Hi, what was the ethnicity of the person who killed his daughter in Toronto, Canada, which was widely reported by media, because she didn't do "pardah" and another Muslim person, who killed his daughter in Itlay?
Oh snap :biggthumb
from wht i have seen, pathan men do not treat their wives better than punjabis,
i'm punjabi, but alot of my cuzns and family are married to pathans, many family friends r pathan,
They themselves say that they wud now get their daughters married to a punjabi than a patahn,
BUt this doesn't mean that punjabi mea treat their wives in general, cos this certainly isn't the case
I guess u cant generalized every man is different, pathan or not; punjabi or not !!!
Re: Do PATHAN men treat their ladies better than PUNJABI men???
Pathan men treat their men even better than their women.
This is not something I have tried to note personally, but most pukhtuns I know treat their women very well.
Interesting responses…
Now I would like to ask everyone, having read thru the whole thread, do those of u who held a biased view as to who treat women better, STILL hold that view???
I would b very surprised if people still harboured biases towards either group.
These biases / superiority complexes are ingrained deep within the 2 cultures, and from my experiences I believe that the 2 cultures are beginning to merge alot more than they used to. Also adding to it the fact that more and more pakistanis have experienced life in outside countries, these biases are somewhat weakened.
What say u???
Not merger. Co-existence.
Re: Do PATHAN men treat their ladies better than PUNJABI men???
lets look at some stats in both provinces and not in absolute numbers but per capita
literacy of women
honor killings
mortality rates
that may give a better insight than personal narratives, dunno where to find such numbers though
lets look at some stats in both provinces and not in absolute numbers but per capita
literacy of women honor killings mortality rates
that may give a better insight than personal narratives, dunno where to find such numbers though
Hi Bhai, I don't know much is this relevant but I found this while searching for honor killing on the Internet.
Monday, May 12, 2008
**
**A shameful reminder of damning crime statistics
*By Shakeel Anjum
*
ISLAMABAD: As many as 260 women were gang-raped and 1,996 were raped in 2007, revealed statistics of the countrywide reported crime, which was submitted to the federal government.
In Punjab, 233 women were gang-raped and 1,509 were raped. In Sindh, 27 were gang-raped and 170 were raped. While, 152 were raped in the NWFP, 33 in Balochistan, 76 in the Islamabad Capital Territory (ICT), 20 in the Northern Areas and 36 in the AJK.
The statistics for the first quarter of 2008 showed 42 women were gang-raped and 428 were raped in the country, 28 gang-rapes took place in the Punjab and 14 in Sindh. The number of rapes in the Punjab this year was 330 as against 32 in Sindh. However, during the last three months, 25 rape cases were reported in the NWFP, three in Balochistan, 27 in the ICT, two in the Northern Areas and nine in the AJK.
Statistics on kidnapping during the first quarter of 2008 revealed that 140 people were kidnapped for ransom in the country. Of these, 47 incidents took place in the Punjab, 57 in Sindh, five in Balochistan, eight in the ICT and one in the AJK. While 2,600 cases of kidnapping and abduction, including 1,998 in the Punjab, 391 in Sindh, 112 in the NWFP, 41 in Balochistan, four in the ICT, two in railway, two in the Northern Areas and 50 in the AJK, were reported.
Figures show 23,144 vehicles were snatched or stolen in 2007. Of these, 13,527 cases were reported in the Punjab, 7,562 in Sindh, 729 in the NWFP, 614 in Balochistan, 537 in Islamabad, 17 in railway, 24 in the Northern Areas and 134 in the AJK. The data for 2008 show 6,229 vehicle-snatching cases were reported during the first quarter. Of these, 3,210 cases were reported in the Punjab, 2,453 in Sindh, 160 in the NWFP, 170 in Balochistan, 179 in the ICT, six in railway, eight in the Northern Areas and 43 in the AJK.
In 2007, 232 people, including 199 in Sindh, 24 in the NWFP, eight in the Punjab and one in the AJK, committed suicide, the report said.
It said 10,556 people were murdered throughout the country during the year 2007. Of these, 5,083 were killed in the Punjab, 2,277 in Sindh, 2,527 in the NWFP, 399 in Balochistan, 100 in the Islamabad Capital Territory (ICT), seven in railway, 59 in the Northern Areas and 104 in the AJK.
In 2008, 2,540 people, including 1,170 in the Punjab, 612 in Sindh, 588 in the NWFP, 109 in Balochistan, 27 in the ICT, three in railway, five in the Northern Areas and 26 in the AJK, were killed during the first quarter.
