^ or a greater Israel takes over the middle east? Yeah, sell your country to the non-believers people, that's called being civilized and progress!
Its highly likely that emotions have taken over SOA...Control your emotions ,dude
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
no it's not emotions. People like make a fuss about something that's not even close to what the kufar are doing to us. He thinks that doomsday is here just because some illiterate people in SWAT have been threatened with death and given weapons and money. These are the likes that the media likes to see, the cowards the likes of Hamid Mir selling out our country by pointing fingers at the poor while sitting in their "western apartments". Not even lifting a finger at the enemy, saying greater Israel was born. How dare he say that, does he even know what greater Israel means. It means the murder of millions of Muslims all over the middle east, it's already happening. Sorry , do all you want in your pathetic little campaign, nobody is going to join you except the likes of Hamid Mir (pcg, firenze). :) but insh'Allah if the battle is near, I hope to see you on our side.
no it's not emotions. People like burqaboy make a fuss about something that's not even close to what the kufar are doing to us. He thinks that doomsday is here just because some illiterate people in SWAT have been threatened with death and given weapons and money. These are the likes that the media likes to see, the cowards the likes of Hamid Mir selling out our country by pointing fingers at the poor while sitting in their "western apartments". Not even lifting a finger at the enemy, saying greater Israel was born. How dare he say that, does he even know what greater Israel means. It means the murder of millions of Muslims all over the middle east, it's already happening. Sorry burqaboy, do all you want in your pathetic little campaign, nobody is going to join you except the likes of Hamid Mir (pcg, firenze). :) but insh'Allah if the battle is near, I hope to see you on our side.
^^
This may all be well and good. pray tell, how does it relate to the main topic and the original discussion?
Must we bring Palestine in every discussion?
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
See what confuses me is that in 105 years, Muslim countries have been colonized and have not participated in the process for a good 55 of those years. Why? But of course colonialism.
Secondly those jews who have recieved their prizes have been part western nations that attributed them as equals. A reason why Martin Luther King never was awarded one.
I love to see people lap up these facts with out any intellectual thought process. Its fun to bash on Muslims and Muslim countries.
See what confuses me is that in 105 years, Muslim countries have been colonized and have not participated in the process for a good 55 of those years. Why? But of course colonialism.
Secondly those jews who have recieved their prizes have been part western nations that attributed them as equals. A reason why Martin Luther King never was awarded one.
I love to see people lap up these facts with out any intellectual thought process. Its fun to bash on Muslims and Muslim countries.
Why were the Muslim countries colonized? Cuz they were fighting guns with swords! While the Europe scientifically advanced during 1300-1700 AD, the 'Muslim' countries were promoting poetry, painting and music.
It is interesting that Muslims refer to the book '[FONT=Verdana,Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]The 100: A Ranking of the Most Influential Persons in History' by Michael H. Hart quoting he put our dear Prophet (SAW) as number one. What we forget is that more than 60% of those 100 are from europe, are scientists, economists, philosophers, adventurers and are from the time 1300-1700 AD.
Re: Eye opener for “Muslim Ummah”
Because the Ottoman empire was disolved at the end of World War 1 for siding with Germany. It was conquered and its land taken as spoils of war. The Germans and Ottomans did not fight with swords you . They fought with the same weapons as did the Brits and others.
Secondly my dear, the Nobel prize was not established in the 1300 to 1700 years, so doesn’t matter.
Lastly our dear - read and learn. BBC NEWS | Science & Environment | The ‘first true scientist’
Following atleast one teaching our Holy Prophet and seek out knowledge for your own betterment.
See what confuses me is that in 105 years, Muslim countries have been colonized and have not participated in the process for a good 55 of those years. Why? But of course colonialism....
CM with due respect, your thesis is utterly off the mark on two points:
- Muslims contributed scientifically all the way until they were colonized 105 years ago i.e. in 1903.
- Muslim heartland of today (Yemen, Egypt, Saudi Arabia etc.) would have contributed more if they were not colonized.
Here is why many analysts go wrong on these points (or simply perform myopic analysis).
