Yes, I agree with the army action. We're Pakistanis, first and foremost. We cannot and will not allow foreign terrorists to take advantage of our land for their sinister purposes. If some Pakistani civilians choose to side with the terrorists, they're accomplices to these terrorists and should be taken care of as is the case in this operation.
No on the principle that the Quaid gave this area autonomy. It is such a wonderful expression of freedom. Using our own army in this way is really unfortunate. However in choosing between two evils ie that of Goras doing this or our Soldiers, I would support our own Soldiers. So far kids have been hurt, if it were goras they would have been shooting kids point blank and then making up some excuses.
I have no problem against any operation that kills or drives out foreign terrorists from Pakistan. My problem is that the army has bungled the operation with 50+ soldiers killed, 100's wounded, with no notable results to show for it, except displaced civilians, who knows how many civilians killed, and bodies of 2 or 3 dead terrorists.
Every time, pakistan army has conducted operations in its own land, it has lost. I don't mean just physically, but psychologically.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Golden_Scorpion: *
THE GROUND REALITY is..... If PAK ARMY would't do this action, US would have created much more TERRIBLE problems for Pakistan. US will never want a STRONG PAKISTAN. BUT right now they dont have other option to give some benefit to PAK against very BIG favour.
Pakistan is not in the condition to STAND AGINST US.
If someday we see that we can STAND AGAINST THE TIDES OF US.... We defenetly will... otherwise PAKISTAN will be another WAR PRACTICVE ZONE for US and Allies.
May ALLAH give us Wisdom for our decisions. May ALLAH unite us as MUSLIMS.
(AMEEN)
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this mantra of if we dont do this then they will do that is getting old now. musharaf and his croonies better come up with better arguments to support their blood thirsty actions. it is like a person killing his mother because he says that if i dont kill her, a murderer will kill her and i dont want a murderer to kill her. this is absurd. we were told that we are marking 50 percent or so of our budget to be safe, and we are sending precious resources to nuclear program to be safe, well then what the hell is going on now that now we are constantly saying the americans are coming the americans are coming and doing every thing against our people. either our pathetic army is just a lazy bunch of morons and corrupt people sucking the blood of pakistani public or we have sold out...what ever the case i do not support this operation in any way because it will sow the seeds of civil war in pakistan and it is the last thing we need at this moment. while we are busying cuddling up with hindus to the east, we are getting our hands dirty in the blood of fellow muslims. pathetic. and as sorry as i am to say this, but if a civil war in paksitan break out between pushtoons and the rest of pakistan, it will be worse than 71..much worse...
PakCanada & Nadz 
INSHA ALLAH everything will turn out ok at the end of this operation 
:k:
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ThandyMazaq: *
this mantra of if we dont do this then they will do that is getting old now. musharaf and his croonies better come up with better arguments to support their blood thirsty actions. it is like a person killing his mother because he says that if i dont kill her, a murderer will kill her and i dont want a murderer to kill her. this is absurd. we were told that we are marking 50 percent or so of our budget to be safe, and we are sending precious resources to nuclear program to be safe, well then what the hell is going on now that now we are constantly saying the americans are coming the americans are coming and doing every thing against our people. either our pathetic army is just a lazy bunch of morons and corrupt people sucking the blood of pakistani public or we have sold out...what ever the case i do not support this operation in any way because it will sow the seeds of civil war in pakistan and it is the last thing we need at this moment. while we are busying cuddling up with hindus to the east, we are getting our hands dirty in the blood of fellow muslims. pathetic. and as sorry as i am to say this, but if a civil war in paksitan break out between pushtoons and the rest of pakistan, it will be worse than 71..much worse...
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My Dear
ThandyMazaq
I do Admire Ur National Spirit.
BUT...... To Be REALISTIC is more Better than to be OPTAMIST.
The Example U gave above... Is totaly Wrong ( Sorry to say ) Pak Army is Not Killing its Mother... The Exapmle is like ..... Mother's Finger has Cancer and If Doctor dont Remove the Finger it will Spread to whole Body and She will be Dead. Pak Army is Cutting the Finger Bcoz they done want their Mother to DIE.
Secondly... Offcourse I admit that CIVIL WAR with Pushtoons will be worse than 71 BUT.... Do mind it.. that it will not be a CIVIL WAR... ONLY one Small Tribe is Opposing, all the other PUKHTOON tribes are supporting the Government.
Do Calculate Wat U have in Hand, Wats the Situation and then Take the Decision.
DONT MISS-INTERPRET ME... I have already Mentioned that..... If I think of Only being a Pukhtun or Muslim and dont consider that I am Pakistani, then I am totaly against the ARMY.
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*Originally posted by Malik73: *
Well said. Those who are against this operation no matter what, should be asked what they would do instead? President Musharraf specifically addressed the FATA tribals and implored on them to expel the foreign terrorists, before the start of this operation, so it is not as though he did not give them a clear chance to pursue the sensible peaceful route?
So would the opponents of the operation rather have the American military invading FATA...?
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IMRAN KHAN was asked that ... Why are U against Musharaf for his Actions for Being PRO US.... and He said....
