Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Well, here you have it. Some morons with their faces obscured had to hang around posing with their AK-47s. Why does this picture always seem to end badly?
Why don’t we see more pictures of guys shaking hands at a peace table? In the course of one day we had a small scale Palestinian civil war, a politician killed with a suicide bomb in Lebanon, and the minarets of a mostly destroyed Shia shrine re-bombed and leveled.

Nice, Jihad on. A fine day for Muslim on Muslim slaughter.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Hamas was Israel's creation and Fatah is good as dead.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

^^ yup they created in 1987

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the problem with fatah is they seem to be more of israels stooges then hamas does at the moment.

this is some sort of peak point, lets see what happens. everything is up in the air

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

^^ Same thing is gonna happen to Hamas

Fatah came with much fan fare in 1994 to Gaza....

And after 10 years, they were accused of corruption and mis management and Hamas challenged them

Hamas after 10 years will go corrupt and another group will come and challenge them

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

^ Are you saying this gang of thugs isn't corrupt already?
There is no way in jahannam these guys are going to last 10 months, nevermind 10 years.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

^ Don’t get your panties in a jolly!! :hehe:

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Gaza is a sliver of land 6 miles wide, with a million and half people. All of the international aid agencies have pulled out, there is 35% unemployment, no middle class, and a rotting infrastructure. This is a place where people are killed by floods of sewage. Half of the people are lving in refugee camps, and there are armed gangs roving around.

So the thing this place needs the most is radicalized leadership, who have alienated their largest neighbor. More guns! More conflict! Let's kill some Jews!

Either Hamas gest very practical very quickly, or they will have a massive humanitarian crisis on their hands. The Eu and the Americans, historically the largest funders of Palestinian government, will not deal with Hamas. The Iranians will of course, but only If Hamas escalates the conflict and kills Jews. The Saudis will hlep, but they will not put up with crap from Hamas.

So Hamas is in a box. Be careful of what you wish for. If they launch rockets into Israel, Israel will not hesitate for a moment to destroy more of Gaza. If they do not improve life for the Gazans they will not have Fatah to blame. I suspect they will have about 24 months before people figure out that they are committing social suicide by gunman.

Hamas will estabilsh security in Gaza. This will be a mixed blessing of street justice and an elimination of their enemies. Once initial security is established, there will be a nice piece in the Guardian about how Hamas has "improved the place" (never mind those Fatah corpses). Of course there will be no new jobs, a lot more weapons, draconian rules, and complete one party rule. (democratically elected is quickly replaced by rule of gun huh?). You could write this script in your sleep eh? Pretty predictable. Of course we will hear a lot from them about "the seige" of Gaza. A seige of Hamas making.

In the mean time, the West Bank will experience economic growth, relaxed rules from Israel, release of prisoners, and foreign investment. The lesson? Peace is good, conflict is bad. Half of Palestine may emerge from this in better shape.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Current situation in Palestine shows that Muslims just can not follow influential leaders and vote them into power. Muslim world is torn apart between logic and religious leaders where moderates are named kaffirs and hated for their support of the West. Hamas, Hezbollah, Sadar and Ahmadjinadabba....I just hope Pakistan does not plunge into mess like this. We have be very careful this coming election and vote for people who are sensible rather influential.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Revenge killings, looting…where have we seen this before?


GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip - On Hamas’ first day of full rule in Gaza, crowds looted strongholds of the rival Fatah on Friday stripping the home of one of the party’s strongmen down to the flower pots and militants sent a man plunging to his death from a rooftop.

But the violence, which came despite a Hamas offer of amnesty for Fatah, was sporadic. Gaza’s streets, deserted in the past week of fighting, were crowded with cars, pedestrians and triumphant fighters with the Islamic militant group.

At Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas’ captured seaside office in Gaza City, a gunman sat down at the Fatah leader’s desk, picked up the phone and pretended to be calling Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice. “Hello, Rice?” the gunman said. “Here we are in Abu Mazen’s office. Say hello to Abu Mazen for me.” Other gunmen rifled through Abbas’ belongings in a bedroom behind the office, lifting up a mattress and searching through drawers

A resident of a Hamas-dominated neighborhood, identifying himself only as Yousef for fear of reprisal by his neighbors, said Gazans would always back the winner, regardless of ideology.
“Today everybody is with Hamas because Hamas won the battle. If Fatah had won the battle they’d be with Fatah. We are a hungry people, we are with whoever gives us a bag of flour and a food coupon,” said Yousef, 30. “Me, I’m with God and a bag of flour.”

Palestinians in the West Bank viewed the Hamas takeover of Gaza with a mixture of fear and hope — realizing that it could bring needed foreign aid while dealing a major blow to dreams of Palestinian statehood.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070615/ap_on_re_mi_ea/israel_palestinians

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

This may actually turn out to be for the best. With Hamas in control of its power base, the Gaza strip, and Fatah in control of its power base, the West Bank, it will be possible to deal with the two leading Palestinian factions in their own way.