**
1. Colonization killed science in colonies. NOT!
**
Yes the colonization was bad for the monarchs, Khalifahs, and other despotic tribal rulers, but for the masses the colonization opened up modern means of communications and modern schools. Thus it was possible for a young man from tiny Indian village to go all the way to universities of Britain and Germany. In the brief period of British rule (1857 to 1947 = 90 years), regions now Pakistan, produced more scientists, philosophers, and INDEPENDENT thinkers than what Pakistan has produced in the last 60 years.
The reason is simple. Science needs free thinkers, while the modern religions including Islam kills that very thinking.
Even when so-called Muslim rule produced these scientists, most of the time they were under Islamists threats. Mullahs typically treated scientists as heretics. The first encyclopedia was produced by these "heretics" while in hiding from the Talibani-style Mullahs.
Think Swat and think Mullahs who were ready to chop of limbs of anyone daring to open schools, labs, or other free-thinking institutions. You want to boast about the "first scientist" from bbc. But read the thingy and burry your head in shame. That first scientist was declared "Mad" by the Muslim despot aka ruler.
In the last 400 years, things have totally changed in Europe. Scientist and free thinkers now survive from the wrath of religious fanatics.
And unless we go through a similar renaissance in Pakistan, there will not be any science. So quit blaming the boogeyman of colonialism.
**
2. Incorrect theory of "Colonization stopped MUSLIM science"
**
These are just lazy excuses. Muslims heartlands like Saudi Arabia, Yemen, UAE, Kuwait etc have not contributed much in the last 1000 years, and you lament about 105.
These so called Muslim regions have been herding goats, and sleeping in caves and tents, and slums for the last many many centuries.
Why do these so-called analysts like CM, forget that most of the "Muslim" contributions do not come from the Islamic-heartlands, but from the peripheral regions where Muslims interacted with people from India, Central Asia, and Europe.
Many Pakistanis become so much romanticized with Arab Urban legends that they lose all their faculty and start believing in the fairy tales.
FYI, The last major engineering contributions came from Muslims in India while Saudis were surviving by looting the haji caravans. Look at the wonder of Taj Mahal and it has a Hindu sign of Lotus on top of the dome. And Taj Mahal by the way was designed by an Muslim architect / engineer from Lahore.
And do not forget that Taj would have been condemned for destruction under the Wahabi rules. If you are in doubt go read the discussion on graves in the religious forum.
As long as Indian and Pakistani youth will continue believing in the false notions of Arab Urban legends, there is no hope for them, that they will ever contribute anything to the science.
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
as an aside Burqaposh, why are Yemen, Saudi Arabia etc the heartlands of Muslims for you?
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
You are asking why Muslim Countries are so POWERLESS, right?
I tell you that with pride
Not following the teachings of the Holy Qur'an and his Messenger (saw)
Persecution of innocent Ahmadies > wasting time even though Allah says
"When someones kill anothers one, it is like he killed the whole humanity
Pay the Price...
Hatred among the 72 sects
4 Muslim Schools of Thought instead of 1 (Did the Messenger (saw) bring 4 Laws?)
Money & Might
Dajjal
END OF LIST
Thank you very much
The Eye Opener
The Truth
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
Go and read how Saladin became a great Muslim King by holding the basics of Islam. Richard Lionheart took over Akko and killed 3000 Muslims, because Saladin was not ready to pay ransom. He prayed instead of that, but for nothing. In a Brutal way the crusader executed all 3000 Muslims.
At this Time Christians also lived in Jeruslaem which Saladin won back against the Christians who ruled Jersualem for 88 Years. He waived the option off to do the same. What great King he was and a Idol. Do we have that here when Palestine is in Danger and the Civilization? Saying Stop, it's Enoug. When Palestine gets attacked again I won't shut my mouth down like all. War has become an attraction :( Have you seen the Journalists and the damn People watching bombs being exchanged :( Do we have here any Muslim Leader showing his balls? I think the balls haven't dropped yet! At the moment licking the feet of the West and becoming same like them is good. Give a Sh't about them. I don't accuse the West totally. I grew up here, but the more and more I gain knowledge it's cristall clear that something is very very wrong here.