I am not Oppsing him for wat he did, because At the Present time this is Wise Decsion, not to put ur country under the TERRORIST COUNTRY banner... BUT....... ** MUSHARAF has the chance to Take Much more benefit from US, wat he has took now.**
Collective responsibility…I am sure demolishing 4000 homes of people will help in the reform of the tribal areas :rolleyes: (yes I am being sarcastic)
“There is going to be no let-up,” the sources said. “Those who have acted in a hostile manner or fired at our troops are known and identified. Their houses will be levelled to the ground,” the sources said.
Already, authorities were looking to get more bulldozers from Dera Ismail Khan, Tank and Peshawar to begin demolition of hundreds of mud-houses which, the sources said, could take a lot of time.
“We are having difficulty in finding bulldozers. The ones operating in Wana are not enough while others on their way got stuck in Monday’s ambush on an army convoy in Serwakai,” the sources said.
Authorities in the regional headquarters in Wana said they had already served notices on the Yargulkhel tribe under the collective responsibility clause of the Frontier Crimes Regulation.
PESHAWAR, March 24: The government decided on Wednesday to go tough on the Yargulkhel tribe in the South Waziristan tribal region and demolish their houses for failing to flush out foreign militants and surrender their local supporters, sources told Dawn.
The number of houses to be demolished ran into hundreds, knowledgeable sources said.
“We are having difficulty in finding bulldozers. The ones operating in Wana are not enough while others on their way got stuck in Monday’s ambush on an army convoy in Serwakai,” the sources said.
Shameful..
I'll tell you whose homes to bulldoze. It's the kothis of the ISI officers who let these thugs in the first place. They are the ones who allowed the international jahils into Pakistan, study in our madaris and then go settle down there so that they can be used in Afghanistan for "strategic depth". Now they are nowhere to be seen since their former "boys" have gone bad and "strategic depth" became a "strategic hole". Where is the accountability in our army?
Pak army makes the IDF look like a humanitarian organization.
After this, I have to wonder why any pashtun would want to consider him or herself as pakistani.
Even in the operation in karachi by paki army, they did not demolish entire neighbourhoods. Sad.
Pakistan must destroy some real houses to show it means business, not these mud huts which these people will rebuild. Maybe India can lend you some big bulldozers?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Abdali: *
You want a list of MQM terrorism and kartoots just ask instead of BSing. What do you think of bhutto the only civilian marshlaw administrator, who declared Ahmedis kafirs and refused to give bengalis their rights... I can fill volumes, just try.
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Lets not also forget Pak Army's role in nourishing ZAB and the MQM.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by umar001: *
is that a logic
I am sure when your children get drunk, and fallover each other,, you will say "oh look how progressive we are"
lets not forget these backward punjabi tirbal method of implementing "progressive" democracy was to punish a woman by gang rape because her son did not marry the right family
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Your first part about children getting drunk I will ignore as it is not worth responding to. As for the gang rape of the woman in some Punjabi village I'm sure you'll find I condemned it outright if you do a search for the thread. I don't judge what's right or wrong according to ethnicity.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by irem: *
If they want to attack us or fight us, let them come, we can face them and inshallah defeat them. Pakistanion ne chooriyaan to nahi pehn rakhi naa. And waisay bhee sher kee mot is better than geedar kee zindagi.
In Ghazwa-e-Badr Muslims were 313 and Quraish were 1000, but Muslims still won.
First, our leaders allowed them to use Pakistani soil to attack our fellow Muslim country Afghanistan and kill our fellow Muslim civilian brothers, sisters, children there. Pakistanis were against it.
Thank God we refused to send our trops to Iraq.
And now they are making us kill our own countrymen.
What will they ask us to do tomorrow? And for how long will be keep saying yes to the kaafirs?
This is all really truly shameful for us.
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Irem this is just silly talk. No one has threatened to invade Pakistan and it's not our obligation to defend fugitives from other countries. Saudi Arabia has far more resources they should offer shelter to it's own sons instead. Pakistan is a 3rd world country and isn't in a position to take on the cause of Palestine, Al Qaida Chechnya or anyone else. Let's look after our own first.
Maybe I am wrong but IMHO, Islam does not teach us that. In Islam, you want for your brother what you want for yourself and you can sacrifice yourself for your brother but not your brother for yourself. There is no US and THEM among Muslims. We are all ONE Ummah. There is no concept of looking after our ownselves first, thats selfishness. We Muslims and Pakistanis should sacrifice ourselves for our brothers and sisters, this is what we have been taught.
Do you remember the example of Hz Bilal RA, the black slave who stood up for our Prophet (SAw). Did he think he was weak? Muslims are supposed to be brave, adversity should not scare us because ALLAH is our protector. If we don’t take up the cause of Palestine and Chechnya who will?
Vilayt reh k aap logon ka khoon safayd ho gya hay kya? 
Brother, its US Muslims against THEM Kaafirs.
Thank You Ji yah don’t worry ji I don’t get upset over small things very easily lolz u take care ji
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by irem: *
Brother, its US Muslims against THEM Kaafirs.
[/QUOTE]
you make statements like these and then whine about muslims being profiled in the west. can you blame them for being scared of morons who think like this?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by queer: *
you make statements like these and then whine about muslims being profiled in the west. can you blame them for being scared of morons who think like this?
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We're not against them UNLESS they harm us first. Islam teaches us to live peacefully and not harm innocents.
p.s. FYI calling other members 'moron' is being personal and is not allowed on this forum.