Evil Eye

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

No knowledgeable muslim believes that people are possessed by jinn or they can be possedded by jinn. 'peer faqir' usually in Asia do weird things like beating the 'the possessed person' etc....again it has nothing to do with Islam or Jinn.

believe it or not, if you are follwing "traditional" teaching you must believe that jinn, if not possess, at least influence humans... refer to the traditional rendition and "tafseer" of chapter 114. If you don't believe in it, then good for you :) you seem to be headed in the right direction, but tread on to get to the true meaning of the word Jinn.

[hareem01]

Re: Evil Eye

@hypnotix-2000

So the Jinn are Created out of Fire eh? Consider the following verses from the Quran:

55:14,15 (He) created the human (form) out of inorganic matter that sounded like an empty pot. (And it was empty of a trace of the finished form). And created the jinn (psychological aspects, thought processes, that others cannot see or sense) out of a flickering/smokeless flame of fire (nothing but confused/animal-like/fiery disposition). [Refer to 50:16, 21:37 and 2:30 why I used this interpretation]

55:14,15....(and it was empty of a trace of the finished form)....(psychlogical aspects, thought processes, that other can not see or sense)....(nothing but confused/animal-like/fiery disposition). these are your own words...these are not God's word nor they are translation of the words.
You used your above interpretation bcoz of these ayahs....let's see what these ayahs are saying....
ref 1] 50:16, 'And indeed We have created man, and We know what his own self whispers to him. and We are nearer to him than his jagular vein.'
ref 2] 21:37 'Man is created of haste, I will show you my Ayat. So ask me not to haste.'
ref3] 2:30 'and when your Lord said to the angels; verily, 'I am going to place khalifah on earth.' They said : 'will You place therein those who will make mischief therein and shed blood, while we glorify you with praises and thanks and sanctify You. 'He(Allah) said, 'I know that which you do not know'.
I can't see in any way how you interpretated 50:14,15 in the light of these 3 ayah.

@hypnotix-2000

Of course, the context of the jinn implies this particular meaning for this verse and a select others, but not all of the verses where the word jinn is used. Flickering or smokeless fire refers to the chaotic nature of us humans that we do not see when we are under its influence (hence the word jinn: hidden). Since the intent in this ayah of Al-Rahman was to illustrate that the fire from which jinns are created is metophoric,

how can you say that 'creation of jinn is metaphoric'...if jinn are metaphoric then humans are also metaphoric.that means we're not exist?

@hypnotix-2000

actually implying chaos/chaotic/primal nature, we are given the indication that it is free from smoke. If jinn were beings made of fire literally, why would Allah declare:

21:30 Are the unbelievers not aware ... that out of water We made every living thing? Will they not, then, acknowledge the Truth?

I ask you if humans are made of sounding clay, why would Allah declare that He has made every living thing out of water?

@hypnotix-2000

So traditional jinn-being theory falls flat on its face. The above verses are meant to indicate the physical/apparent and hidden nature of living beings created, principally man himself. We are partly water, our cells are held together by various organic and inorganic compounds and salts. Besides, the way our brain works is quite interesting too since it functions with electrical disharges, something that is fiery and chaotic in nature.

If human cell has 70 percent water and humans are made out of sounding clay then the same metter can be for jinn. They are made out of smokeless fire, may be thier cell is containing 70% or more than 70% water.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

55:14,15....(and it was empty of a trace of the finished form)....(psychlogical aspects, thought processes, that other can not see or sense)....(nothing but confused/animal-like/fiery disposition). these are your own words...these are not God's word nor they are translation of the words. You used your above interpretation bcoz of these ayahs....let's see what these ayahs are saying.... ref 1] 50:16, 'And indeed We have created man, and We know what his own self whispers to him. and We are nearer to him than his jagular vein.' ref 2] 21:37 'Man is created of haste, I will show you my Ayat. So ask me not to haste.' ref3] 2:30 'and when your Lord said to the angels; verily, 'I am going to place khalifah on earth.' They said : 'will You place therein those who will make mischief therein and shed blood, while we glorify you with praises and thanks and sanctify You. 'He(Allah) said, 'I know that which you do not know'. I can't see in any way how you interpretated 50:14,15 in the light of these 3 ayah.

what seems to be your question? Where do you see disagreement?

how can you say that 'creation of jinn is metaphoric'...if jinn are metaphoric then humans are also metaphoric.that means we're not exist?

