Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Oh no brother… thanks go the Punab Government for announcing the holiday thats why i used this opportunity…
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
so If marvan offspring do something…the blame cannot be given to marvan and if this blame cannot not given to marvan how will we can blame muavia(ra) ???
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
hadith was posted because sane people can see the character of mawiya...its very evident that he has people abuse Imam Ali (a.s.) **WHAT PREVENTS YOU!!! **i mean why would anyone be thinking about abusing the Imam..whom Prophet (pbuh&up) loved so much and called him his brother..yet this practice was common..there are many hadiths mentioning this by many different sunni authors
anyways you go ahead and keep praising him
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
jawab e jahilana is khamoshi.
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
actually I am still trying to find out the name of Sydena Muawiya:razi: in that hadith… I agree to the context and that ABu Turaab:razi: is the beloved name of the prophet:saw: for Sydena Ali al Murtaza, Asadullah wa Asada Rasulehi:razi: but I do not find that hadeeth connected to the discussion at hand.. hence, the khamoshi 
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
KHILAFAT-O-MALOOKIYYAT by sunni moulana moududi gives reference to
Al-Tabari, Volume 4, Page 188
which states that muawia HIMSELF and on HIS orders all his GOVERNORS during the SERMONS (khutbas) from the pulpits of the mosques would curse incessantly Hazrat Ali ra.gif, even in the PROPHETIC MOSQUE (Masjid-e-Nabawi) on pulpit of the Prophet (SAW), exactly in front of the Tomb (Roza-e-Rasool) of the Holy Prophet (SAW), names of the dearest (Ali) to Holy prophet would be called, while the children and the close family members of Hazrat Ali ra.gif would hear to these name-calling from their very own ears (Al-Tabari, Volume 4, Page 188)
Al-Tabari is one of your most authentic book.
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
another reference in the honour of your beloved muawia is
Following the death of Muhammad bin 'Abu Bakr the people of Egypt gave bayya to Muaweyah. It was following this (event) that Ummul Mu'mineen Ayesha would curse Muaweyah and Amr bin Aas after every Salaat.
Tadhkira ul Khawass page 62
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Another reference from your most authentic book.
Sunni reference: Musnad Ahmed Bin Hanbal Volume 5 page 347
Imam of Ahl'ul Sunnah Ahmad Bin Hanbal records in his Musnad that:
"Muaweyah consumed a liquid that had been declared haraam by the Prophet (p)".
still can't find your guru's name.
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Muaweyah took interest
Sahih Muslim Book 010, Number 3852
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
"Muaweyah issued an order to curse Hadhrath 'Ali. Upon hearing this Sa'd bin Abi Waqqas said "Even if you place a sword over my head and demand that I curse 'Ali, I will refuse to do so".
Sunni reference: Fathul Bari Volume 7 page 74, Bab Manaqib 'Ali
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Abdullah ibne Umar narrates that he heard Rasulullah say:
"Muaweyah shall not die on the path of Islam".
Sunni references:
Tareekh Tabari Volume 8 page 186
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Why don’t you post the Hadith you mention here for everyone to see if Muawiyah 
took any interest…Or are you tabbaraing again…
And some of the books you mention, are they even real Sunni books?
Plus, as a test of devotion, if I ask my kid, ‘why don’t you curse me’, just to see why, is that the same as my kid cursing me?
Use some sense shidi jaambo…
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
curse and Imam Ali (a.s.) ..how can we even think about word curse when we are talking about Imam Ali (a.s.) he was the leader at that time and people were cursing Imam (a.s.)…u’d praise mawiya even if he made you curse Imam (a.s.)
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
[quote=“Sheraz CT”]
curse and Imam Ali (a.s.) ..how can we even think about word curse when we are talking about Imam Ali (a.s.) he was the leader at that time …/QUOTE]
In similar vain no one should even think of cursing or bad mouthing Imam Ali (ra)'s three very pious predecessors (May Allah (swt) be pleased with them) as they too were leaders of the Ummah at that time.
There is no comparison between status of Hz. Ali (ra) compared to that of Hz. Muawiyah (ra).
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
So why was mr. Mauwiya asking him that question anyway? Just for fun?