In all, 5,485 people, including 3,288 in the Punjab, 930 in Sindh, 740 in the NWFP, 230 in Balochistan, 121 in Islamabad, three in railway, 40 in the Northern Areas and 133 in the AJK, died in road accidents in 2007. While during the first quarter of 2008, 1,097 people, including 645 in the Punjab, 187 in Sindh, 165 in the NWFP, 47 in Balochistan, 28 in Islamabad, eight in the Northern Areas and 17 in the AJK, were killed in road accidents.
Last year, 37 banks, including 15 in the Punjab, 20 in Sindh, one in the NWFP and one in the Northern Areas, were looted, while 11 incidents of bank robbery, including five in the Punjab and six in Sindh, were reported in the first quarter of 2008.
Looting of 79 petrol pumps was reported during last year. Of these, 37 took place in the Punjab, 41 in Sindh and one in Balochistan. Twenty-eight incidents of petrol-pump looting, including eight in the Punjab and 20 in Sindh, were reported so far from January to March, 2008.
In all, 3,211 incidents of highway dacoities and robberies were reported in 2007. Of these, 265 took place in the Punjab, 89 in Sindh, nine in the NWFP, 21 in Balochistan, one in Islamabad, seven in the Northern Areas and 23 in the AJK.
A total of 289,751 cases of street crimes, including dacoities, robberies, burglaries, thefts, drug dealing, bootlegging and carrying illegal weapons, were reported last year. While 76,974 cases of street crimes have been registered so far during the first quarter of 2008.
Re: Do PATHAN men treat their ladies better than PUNJABI men???
I wonder why are gang rape and rape figures for Punjab and Sindh so high, especially Punjab. For example, of the 260 gang rapes that took place in Pakistan, 233 gang rape cases occured in Punjab and 27 in Sindh while 0 each in NWFP and Baluchistan.
Of the 1996 rape cases, 1509 happened in Punjab, 170 in Sindh, 152 in NWFP, and 33 in Baluchistan.
Are their some social causes for these relatively high figures for Sindh and Punjab?
“According to a Daily Times report, the Interior Ministry sources said the crime rate against women has significantly
increased during the last two years and cited an alarmingly high number of cases **[FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]– **17,692 cases of violence against
women had been registered across the country, including 612 honour killings, 67 stove explosions, six incidents of
acid throwing, six cases of [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]vani, 2,484 cases of sexual harassment where 405 women were harassed at their offices
and 4,717 cases where women were physically tortured in their homes. The report also said that around 14,091
cases of violence against women had been registered in Punjab alone, including 137 cases of honour killing, 3,049
cases of physical torture in their homes, 32 cases of stove explosion and acid throwing, two cases of [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]vani, 2,709
cases of sexual harassment, where 11 women were harassed during jobs, and 7,951 cases of other harassment. (DT,
Sep 24) Aurat Foundation revealed that by December, 403 women, had been killed in Sindh. 26 minor girls and 196
women had been killed after being declared [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]karo-kari. (D, Dec 12)”
Pakistan Human Rights Commission report about violence against women in Pakistan, containing figures for honor killing.
sad statistics showing some real issues in the country indeed. There may be some social causes which could be a great separate topic for discussion among people who may know better. I do think that looking at some (not all) of those figures in context of population numbers may paint a slightly different picture as well.
I do think that male members of the family dont gang rape their women, however literacy is directly dependant on how the women are treated in teh family especially in this day and age when the value of education cant really be argued against.
additionally, mortality rates would indicate healthcare and general lifestyle, another thing that is dependant mostly on how a family treats its women.
so while the stats you post are indeed very shameful and troubling, they are looking at criminal actions of deviants in a society and not the usual approach of a society.
do we have statistics on literacy rates and mortality rates?
Re: Do PATHAN men treat their ladies better than PUNJABI men???
Sorry, the above Human Rights Commission Report includes figures about violence against women including figures on domestic violence and honor killing. Punjab seems to top killing women by burning by stove.
I wonder why are gang rape and rape figures for Punjab and Sindh so high, especially Punjab. For example, of the 260 gang rapes that took place in Pakistan, 233 gang rape cases occured in Punjab and 27 in Sindh while 0 each in NWFP and Baluchistan.
Of the 1996 rape cases, 1509 happened in Punjab, 170 in Sindh, 152 in NWFP, and 33 in Baluchistan.
Are their some social causes for these relatively high figures for Sindh and Punjab?
In my initial post on looking at stats I had noted that numbers have to be looked on a per capita basis and not plain numbers to factor in the huge population diffeences.
here are the population numbers from 1998
population of different provinces was 73621290 (Punjab) 17743645 (NWFP), 30439893 (Sindh) and6565858 (baluchistan)
now the numbers that you provided when looked on a per capita basis show that Punjab had the highest rates folowed by NWFP, then sindh and then Baluchistan
Punjab 0.002049678836%
NWFP 0.000856644731%
Sindh 0.000558477653%
Baluchistan 0.000502599965%
anyways, just wanted to do an analysis on a per capita basis to have a cleaer picture. The truth however is that one such cases is oen too many. shameful stats indeed.