I am not saying the creation is metaphoric... I am saying the deption of fire is metaphoric for the fiery nature.

I ask you if humans are made of sounding clay, why would Allah declare that He has made every living thing out of water?

:) I think I have answered this

If human cell has 70 percent water and humans are made out of sounding clay then the same metter can be for jinn. They are made out of smokeless fire, may be thier cell is containing 70% or more than 70% water.

Sounding clay is metaphoric... it is used to depict the form.

[hareem01]

Re: Evil Eye

@hypnotix-2000

So Iblis is Shaitan (satan), Jinn (demon) and a Malikah (angel)? Iblis, a word synonymously used for Satan in the traditional Islamic belief, is considered a jinn-being who was demoted from the status of angel or malikah after he rebelled. Actually, this belief is not unlike the biblical story of the Archangel Lucifer (this is ironic, since Christians consider this to be the actual name of Satan described in the Bible, even when this name is European and not Semetic).

Coming back to Iblis, there is no doubt that this name comes from the Arabic root BLS implying sorrow, anguish and grief. Hence, Iblis would mean that element which causes BLS, and implies the rebelious side of mankind. The representation in classical terms is as follows:

• Iblis as jinn: Something hidden to our psyche (not a separate/living being)

• Iblis as malikah: Something that can control our psyche (not a separate/living being)

• Iblis as shaitan: Something that is distanced from truth/reason (not a separate/living being)

A competing theory of the name Iblis is that it was derived from the Greek: Diabolos, which literally means something drawn across (Dia : across, Bolos : throw/draw/cast). Ideologically, it refers to something that causes confusion/deviation from the straight path. This word later became the Roman/Italian Diabolo, Romanian/Slavic Dracul/Dracula, and the English Devil. It is suggested that the "D" was considered as a prefix by the Arabs/Semites and they adopted "Iabolos". This morphed into Iblis in Pre-Islamic Arabia over the centuries. This theory does have its fair share of open-ended questions, foremost of which is why this name or its etymological counterpart is not present in Hebrew, Aramaic or Sabaic. !

yes, Iblis is a Jinn and after disobeying Allah he's also a Shaitan.
Shaitan is from shatan which means distance and shaitan that is distanced.
According to Qur'an There are shaitan among humans and shaitan among jinn.
Surah 6 ayah112:' And so We have appointed for every Prophet enemies, Shayatin(devils) among mankind and jinn.....'
Also in Masnad Ahmad it is narrated from Abu Zar(RA) that Prophet Muhammad(pbuh) said:' O Abu Zar! seek refuge in Allah from the Shayatin among humans and jinn'.I asked ' are there shayatin among humans '.He(prophet Muhammad(pbuh) said, 'Yes'.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

yes and in effect, there is a "devil" inside each and everyone of us. It is not a separate being but our own set of thought processes that tend towards negativity.

yes, Iblis is a Jinn and after disobeying Allah he's also a Shaitan. Shaitan is from shatan which means distance and shaitan that is distanced. According to Qur'an There are shaitan among humans and shaitan among jinn. Surah 6 ayah112:' And so We have appointed for every Prophet enemies, Shayatin(devils) among mankind and jinn.....' Also in Masnad Ahmad it is narrated from Abu Zar(RA) that Prophet Muhammad(pbuh) said:' O Abu Zar! seek refuge in Allah from the Shayatin among humans and jinn'.I asked ' are there shayatin among humans '.He(prophet Muhammad(pbuh) said, 'Yes'.

[Rush]

Re: Evil Eye

@Furqan

How does one protect itself from an evil eye. Sometimes people call it "nazar laga di" etc.. etc.. umm in this world there are some envious people who have the most sick/dirty/Black eye which can destroy someones life. I need help majorly.

ref: Ma'arif Al-kuran, Vol 8, page 539

Surah Qalam, ayah 50-52

[hareem01]

Re: Evil Eye

@hypnotix-2000

So Idols are Jinn? Quran, in 34:41 declares that idol-worshippers worship jinns:

34:41 They will answer, "Glory is Yours! You are our Master, not them. Nay, they used to worship the jinn (invisible guises of their selfish desire). Most of them were believers therein." [Jinn = Hidden from sight. Generally this term in the Qur’an applies to nomads rarely appearing in townships. It is also used to describe rebellious desire, emotions and fiery temperament like Satan 6:101, 18:50, 37:158, 55:15]

Allah says in the Qur'an; 6:112
' Likewise did We make for every Messenger an enemy,- evil ones among men and jinns, inspiring each other with flowery discourses by way of deception. If thy Lord had so planned, they would not have done it: so leave them and their inventions alone'.
In another chapter 7 ayah 200,201of Quran Allah says: ' If a suggestion from Satan assail thy (mind), seek refuge with Allah. for He heareth and knoweth (all things).
Those who fear Allah, when a thought of evil from Satan assaults them, bring Allah to remembrance, when lo! they see (aright)!

The worse a shaitan can do is to whisper FOR evil doing.
Shayatin have no power over us except suggesting bad things to us.It depends on us if we listen to them or ignore them.
At the time of fajar shatan comes to us and whisper , ' dont wake up for salaat'.if we listen to him ,we dont read salaat and if we ignore him then we wake up and read our salaat.
only if you ask Allah for His refuge then the Satan run away.
the shayatin who whisper or suggest things to us are those who are from jinn thats why we can't see them.but according to Quran there are also shayatin among humans [evil people].
Allah says in the Qur'an chapter 16 ayah 98,99: ' When thou dost read the Qur'an, seek Allah's protection from Satan the rejected one.
No authority has he over those who believe and put their trust in their Lord.
Also there is a hadith:
Abul-Maleeh (ra) reports that a man said, "I was behind the Messenger (saw) and his riding animal stumbled. I said, "May Shaytaan perish", and he said, "Do not say, "May Shaytaan perish". If you say that he will grow in size until he becomes the size of a house and says, "By my strength". Instead say, "In the Name of Allaah". When you say that, he reduces in size until he is like a fly." (Abu Dawood, saheeh isnad).
In your quoted ayah34:41....first read one ayah before it 34:40 ' One Day He will gather them all together, and say to the angels, "Was it you that these men used to worship?"
and ayah 41:' They will say, "Glory to Thee! our (tie) is with Thee - as Protector - not with them. Nay, but they worshipped the Jinns: most of them believed in them."
' worshipped the Jinns mean ' that they listened to what jinns were whispering or suggesting to them.

[/quote]

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

ref: Ma'arif Al-kuran, Vol 8, page 539

Surah Qalam, ayah 50-52

Presented is a word for word literal translation... please tell me where is the evil eye:

وَإِنْ يَكَادُ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا لَيُزْلِقُونَكَ بِأَبْصَرِهِمْ لَمَّا سَمِعُوا الذِّكْرَ وَيَقُولُونَ إِنَّهُ لَمَجْنُونٌ
And indeed those who disbelieve would almost offend you through their eyes when they hear the reminder and they say, surely he is crazy/schizophrenic.

وَمَا هُوَ إِلَّا ذِكْرٌ لِلْعَلَمِينَ
No however,since this is nothing except a reminder-for/giver-of-eminence-to (all) worlds/times/nations.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

Hareem01 you can't have your cake and eat it at the same time... you use one argument and then forget that it is refuting your earlier argument.

You mentioned the verse where :
ref 1] 50:16, 'And indeed We have created man, and We know what his own self whispers to him. and We are nearer to him than his jagular vein.'

And now you say jinns whisper into mans heart and that worshipping jinns is like listening to their whispers. So clearly jinns are NOT beings... the word jinn is describing an attribute that in this instance is describing the human psyche that a person does not or cannot see when he/she is under its influence.

Allah says in the Qur'an; 6:112 ' Likewise did We make for every Messenger an enemy,- evil ones among men and jinns, inspiring each other with flowery discourses by way of deception. If thy Lord had so planned, they would not have done it: so leave them and their inventions alone'. In another chapter 7 ayah 200,201of Quran Allah says: ' If a suggestion from Satan assail thy (mind), seek refuge with Allah. for He heareth and knoweth (all things). Those who fear Allah, when a thought of evil from Satan assaults them, bring Allah to remembrance, when lo! they see (aright)!