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
This post has gone high very rapidly. I think the sole reason of splitting muslims into shias and sunnies was this ummayyad dynasty. They instituted this tradition of cursing ahl e bait. Sunnies are far from this practice now and the world is unanimous that Imam Hussain was on Haq, shias still are stuck to the past. I am not sure but i have heard of a practice called 'Tabarra' where they routinely curse first three caliphs.I think in these times we should mature. To have fiqa differences is normal but so far down the convoluted history, you cannot take sides. Nehjulbalagha is not an authoritative guide where Hazrat Ali has been stated saying that he dislikes first three caliphs. It was written in Abbasyyids time who were shias and liked to reverse every thing umayyads did. So it was tit for tat. Also it does not have that kind of scrutiny through which Ahadith are passed.Do not glorify muawiyya, neither demean him to much lower than he deserves. Similarly do not demean the first three caliphs and hopefully we will be much better off.
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
You say that Nahjul Balagha was written from a Shia perspective. So, logically, it can be said that the love 'portayed' btw Hz Ali a.s and the three Caliphs in sunni books is a total partial work by sunni authorities!
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Brother MKF...ummayads not divided the ummah into shias and sunnis ...it was divided when usman(ra) was killed in cold blood......so shian-e-ali(ra) which were involved in killing of usman(ra) went to ali(ra) army and portrayed themselves as they are lovers of ahle-baits but there purpose was only to save themselves from Qassas ..in Jamal..when both parties agreed upon qassas....these same kufis and traitors threw arrows from both sides at night and started the war ....latter they also started misconceptions betwen ali(ra) and muavia(ra)...before ummayads took control..almost 70,000 uslims have been died in 2 wars ..and this uis evenge of Nature of the mazloom usman(ra) murder...
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
Furthermore ..it is no proof that muavia(ra) himself cursed ali(ra) ever.....he always remembered him with good words ...hasan and hussain (ra) went every year and be treated as emperors......there are inter marriages between ummayads and hashimis... the governor of madina was marvan...he was not considered as good by almost all the historians... he was a man who created many misconceptions in last days of usman(ra) ......and most of the people had considered marvan as a great conspirator to himself become the caliph......so prophet(pbuh) had ordered him and his father (al-hakam) to leave madina.....if marvan had done something to crse ali(r) or respeced ahle-bait...it was act of marvan who in a tribal jeolusy had done this ...as thier leader usman(ra) was also killed when he was hungry and thirsy ...no food and water was allowed...just think...a person who sacrificed his whole wealth in the name of islam right from beginning ...he was murdered brutally without food and water...and yes ..and thier murderers were in li(ra) army and latter he honoured them with governorships and high officialships...so in tribal revenge ...if someone has said some bad words to ali(ra) and ahle-bait..then it was a tribal conflict...i am not justifying it... it was a very bad practice but it was the same tribal supriority with which banu hashim practised the policy of isolation and non-cooperation with 3 caliphs..and it was the reaction of that ...however ..muavia(ra) himself never did it or ordered it..if such things happened ..ahle-baits would not have visited syria many times to muavia(ra) and married inhis family..this is simply illogical....
Re: Hazrat Ameer Muawiya r.a and the Romans
No problem Ripper. We’ll do one better, and get the narrations from your books written by your eminent scholars!
Enjoy!
Once, Imam Muhammad al-Baqir (ra) while sitting with his companions, praised Abu Bakr by calling him the truthful (“as-Siddiq”).
One of his companions got astonished by this remark and inquired if he (the Imam) really meant what he said. Upon this Imam al-Baqir replied, “Yes Abu Bakr is the truthful and whoever does not give this attribution to him, then may Allah make that person (who did not give the attribute) helpless on the day of resurrection” Source: Kashful Ghumamah, vol.2, p.174]
Imam Jaffar as Sadiq (ra) expressed his support to Abu Bakr and Umar:
Once wife of Imam Jaffar as Sadiq asked him about Abu Bakr and Umar.
He replied, “I support them”.
Then he said to his wife,” you should support them also.”
His wife replied, “So should I say to my creator when I meet Him, that it is your order to support Abu Bakr and Umar.”
The truthful Imam Jaffar replied, ” Yes." - Source: Rawzatul Kafi, vol.8, p.101
Now don’t tell me that the Imams got it wrong, remember they are infallible, and utter nothing but the truth.