Sorry, the above Human Rights Commission Report includes figures about violence against women including figures on domestic violence and honor killing. Punjab seems to top killing women by burning by stove.
Thanks for finding the information.
would you mind pulling those numbers out and giving per capita stats?
of ..and literacy and mortality rates? did you have any luck finding those? Thanks
sad statistics showing some real issues in the country indeed. There may be some social causes which could be a great separate topic for discussion among people who may know better. I do think that looking at some (not all) of those figures in context of population numbers may paint a slightly different picture as well.
I do think that male members of the family dont gang rape their women, however literacy is directly dependant on how the women are treated in teh family especially in this day and age when the value of education cant really be argued against.
additionally, mortality rates would indicate healthcare and general lifestyle, another thing that is dependant mostly on how a family treats its women.
so while the stats you post are indeed very shameful and troubling, they are looking at criminal actions of deviants in a society and not the usual approach of a society.
do we have statistics on literacy rates and mortality rates?
I agree with you but it is not literacy and affluence alone. I think social values and structure also play a very significant role in limiting or exacerbating violence against women.
I will give you one example. In NWFP, torturing or committing violence against your wife means enmity with her family which may lead to dire consequences. This puts a restraint on violence against woman.
I personally know two such events.
There was this guy in class 9 in school and her sister was being tortured by her husband and other family members and he took to gun and killed two of them which started enmity that lasted till five-six people were killed.
I know another such incident.
Bad things also occur. For example a girl of an affluent family liked a boy from a poor family and both eloped and consequently were killed.
In my initial post on looking at stats I had noted that numbers have to be looked on a per capita basis and not plain numbers to factor in the huge population diffeences.
here are the population numbers from 1998 population of different provinces was 73621290 (Punjab) 17743645 (NWFP), 30439893 (Sindh) and6565858 (baluchistan)
now the numbers that you provided when looked on a per capita basis show that Punjab had the highest rates folowed by NWFP, then sindh and then Baluchistan Punjab 0.002049678836% NWFP 0.000856644731% Sindh 0.000558477653% Baluchistan 0.000502599965%
anyways, just wanted to do an analysis on a per capita basis to have a cleaer picture. The truth however is that one such cases is oen too many. shameful stats indeed.
Thanks for this. I think we should make a distinction between Sindh Urban and Sindh Rural.
Re: Do PATHAN men treat their ladies better than PUNJABI men???
oh my , what a shame , all these satistics shows that there r so many people in our society who have no morals and conscience
Here are province-wise honor killing figures for the period 2001-2004.
“The province-wise break-up revealed that there were some 287 cases in Balochistan during the last four years. In NWFP, 299 cases were reported, in the Punjab a total of 1569 women had fallen victim to honour killing and in Sindh 2228 such cases were reported during the four-year period.”
Full report at:
since the majority of population n sindh is urban, even if the majority of crimes were urban I doubt it will leapfrog to #2 or #1 position, but as I noted earlier, even one of these barbaric crimes pepetrated by the worst animals of our society is too many. However if you want to have an assessment for statistical curiosity sake, please go ahead.
oh and in the interim I did find literacy rates for different provinces
here is a link
Population Census Organization, Government of Pakistan
again across the board pretty pathetic and nothing to be gleeful about for any province, but it shows that some areas are indeed worse than others e.g. FATA is way below Islamabad etc. and NWFP is below Punjab when it comes to education in most categories for women
Hi X, I meant Urdu-speaking and Sindhi speaking distinction.
As for I remember, Urdu speaking people are 21% whereas Sindhi speaking 67% so Urdu-speaking people have relatively lower figures of these crimes. Anyhow, this is just a guess.
Hi X, I meant Urdu-speaking and Sindhi speaking distinction.
As for I remember, Urdu speaking people are 21% whereas Sindhi speaking 67% so Urdu-speaking people have relatively lower figures of these crimes. Anyhow, this is just a guess.
dont know if they break stats by city levels.
one would assume that this is a predominantly rural versus urban crime
but I dont know enough about it to say with certainty that its a fact
Atthe end of the day, there is a lot more than can be done in pakistan, I think teh figures posted on all fronts show that there is an issue, less in some areas more in others but an issue none the less.
we look at our families and our relatives and freinds and see ladies being treated with the dignity and respect that they should be and assume that is the case for the entire region, and its not. What that means is that we support groups and initiatives that are trying to tackle this stuff.
I invite you to take a look at Human Development Foundation, a group that has done some good work in this area.