Re: I have accepted Shiaism…
shiaas shud not be declared kaafir, i dont think many sunnis think that they r kaafir…
just that thet r wrong about so many things…
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
You know its simple as this. I don't know why Sunnis and Shias take it so far.
Say for example there is a sunni muslim.
He says that putting my hands on my chest is the right way, because his book says that.
The mainstream sunnis say it should be below the naval.
The fundamental beliefs are the same for both sunnis, its just they have different ways of praying.
Now the way of praying is up to the individual himself, and if he is right or wrong Allah swt knows.
We as muslims can only go so far to say to one another "please correct it". Not "force them" or "hate them".
However the point is, both those sunnis in the prayer example, are considered muslims. They just have different thinking of where the hands shud go.
Shias are no different.
Fundamentally they're all the same as sunnis. And if they have differences...let them have their differences. Let sunnis have theirs.
Atleast unite on the level where you share the same *fundamental beliefs. *
What makes you a muslim if you hate someone who attests to One God and **Muhammad saw as his Last messenger?
**How can you hate a man that attests to that?
Just cuz he puts his hands on his chest and you below your naval?
Pretty weak motive if you ask me.
We have **bigger things **to worry about, than where the hands go.
Our women are being raped, and here all we can talk about is how different we are amongst ourselves.
I for one can take that, i can tolerate that.
I don't care for the differences as much as I *care for those kafirs eating up our culture, our lives, and destroying the name of Allah swt as we speak. *
What muslims are we?
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
just that thet r wrong about so many things....
this is what i am talking about...shias will say sunnis are wrong about so many things...what will that accomplish...did you watch the video..you need to watch it more then anyone else on this forum...we can never have unity when there will be people like you
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
u cannot even dream of unity when a group of people curse the wives and dearest companions of a Prophet (saw) of another people....
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
and why do these ppl get this honor? according to molana ishaq you gotta read your own books...y dont you just watch the video?
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
molana ishaq can keep his views to himself....
i cant respect someone who cant respect the best people after the prophets (as)....
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
and i can't respect someone who has commited crimes againt that same Prophet (pbuh&up) family..case closed!
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
and i cant get myself to argue with someone who thinks wives are not counted as one's family....
urdu me kaafi mashhoor hai keh maap baap behn bhai sab sotelay ho saktay hain, lekin biwi sotelee nahin hoti....
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
no one is denying wives are part of family..but Prophet (pbuh&up) gathered some Special People (a) together and thats when the ayat came from Allah...that is the Family Prophet (pbuh&up) is talking about
anyways this is endless discusssion..tum apni kabar main ja'o gay hum apni
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
I wonder if this discussion is similar to ones that people from Athens had with people from Sparta back in the day. In Athens they worshipped Athena while in Sparta they worshipped Artemis but in the end these gods all belonged on the same kabob.
Like The ancient Greeks you’re all on the same kabob, spend your energy on something other than getting one another all riled up.
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
Lajawab, have your actually ever spoken to a person who has accepted Shia thought? You might want to ask them what ahlulbayt means to them. Its all too easy to sit back and take the pi$$.
Re: I have accepted Shiaism…
what a post yaar; :biggthumb 
reading this those young brothers from hizb ul tehrir come to my mind, used to have a stall in the town centre on a saturday..
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
**Lajawab; **i agree with his questions and points raised..they make sense to me..probably cuz im a sunni and thats what ive been taught..
it comes down to the different routes taken by the sunnah & ahaadees i.e. sahaabas and imams to sunnis and shias..
as for not accepting the 3 khlifaas, thats also what the imams taught..
which doesnt make sense to me for the same reasons that Lajawab and Crescent mentioned..
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
that made me laugh :D ive heard that so many times.. in family discussions that is
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
Muslims are Ummatun Wasatun, we are the Ummah of the Middle ground.
Don't say Shi'a are kaafir, they are just as Muslim as Sunni's.
It is those who are hidden amongst our community who commit Rafd, and those who disrespect Rasul-Allah (saws) who are Munafiqin, that are trouble makers.
Blowing up Shi'a Masjids in Pakistan??? Who do you think did it?
Blowing up Sunni's in a Masjid because they celebrating Milad-e-Nabi? Who do you think did that one as well???
Just read the fatwa from University of Al-Azhar Sharif, in which it emphatically declares, that both Ahlus Sunnah wa'l Jama'ah, and the Ithna Ashari Shi'a are 100 percent Muslims and anyone who says otherwise is then going against the most prestigious centre of Sunni learning for over 1000 years. This is something Sunni's should know, I myself am Ahlus Sunnah wa'l Jama'ah.
Here is the fatwa from al-Azhar Sharif:
Head Office of al-Azhar University:
IN THE NAME OF ALLAH, THE BENEFICENT, THE MERCIFUL
Text of the Verdict (Fatwa) Issued by His Excellency Shaikh al-Akbar Mahmood Shaltoot, Head of the al-Azhar University, on Permissibility of Following "al-Shia al-Imamiyyah" School of Thought
His Excellency was asked:
Some believe that, for a Muslim to have religiously correct worship and dealing, it is necessary to follow one of the four known schools of thought, whereas, "al-Shia al-Imamiyyah" school of thought is not one of them nor "al-Shia al-Zaidiyyah." Do your Excellency agree with this opinion, and prohibit following "al-Shia al-Imamiyyah al-Ithna Ashariyyah" school of thought, for example?
