will harm me little for it is you who will have answer for what you say.
I already made it clear to you earlier to stop using foul language and slander, if you want to discuss with me. I generally let all dogs bark, including the human kind and do not go down to your level but when it comes to hindus I make some exceptions due to their vile nature, so you have been exposed again and again.
Ibrahim says : hmmm.. so even after giving you facts you still talk nonsense, let me get this straight one more time……the law of marriage ordained by God is revealed in all scriptures and hindu scriptures in particular gives exact time for such marriages and as witnessed above and performed by you priest every year.
The law they follow is this
Read again and remember well and ask your hindu priests that perform such marriages why they must follow this law or why they perform such marriages if hindus considered it a sin.
READ!!!
** “A thirty-year-old man should marry a twelve-year-old girl who charms his heart, and a man of twenty-four an eight-year-old girl; and if duty is threatened, (he should marry) in haste.”** – Manusmrti 9:94.
Now in addition to this ONLY in Hinduism we can find this.
** 4-YEAR-OLD MARRIED TO DOG **
FROM SHANKAR MUKHERJEE
Haringhata (Nadia), July 13
Every dog has his day. Sanjay’s happened to be Monday when Anju married him. ** Four-year-old Anju was given away in marriage to the six-month-old dog
in the hope that Sanjay would bring luck to the accident-prone girl who lives at Mohanpur in Nadia district, about 50 km from Calcutta. **
Anju’s father, Subal Karmakar, an employee of Bidhan Chandra Krishi Viswavidyalaya, ** followed all traditional Hindu rituals** at Monday’s marriage. Anju’s “father-in-law” and the owner of the brown dog, Barun Dutta, a neighbour, organised boubhat on Wednesday.
“I had to do it to ward off the evil eye. My youngest daughter is suffering from various diseases from her birth and suffered a number of accidents. ** One astrologer, Badal Bhattacharya, who is known to our family for years, advised me to marry my daughter off to a dog to save her life,’’ ** Karmakar said.
He said that since it had to be a dog that his daughter had to wed, he felt a known dog was always better than an unknown one. “Barun is my old friend and like our relative. He has a dog which I selected as my son-in-law,’’ he said.
So up went a pandal and a decorated entrance to it, the lights shone bright, the shehnai sounded and, of course, the feast.
Anju was dressed in a red Benarasi sari, an odni draped over her tiny head, and a big garland of jasmine hung from her thin neck. One of their neighbours, Parama Karmakar, arranged the bridal dress.
Amid blowing of conchshells and much ululation, little Anju garlanded the groom dressed in a piece of blue-and-white cotton cloth.
** The groom had no name till he entered the chhadnatola, where the marriage rites take place. ** When the priest asked the guardian of the groom to reveal his name and gotro (sub-caste), Barun was stumped. One of his quick-thinking relatives came up with the answer:** he named the dog Sanjay. **
After the rituals were over, the “couple’’ was kept in a specially-decorated room with members of both families around them.
** As many as 300 guests were invited to the marriage ceremony. The CPM local committee secretary, Kamal Karmakar, was among them along with his comrades. **
“I did not hesitate to spend money to please the guests despite my limited financial ability,’’ said Subal.
The menu for the feast was rice, murighanta, two types of vegetable, fish curry, mutton curry, chutney, papad, curd and rasogolla.
** The guests brought along gifts, the kinds that are seen in every man-woman marriage. ** One of Subal’s close relatives presented a toy and a
packet of chocolates.
“Nobody brought anything for the kutta but I have given him a silver ring,’’ Subal’s wife, Annada said.
Subal’s brother-in-law, Nirmal, revealed after some hesitation: ** “We have
given a dowry of Rs 1,000 to the owner of the kutta,** Barun.’’
** People are surprised that Subal, being a moderately educated person, fell for such a superstitious rite. “We went to see the fun and to eat a mouthful of meat,” said Tapan Dutta, a resident.
Ibrahim says So sundaram, explain to us why hindu priest in India conduct child ( I mean.. children who have not reached their puberty even ) marriages and also why they marry their children to dogs when dogs are considered EVIL in Hinduism??
There is no doubt that Vatsyayana was more than averagely wise, for his insights into female sexuality would be considered advanced even by today’s standards
The Kama Sutra, believed to have been written by a Hindu Sage, Vatsyayana, some 1600 years ago, is much more than a 4th Century version of The Joy Of Sex - even if the illustrations do feature a man with some dodgy facial hair http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/entertainment/newsid_1158000/1158997.stm