I give you one Shot, it's a good ONE. Believe me! I won't disppoint.
Iran is the leader and the axis of the bad. Iran wants Israel to be erased from the World Map. Because of the fights between Russia and Ukraine concering the Gas. Million, maybe Billion Dollars have been lost, damage undescribable because of the 2 Week lasting fight. Germany, France and some other countries want to build a Pipeline in Eastsea. Here plays Iran a vital role. In a few even these resources will not exist anymore where they want to get it from. Iran has the second biggest gas apperance in the World and in the long-term Israel friendly countries like Germany will depend on Iran in the future. I want to see how that works! But when Money talks and the Truth is hidden and veil put on, I heard people sold their mothers and sisters for money (astagfirullah). In the long run I see Germany, Israel, Great Britian regaining Middle East and this leads to the metpahoric meaning that Dajjal will be close to Mecca and Medina...Israel is gaining more and more land!
I will make a Report. I need to go very deep in this hole. It's a very deep and sh't hole. I tell you. Gain Knowledge. Rabbe Sidni Ilmaa...Have a nice one
as an aside Burqaposh, why are Yemen, Saudi Arabia etc the heartlands of Muslims for you?
Very good question.
Heartland is just that, the region (or land) that acts as heart, that drives the emotions, the trends etc.
For many Sunni Muslims (and that's majority), the heartland regions are the epitome of Islam and the true Islamic thought. Many strict Muslims want to walk, talk, dress, and above all THINK like the people from heartland.
A Pakistani may not have ever experienced the heartland culture, but you will so many so called strict-Muslims trying to ape the tribals using things like hijab. Even though Pakistani culture never had that kind of dress code.
You can also do a test and see how many British-born Pakistanis are driven by the Islamic thought emanating from the heartland, and not from the thoughts of British Institutions like their universities or British parliament.
Look at Swatis, what they are doing with hand chopping, neck cutting etc is the ditto copy of what is practiced by the tribals of the "heartland" of Muslims. This type of caveman behavior was never a local custom not at least in the recent memory.
Shias too have a heartland, and that is Iran. Whatever you say, Iran can never be wrong for a typical Shia. However Iranian heartland has much less influence and that influence extends to Shia population centers in South Asia and tiny portions of the Middle East such as Lebanon.
So I hope I have answered your question.
p.s. It is unfortunate to say that even Ahmadis of today do not possess INDEPENDENT thinking. And they have become a copy of the tribal practices of Sunnis and Shias.
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
LOL burqaboy you made my day. Khalifas = despotic tribal rulers? .. Muslims wearing hijba = not Pakitani culture? lol
and Numb comes along and says "Ummah is doomed because they called Ahmadies non-Muslim" lol,, give me a break.
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
Blah blah blah Posh. Do a quick google search and learn when the Nobel prize opened up for non-western nations.
Its like saying Martin Luther King is a failure because the Nobel Prize wasn't given to him. Of course it wasn't. He wasn't consider an equal back then and thus not worthy of it at the time.
Blah blah blah Posh. Do a quick google search and learn when the Nobel prize opened up for non-western nations.
Its like saying Martin Luther King is a failure because the Nobel Prize wasn't given to him. Of course it wasn't. He wasn't consider an equal back then and thus not worthy of it at the time.
Calm down yara.
Ok so Nobel Prize was not open to everyone. That's fine.
As a self-professed champion of Islamic Ummah, who would you have given or recommended for a prize in Science?
LOL burqaboy you made my day. Khalifas = despotic tribal rulers? .. Muslims wearing hijba = not Pakitani culture? lol
and Numb comes along and says "Ummah is doomed because they called Ahmadies non-Muslim" lol,, give me a break.
they have not called them, they have DECLARED, LABELED. Same like Hitler ordered the Jews to wear the Jewish Star so the Nazis could recognize a Jew.
Yes, right now the Ummat is doomed. The Glory of Old Times are gone! The principles of Islam have been forgotten!