His Excellency replied:
1) Islam does not require a Muslim to follow a particular Madh'hab (school of thought). Rather, we say: every Muslim has the right to follow one of the schools of thought which has been correctly narrated and its verdicts have been compiled in its books. And, everyone who is following such Madhahib [schools of thought] can transfer to another school, and there shall be no crime on him for doing so.
2) The Ja'fari school of thought, which is also known as "al-Shia al- Imamiyyah al-Ithna Ashariyyah" (i.e., The Twelver Imami Shi'ites) is a school of thought that is religiously correct to follow in worship as are other Sunni schools of thought.
Muslims must know this, and ought to refrain from unjust prejudice to any particular school of thought, since the religion of Allah and His Divine Law (Shari'ah) was never restricted to a particular school of thought. Their jurists (Mujtahidoon) are accepted by Almighty Allah, and it is permissible to the "non-Mujtahid" to follow them and to accord with their teaching whether in worship (Ibadaat) or transactions (Mu'amilaat).
Signed,
Mahmood Shaltoot.
The above Fatwa was announced on July 6, 1959 from the Head of al-Azhar University, and was subsequently published in many publications in the middle east which include, but are not limited to:
- al-Sha'ab newspaper (Egypt), issue of July 7, 1959. *]al-Kifah newspaper (Lebanon), issue of July 8, 1959.
Re: I have accepted Shiaism…
I don’t know…
49:12
YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! Avoid suspicion as much (as possible): for suspicion in some cases is a sin: And spy not on each other behind their backs. Would any of you like to eat the flesh of his dead brother?
But keeping the above verse in mind, can you please tell us who it is?
Re: I have accepted Shiaism…
YA Sufi sahib - Ye baat saheeh hai kay Shia loog musalmaan hain, lekin kuch kuch aqeedah mein gharbaar hai. “the Ithna Ashari Shi’a are 100 percent Muslims” aap ki yea baat daarust nahin. Yee loog Sahabah akraam ko saheeh Musalmaan nahin mantay - in fact oun ko munafiq samajtay hain.
The Fatwa of Mahmood Shaltoot was highly criticized by all other authorities. Al Azhar does not carry any weight for last 70 odd years.
Any reciprocal fatwah from the shia side - Qum or Najaf that Sunnis are 100% Muslims. Keep waiting.
Having said that, no Muslim has the right to take others life however deviated.
Keep Lajawab’s post in mind.
Don’t throw your Suspicions around without solid proof. It is against the Quran and the Sunnah.
Use your head and see who is trying to gain from the strive among Muslims.
Nabi Kareem (saw) has warned us against stirring up mutual strive with spreading rumours without any proof.
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
Can you please provide me with a hadith or any proof that anyone who doesnt considers (some) sahaba munafiq are not 100% muslim.
Re: I have accepted Shiaism…
U have enough hadith to say that only some, about 5 - 6 remained true Muslims and that the rest of them all renegaded from Islam.
So it not matter of some Sahabah but the whole lot save a few, as I said 5 - 6. Is it not so? Let me see you answer this in true faith.
Read the Quran about early Muhajiroun and Ansar, Allah azza wa jaal has praised them and is happy with them. These are Abu Bakr (ra) Umar (ra) and Uthman (ra) and yet you take them to deviants and turncoats in the least degree.
He who takes a true Muslim (vouched by Quran) to be a munafiq is one himself.
Re: I have accepted Shiaism...
So it not matter of some Sahabah but the whole lot save a few, as I said 5 - 6. Is it not so? Let me see you answer this in true faith.
Read the Quran about early Muhajiroun and Ansar, Allah azza wa jaal has praised them and is happy with them. These are Abu Bakr (ra) Umar (ra) and Uthman (ra) and yet you take them to deviants and turncoats in the least degree.
He who takes a true Muslim (vouched by Quran) to be a munafiq is one himself.
It is the other way round majority of the ashab didn't but a few turned deviants after demise of Rasool Allah, and the main issue is that Shias believe that Abu Bakr, Umar and Uthman were included in those few.
As prove if you watch the video clip mentioned in quiet a few posts you will learn wat your own ullema beleive about the first and second khalifa's of sunnis and why shias do not believe in their khilafat.
Here is what your own books say
"This is what Muawiya wrote in reply to a critical letter by Muhammad bin Abu Bakr:
"We and your father during the lifetime of the Prophet, used to consider the right of Ibn Abi Talib binding upon us, and his excellence was well above ours. Despite this when Allah chose for the Prophet what he had in store for him?He took him to Himself. Then your father and his Faruq were the first to snatch it and oppose him, they both worked together on this?If it was injustice, then your father founded it and we are his partners. We followed his guidance and imitated his action".
Waq'at Sifeen by Minqari p118-120 (Cairo edition 1962); *
*Ansab al Ashraf by Baladhuri Volume 2 page 393-397 (Beirut edition 1974); *
*Masudi Muruj ud Dhuhab Vol 3 page 197 - 201 (Beirut 1969 edition)
Care to explain this to me??