Ok so I had this most awesome beef pie today and was wondering the same thing.. I read "Bismillah" over it first though, I wonder if that sufices..
I may very well be wrong but here's how I see it, I thought it's okay to eat if it's been slaughtered (as opposed to shot) by a Muslim, Christian or Jew (as opoposed to a Hindu or Atheist) and the name of Allah/God/Jehovah was mentioneed over it (as opposed to that of a fake pagan deity such as Latt or Krishna or something).
I have three questions..
1) If no deities name has been mentioned at the time of slaughter, can I just say God's name over the cooked dish and eat it? Is there anything to say it must be at the atime of slaughter?
2) Does the butcher have to be from the three Semitic religions? Or was this rule only because at the time ervyone else sacrificed in other than God's name and only Muslims, Christians and Jews slaughtered in Allah's name?
3) I heard stunning does not kill the animal, is it okay to eat meat which has been stuneed first and then sluaghtered?
I am not talking about the methods of slaughter. I am talking about the point made by someone that since the christians believe that Jesus is the son of God, hence they are no longer “People of the Book”.
Re: methods of slaughter, I am sure some of the modern methods employed by muslims in muslim countries were not present in 700 AD either, but that, by itself, doesn’t invalidate the zabihah. Ofcourse, if any of these processes (including stunning) results in the animal being dead before the slaughter takes place, then its a problem. In which case, you have to find data for what percentage of animals die as a result of stunning, and whether it is an acceptably low percentage e.g. 2% or less. On the other hand, if you find out that, for example 14-15% of animals die as a result of stunning, and that it is an unacceptably higher rate, then stay away from that meat.
There are two kind of slaughtering methods allowed in USA by USDA (US Dept of Agriculture), one is based on the USDA regualtions slaughtering method and the other is religious slaughtering method. Both Muslims and Jews are allowed to follow their religious method of slaughtering. Even Orthodox Sachet (the rabbi who allowed to slaughter animals) say prayers on the first and last. They do not allow stunning, this is the reason their meat is pale yellow color. The Mufti Saheban sit in Pakistan, India and other countries have no practical expereince in slaughtering methods in USA and they make fatwa based on the books but never try to see how ahlekitab perform slaughtering.
While we're at it, I have never really seen animals being slaughtered other than on Eid.
Do all the Muslim butchers read kalima over every single animal and slaughter it the Islamic way? Do their religious devotion count? Ie. if they're practicing or not? What other things do many of you look for when getting meat from a Muslim?
I'm just curious, as I don't go buy meat or see it getting slaughtered.
Sadiyah, would you be surprised if i ell you that in KSA atleast in one meat plant, the kalma is on a looped tape.
and yeah, i have seen it with my own eyes.
as far as blood red vs pale meat colour goes, how many of you have bought blood red meat dripping with blood from a zabeeha meat shop? I have to drain it all myself after I bring it home.
I don’t think Fraudia is approving it, he is stating a fact… I think the way to “zabihafy” is that it be pronounced by a Muslim when the animal is slaughtered.
whether Muslim butchers really pronounce kalima when slaughtering an animal or not is a different issue from stunning it then zabihafying/butchering, yes/no?
I would feel Ok if Kalmah is said in the morning for all animals to be properly slaughtered.
The person who reads kalmah has to be clean and has an intent that he/she is reading kalmah for all animals for that day.
I think that most scholars say it’s not okay and a small minority say it is. I would guess that the halal meat factory in Saudi that Fraudia is talking about is certified by an authority from the minority, and that Saudi Arabia allows all meat certified by any halal authority to be distributed.
As far as the actual food is concerned the idea is to get as much blood as possible out with as little as possible pain to the cattle, which doesn't necessarily happen at slaughter houses. The minute the cattle is stunned or shot (the two most common practices) they are immediately put on a conveyer belt where they are cut into pieces, without waiting for the blood to drain. I have talked to the meat guy behind the counter & they say while cutting most of the blood does drain out but I still have my doubts.
This is not to say that the modern 'halaal' slaughter houses don't do things at the same speed.
Oh and for the least amount of pain for the animal being sacrificed, only Allah knows cos you can argue many different ways.
All those buffoons invoking the Ahle-Kitab card in order to justify their disgusting act of eating non-zabeeha food should ask how many people who actually slaughter and prepare meat in the US/West are actually Ahle-Kitab to begin with and secondly do they use the methods prescribed to them to slaughter meat....
CheG, what is the prescribed way to slaughter meat for Muslims and how is it different from the prescribed way given to Christians or Jews? As any Christian, better yet ask a priest and see if he know what is the 'prescribed' way?
Captain1, yes, it does seem to be a different issue.
CheGuvera, you should try to be respectful to the beliefs of others. Often times there is more than one correct opinion. No one is forcing those who prefer meat by Muslims alone to consume the meat by ahle-kitaab.
okay now, your question : “What about others? Do others approve of it who strictly prefer to consume meat by Muslim butchers/slaughterhouses?” is to ask guppies of their opinion or a known scholarly opinion?
Captain1, I'm assuming the guppies here are most likely following the opinion of the scholars. I believe I may have read on it in the past and there seemed to be several opinions about Muslim butchers.
It'd be nice if you could share them if you have access to them.
Ok I have concluded after spending good 30 min on this thread
Where I live or I should say, whenever anybody lives in USA for at least, there are 100 different ways of avoiding food that is extremely doubtful of being Halal or Haram on us.
If you say that 'Oh I cant eat fish every day' then that is BS. Sure you can, if not eat Tuna if not eat salad if not go home eat your home food.
We SURELY can avoid the very doubtful halal/haram food outside. There are so many reasons not to eat EVEN if the Ahl-e-Kitaam Issue is justified e.g. Oil that is used, the utensils at McDonalds to flip meat (fish/beef/chicken). So to avoid all that do not eat that is very very much doubtful.
Couple of year's ago, I never used to eat anything from outside but now I do eat it every now and then. But whenever I do eat it, I have this feeling that I am doing something terribly wrong. I am trying my best not to eat Jhattka. May Allah give me enough strength to do such. Ameen.
Eating Jhattka is permissible…But one should not abuse one’s permissibility according to my Imam…
It’s shouldn’t be that if Daal is cooked in your house and you say, 'Heck. I feel like eating a burger rather than that…" In the presence of Halal food, permissible food takes a back seat…
And anyways, you can eat it…Why?
Because in Islam there is a phrase in Arabic which literally means ‘Hanging on someone’s neck’…
It means, if a scholar has told you something and it happens to be wrong, then you take the sins which you did because of the scholar’s mistake and you ‘hang them in his neck’…
And Allah :swt: will account for the sins from the scholar…
That’s why, being a scholar is no small fry…One mistake and you are accountable for all those that do the same mistake that you related it to…