1) Fatah. Fatah's short term negotation objective is a permanent peace settlement. In the past, opposition by Hamas made Fatah unable to realistically negotiate this. Free from linkage to Hamas, Fatah can now receive frozen funding from the West and confiscated taxes from Israel, start re-building some semblance of a state, and negotiate a permanent West Bank + Jerusalem deal. Since "Fatahland" is the most bitterly contested part of the Palestinian Authority's land, this is where negotiation will be hardest; but Fatah is the most willing to Negotiate. Similarly, it will be easier for Fatah to enforce a peace here, since Hamas is weak in the West Bank.

2) Hamas. Hamas's negotiation objective is a short term peace subject to renewal clauses. They've been unable to achieve this because Fatah, as the previously dominant party, instead made negotation only with a long-term view. Israel has also refused to talk publically with Hamas.
Hamas now completely controls Gaza with no Fatah "friendly face". But Israel is responsible for Gaza's water and electricity. Israel will have to publically have links with some aspect of Hamas to continue these utilities, else face immense pressure from its allies for the humanitarian consequences of a cut-off. This also gives Hamas an incentive to on some level at least work with Israel, at least on utilities cooperation. This could be a starting point for moderation on both sides.

My prediction: a three/two-state solution. The Fatah West Bank could settle with Israel, and create a Western-aided state. The Quartet will continue with their short-sighted effort to isolate Hamas rather than make so much as a slight effort to involve Hamas as a partner for any kind of peace; nonetheless, Hamas and Israel could work out a series of ceasefires on their own.

Gaza will exist not as the terrorist state some scare mongers are trying to make; but rather continuing as a giant poor refugee camp, run by Hamas, who'se government will exist solely to distribute the aid given out by a handful of donor states. Western governments (and the voters who choose those governments) will continue to isolate and cripple Gaza's people with sanctions, deliberately choosing to punish the common people for their support of their Islamist government.

Nonetheless, this does not necessarily mean Gaza will be more hellish than the West Bank state. Fatah has always been, and will continue to be, a gang of corrupt thugs. If there is any political party in the world capable of taking an immense amount of aid meant to build a state and completely waste it on themselves instead, it is Fatah. Without Hamas and Israel to label as their enemies, in fact, the heavily armed Fatah factions may turn on each other in a fight over the spoils of peace.

By contrast, Hamas have always had an immense amount of internal discipline that meant that despite the efforts by Western nations and western voters to punish the Palestinian people for electing Hamas, they retained support through ruling better than Fatah. If there is any political party that is capable of successfully running an isolated microstate crippled by sanctions and yet stay popular, it is Hamas.

Ultimately, Palestinian voters will decide which state's model works best. If Fatah somehow turn the West Bank into a successful nation existing peacefully with Israel, it will not be long before pro-Fatah sentiment breaks out in Gaza and Hamas are forced out of power.

But if Fatah manage to make a mess of the West Bank and Hamas at least keeps law and order in Gaza, then the pendulum will swing the other way.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Then why the HELL are you Cryin', Isreal did beat the crap out its neigbors long back and returned some of the land it captured during the war.

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I guess, Prophet Mohammed was a very influential person himself, If you check out the messiah's before him, they had had magical powers to impress ppl but Mohammed was just a normal, intelligent and very influential Human being !!

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

theyre all frauds i tell u

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I dunno abt that but he sure was very intelligent leader !

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^ nono i meant all the hamas's and fatahs and all.... its all about politics. palestinian brotherhood whatever, and arabs and islam none of them care... its all a big fraud i tell u everyone just wants power and are involved in their own internal dramas. thats why pakis shouldnt get involved with them and their power struggles...

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

^ like we Pakis are not frauds either?

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Most Palestinians don't want the baggage that comes with Hamas, they want a party in power that isn't corrupt how Hamas can run a country with the peoples support and maintain their vow to push Israel in the sea and other ideologies isn't realistic, it's going to bring to many hardships, yes even more so than before.

Hamas has backed off and now are saying they recognize Abbas as the Chairman of the PA and have order their flags to not to be flown in buildings taken over in Gaza. It's seems like they've taken a bite bigger than then can chew and realize that they are going to choke but it may be to late.

Israel has stated they will step in if the humanitarian situation in Gaza gets out of control and will countine to provide Aid to there as well.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

Did more than FATAH. Hamas has always been a welfare organisation, bit like Hezbollah.

Why are you all blaming Hamas. Hamas won the elections. They as the government have the mandate to control border corssings, security i..e police, intelligence, bodyguards of politicians etc... they are meant to be the state. Instead what happend was FATH never gave up the real power. Israel/USA funded some elements with money (undermine Hamas) new weapons to destroy Hamas. This was a proxy war. USA always has problems with Syria using groups in Lebanon to undermine the pro west government. they did exactly the same in Gaza. OK USA is not under some obligation to fund Hamas like it did with Fatah but it stopped all income from middle east banks. Hamas had funds in Egypt, Jordan banks that would not be released in fear of banks being put under sanctions by USA. Again USA being a bully, stopping a government operate.

Fatah was now tring to claim back more power from the elected government. Hamas had enough of TRYING to govern. Had enough and overthrew what they see as traitors.

Re: Hamas and Fatah Killing One Another

pakis are the BIGGEST frauds