The worse a shaitan can do is to whisper FOR evil doing. Shayatin have no power over us except suggesting bad things to us.It depends on us if we listen to them or ignore them. At the time of fajar shatan comes to us and whisper , ' dont wake up for salaat'.if we listen to him ,we dont read salaat and if we ignore him then we wake up and read our salaat. only if you ask Allah for His refuge then the Satan run away. the shayatin who whisper or suggest things to us are those who are from jinn thats why we can't see them.but according to Quran there are also shayatin among humans [evil people]. Allah says in the Qur'an chapter 16 ayah 98,99: ' When thou dost read the Qur'an, seek Allah's protection from Satan the rejected one. No authority has he over those who believe and put their trust in their Lord. Also there is a hadith: Abul-Maleeh (ra) reports that a man said, "I was behind the Messenger (saw) and his riding animal stumbled. I said, "May Shaytaan perish", and he said, "Do not say, "May Shaytaan perish". If you say that he will grow in size until he becomes the size of a house and says, "By my strength". Instead say, "In the Name of Allaah". When you say that, he reduces in size until he is like a fly." (Abu Dawood, saheeh isnad). In your quoted ayah34:41....first read one ayah before it 34:40 ' One Day He will gather them all together, and say to the angels, "Was it you that these men used to worship?" and ayah 41:' They will say, "Glory to Thee! our (tie) is with Thee - as Protector - not with them. Nay, but they worshipped the Jinns: most of them believed in them." ' worshipped the Jinns mean ' that they listened to what jinns were whispering or suggesting to them.

[Rush]

Re: Evil Eye

Presented is a word for word literal translation... please tell me where is the evil eye:

وَإِنْ يَكَادُ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا لَيُزْلِقُونَكَ بِأَبْصَرِهِمْ لَمَّا سَمِعُوا الذِّكْرَ وَيَقُولُونَ إِنَّهُ لَمَجْنُونٌ And indeed those who disbelieve would almost offend you through their eyes when they hear the reminder and they say, surely he is crazy/schizophrenic.

وَمَا هُوَ إِلَّا ذِكْرٌ لِلْعَلَمِينَ No however,since this is nothing except a reminder-for/giver-of-eminence-to (all) worlds/times/nations.

please read page 539 of the given ref.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

please read page 539 of the given ref.

I read it a long time ago and did not agree with it. Sanad is something that has documented proof... there is no such thing as "evil eye"... wake up!

[Rush]

Re: Evil Eye

If you dont agree with it, that is your personal choice.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

:) it goes both ways...

If you dont agree with it, that is your personal choice.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

Salam mufakkar,

I am really grateful for the kind words. The credit goes to Allah however... I am merely responsible for the mistakes.

The idea is not to prove that I am right. The idea is to get people to think that perhaps all that is propelled today as part of Islam may have nothing to do with the Divine way of life that is Islam.

If I would have gotten even a single person on this forum to think on this issue (and from your reply, I think I have been able to do that,) I have made a world of a difference.

Sincerely,
Hypnotix-2000

@mufakkar

Hypnotix,

Yours is a well thought out and convincing thesis with enough intellectual rigor in it to give merit to your argument. While I also await rebuttals to your POV, I thought you should know that your argument is impressive.

[hareem01]

Re: Evil Eye

Hareem01 you can't have your cake and eat it at the same time... you use one argument and then forget that it is refuting your earlier argument.

You mentioned the verse where : ref 1] 50:16, 'And indeed We have created man, and We know what his own self whispers to him. and We are nearer to him than his jagular vein.'

And now you say jinns whisper into mans heart and that worshipping jinns is like listening to their whispers. So clearly jinns are NOT beings... the word jinn is describing an attribute that in this instance is describing the human psyche that a person does not or cannot see when he/she is under its influence.

6:112,' Likewise did We make for every Messenger an enemy,- evil ones among men and jinns, inspiring each other with flowery discourses by way of deception. If thy Lord had so planned, they would not have done it: so leave them and their inventions alone.'

7:200, *201, *'If a suggestion from Satan assail thy (mind), seek refuge with Allah. for He heareth and knoweth (all things).' . 'Those who fear Allah, when a thought of evil from Satan assaults them, bring Allah to remembrance, when lo! they see (aright)! '

23:96.,97,' Repel evil with that which is best: We are well acquainted with the things they say.' **'** And say "O my Lord!** I seek refuge with Thee from the suggestions of the Evil Ones'**
41:36. 'And if (at any time) an incitement to discord is made to thee by the Evil One, seek refuge in Allah. He is the One Who hears and knows all things'

You are superimposing two different whisperers into one.The Quran clarifies
there are two different whisperers.
Surah 114:4-6 ' From the evil of the whisperer who withdraws, who whispers in the breast of mankind, of Jinn and Men.