Allah says in the Qur'an that he hates War and tells people to end it as soon as possible and only if necessary Wars should be led! Iraq had been bombed for nothing. Where was the Muslim Ummat? Muslims have the duties ladi upon to care for others, stop bloodshed, violence, hatred. Allah asks humans to live peaceful and to spread peace! Where is the Peace?
Is it just when Ahmadienschad says "Israel needs to be erased from the Worldmap" and the innocent people in Palestine are bombed? Where is a the Muslim Leader? If Saladin was alive, he would have shown these muslim jews and these muslim christians the holy sword of Muhammad (saw)
Where is the Muslim Ummah? The Muslims are UNITED on youtube to give lectures against Ahmadiyya! Have fun...lol...have a taste of yourself!
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
oh great here we heard it all.
for your info, ahmadis would be the first to say "you go, we will stay behind" (that's IF they are considered Muslim).. ahmadis have many bad characteristics of jews. :)
and the ummah is asleep, i agree with you but that doesn't mean ahmadis are on the right path. you can call the ummah whatever you want, you will never win their hearts over some dead man who proclaimed he was a prophet of God. it only works in african villages, go there ur better off.
Re: Eye opener for "Muslim Ummah"
And I never said that Ahmadies are on Right Path, either! my friend! Read carefully, alright!? :)
Why do you compare the Muslims states who have applied the jewish character with Ahmadies?
"you will never win their hearts over some dead man who proclaimed he was a prophet of God. it only works in african villages, go there ur better off."
^
isn't here the jewish tongue barking? ;)
And I never said that Ahmadies are on Right Path, either! my friend! Read carefully, alright!? :)
Why do you compare the Muslims states who have applied the jewish character with Ahmadies?
"you will never win their hearts over some dead man who proclaimed he was a prophet of God. it only works in african villages, go there ur better off."
^
isn't here the jewish tongue barking?
nah, one of the many who barked in the last century was that druggie mirza ghulam, that punk who joined the kuffar and dragged thousands with him. that jahil who sold his soul to the pounds of the british empire. what did it bring him, a cruel death indeed! the jews are known for their cowardly ways, just like them you ahmadies have been fooled into believing there is no jihad. you talk about the great Salah-Uddin and yet when called for jihad, you shy away like the cowards, you hypocrites. every sane individual knows this. don't try to fool anyone, don't try to hide the truth, everyone knows that mirza was a tool. :)
nah, one of the many who barked in the last century was that druggie mirza ghulam, that punk who joined the kuffar and dragged thousands with him. that jahil** who sold his soul to the pounds of the british empire**. what did it bring him, a cruel death indeed! the jews are known for their cowardly ways, just like them you ahmadies have been fooled into believing there is no jihad. you talk about the great Salah-Uddin and yet when called for jihad, you shy away like the cowards, you hypocrites. every sane individual knows this. don't try to fool anyone, don't try to hide the truth, everyone knows that mirza was a tool. :)
**Go and study History, you lack in knowledge very much in this field. Your beloved Rajas and Maharajas sold Hindustan to the British Empire.
We don't say there is NO JIHAD! We just say that Jihad means "strive in Allah's way" and if you know Islam and Qur'an then you should know that Allah hates Wars!
Muslims are not allowed to start wars. They are only allowed to defend themselves when they are attacked! Strive in Allahs way and spread peace!
May Allah guide you!
**
nah, one of the many who barked in the last century was that druggie mirza ghulam, that punk who joined the kuffar and dragged thousands with him. that jahil who sold his soul to the pounds of the british empire. what did it bring him, a cruel death indeed! the jews are known for their cowardly ways, just like them you ahmadies have been fooled into believing there is no jihad. you talk about the great Salah-Uddin and yet when called for jihad, you shy away like the cowards, you hypocrites. every sane individual knows this. don't try to fool anyone, don't try to hide the truth, everyone knows that mirza was a tool. :)
I am really struck by the brazen manner in which you vilify a person who many persons hold in high esteem. You talk about jihad being and how the ahamdis shy away from the same. My dear friend what are you doing here. Why aren't you in Afghanistan, Iraq,Swat. Internet gives you the freedom of screaming without disclosing your identity. That does not mean that you can talk gibberish.