So this states that there is a whisperer from the jinn and a different whisperer from the men.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

Again, the word jinn is not use to indicate a species or our inner desire alone... at places, Nomads/cavemen are implied as jinn and INS implied city/town/urban dwellers. It does not mean to indicate ONE entity... at other places such as chapter 114 it indicates the hidden psyche from which the whispering of the blinding desire is heard by the human councious.

It is interesting that Qabar (grave) is also known as JaNaN in Arabic, since it hides/conceals the dead...

Based on this, now can you imagine the versatility of this word and in how many different ways it must have been used in the Quran?

6:112,' Likewise did We make for every Messenger an enemy,- evil ones among men and jinns, inspiring each other with flowery discourses by way of deception. If thy Lord had so planned, they would not have done it: so leave them and their inventions alone.'

7:200, *201, *'If a suggestion from Satan assail thy (mind), seek refuge with Allah. for He heareth and knoweth (all things).' . 'Those who fear Allah, when a thought of evil from Satan assaults them, bring Allah to remembrance, when lo! they see (aright)! '

23:96.,97,' Repel evil with that which is best: We are well acquainted with the things they say.' **'** And say "O my Lord!** I seek refuge with Thee from the suggestions of the Evil Ones'** 41:36. 'And if (at any time) an incitement to discord is made to thee by the Evil One, seek refuge in Allah. He is the One Who hears and knows all things'

You are superimposing two different whisperers into one.The Quran clarifies there are two different whisperers. Surah 114:4-6 ' From the evil of the whisperer who withdraws, who whispers in the breast of mankind, of Jinn and Men.

So this states that there is a whisperer from the jinn and a different whisperer from the men.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

Let me clarify this for your Hareem01 since you seem to be a bit confused about this:

JNN: JINN, JAANN, JANNA, JANNAH/T, JANAN, MAJNOON point to the aspect of hidden/veiled/concealed/seldom-seen in one way or the other

ShTN: ShAITAN, ShUTUN point to anything distanced from truth and reason

BLS: BALAS, IBLEES points to what causes grief and dispair

MLK: MALIK, MAALIK, MALIKAH/T, MALAA'IK, MULK point to being in the domain/control of

[Vedic_Intellect]

Re: Evil Eye

Typical response, yet again... yes being muslim does not mean someone who does not question. Vedic_Intellect is correct in his question. Islam is a system to lead a pragmatic life that is meant to cleanse ourselves from superstition and conjuncture! Evil Eye is nothing but speculation and superstition...

exactly! questioning helps you understand better!

Hareem... I'm half-muslim.. if you must know.. go on.. and give me a lecture about how theres no such thing as a half-muslim and either im musllim or a kafir lol...

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Evil Eye

Peace Vedic_Intellect,
If you keep up a sincere search, you will for sure be a full muslim very soon :) keep up the good work and keep looking for the truth.

exactly! questioning helps you understand better!

Hareem... I'm half-muslim.. if you must know.. go on.. and give me a lecture about how theres no such thing as a half-muslim and either im musllim or a kafir lol...

[hareem01]

Re: Evil Eye

Let me clarify this for your Hareem01 since you seem to be a bit confused about this:

JNN: JINN, JAANN, JANNA, JANNAH/T, JANAN, MAJNOON point to the aspect of hidden/veiled/concealed/seldom-seen in one way or the other

ShTN: ShAITAN, ShUTUN point to anything distanced from truth and reason

BLS: BALAS, IBLEES points to what causes grief and dispair

MLK: MALIK, MAALIK, MALIKAH/T, MALAA'IK, MULK point to being in the domain/control of

For me: Barkat is in the kitchen
For you: Kitchen is Blessed....

I'm not confused you are confused....

If you are truthful in saying that Jinn are not creatures
If you are truthful that jinn are ' thought process'
then say 'Be death be upon me'

I'm saying look I'm saying If I lie that Jinn are creatures of Allah then Death be upon me.