Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

[Niksik]

It has to do with religion, because the mother is passing this child abuse off as part of Islam. Which it's not.

So, I'm not going to reiterate what others have written here, because obviously, these are the kinds of issues that make me absolutely angry about some of these tableeghi-type characters.

Can you report this to DCF (Dept of Children and Families)? Reason being, she is legally bound to educate her children up until the age of 16, beyond which her kids can opt out of schooling by their OWN choice (not held back against their will).

If she is not following the curriculum at home, maybe it could be pushed as a case of child neglect? I don't work enough with the DCF to know details. But at least if they have one call being made to the DCF and one investigation on record even if nothing comes of it, they will already be on government radar. That will perhaps get this family to straighten out and follow the law to educate the kids.

OR in the event that she and her husband are up to illegal activity, they already have one solid complaint against them for breaking education laws. I'm pretty sure it is illegal to say you're "home-schooling', and then not even bothering to follow curriculum. Do these kids have to give exams that need to be registered in the state to ensure the curriculum is being followed?

What she's doing, should be illegal, if it isn't already.

I guess the real problem will start when her kid turns 6 because before that officially you don't have to be in school.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

You can also explain to your friend who was born and school-raised here, ironically, that she went through the schooling system, and she somehow managed to come out sufficiently nutty. There is no reason to believe her kids wouldn't do the same.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

Then I would wait for them to turn 6, and then report to the DCF. If your child is like 10 and was never given the opportunity to read or write, then I think DCF will take issue with it, and child protection services will intervene.

[CM]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

It does not PCG. I can say right now I issue a fatwa that all Muslim women must walk around naked. That doesn't mean it is part of religion.

Pakistanis need to learn to differeniate between Islam and what ever culture they think is Islam. Islam dictates that a child MUST have an education. Including girls.

It is hadis that a man that raises three daughters, educates them and marries them off will enter heaven. No questions asked.

[libranrulz]

It does not PCG. I can say right now I issue a fatwa that all Muslim women must walk around naked. That doesn't mean it is part of religion.

Pakistanis need to learn to differeniate between Islam and what ever culture they think is Islam. Islam dictates that a child MUST have an education. Including girls.

It is hadis that a man that raises three daughters, educates them and marries them off will enter heaven. No questions asked.

i totally agree with CM on this one that most pakistanis can not differentiate between wat is relgion and wat is culture. they take some of these messed up things that they were taught growing up and label them as religious practices

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

The other thing you can do is invite her to your home, have an aalim and his wife there of reputable fame in your community, and have them talk to them. Like an intervention of sorts. Except instead of getting them off cocaine, you're trying to get them off stupidity.

[Reha]

Ok so that changes everything. It doesn't even seem like a deen/duniya issue to me anymore. I don't think it's a problem if she wants to avoid exposing them to a school environment. Where does she get the idea that not teaching them to read/count etc. is going to keep them on deen anyway (or that teaching them those things will take them away from it)?

She finds Western society an issue. Everything about the Western world is wrong.

Her words are: I dont care if my kids dont learn the ways of the world, I will do whatever I can to protect my children and their Akhirah.

My question is what does this have to do with religion?

It has to do with religion because apparently children that go to school are all doomed. Every parent out there thats working their butt off to provide a balanced approach for their kids is just wasting their time.

Saving them from schooling and education will help them in their Akhirah.

[Reha]

Then I would wait for them to turn 6, and then report to the DCF. If your child is like 10 and was never given the opportunity to read or write, then I think DCF will take issue with it, and child protection services will intervene.

6 years is the minimum.

The other thing you can do is invite her to your home, have an aalim and his wife there of reputable fame in your community, and have them talk to them. Like an intervention of sorts. Except instead of getting them off cocaine, you're trying to get them off stupidity.

Her sister and father have tried intervention and it hasnt worked sadly. If I hear she married her daughter off at 14...Im callin the cops.

[fat_spartan]

@Reha

She finds Western society an issue. Everything about the Western world is wrong.

Her words are: I dont care if my kids dont learn the ways of the world, I will do whatever I can to protect my children and their Akhirah.

It has to do with religion because apparently children that go to school are all doomed. Every parent out there thats working their butt off to provide a balanced approach for their kids is just wasting their time.

Saving them from schooling and education will help them in their Akhirah.

Well this is not really a case of someone choosing between deen or duniya as far as I can tell. So where's the father in all of this?

[NaMaan]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

In this time and age , not educating a child is criminal .

[Reha]

@fat_spartan

Well this is not really a case of someone choosing between deen or duniya as far as I can tell. So where's the father in all of this?

I asked the same thing...

Her husband is part of TJ and is gone a lot traveling for Dawa purposes I guess.

He is on board and supports her 100%.

Sad, really.

[MIAinVA]

Aisay log hee Islam ko badnaam kartay hain.
Reha, don’t you have any Islamic schools in the area? She cannot possibly be against Islamic schools too, or is she?

[Reha]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

She put them in there and took them out after one year...says they are too corrupt for her children.

[fat_spartan]

@Reha

I asked the same thing...

Her husband is part of TJ and is gone a lot traveling for Dawa purposes I guess.

He is on board and supports her 100%.

Sad, really.

In that case have other TJ's talk to them. I know they don't generally try to keep kids out of school or that type of thing. On the other hand I've seen them emphasize to youngsters to do well academically.

[MIAinVA]

@Reha

She put them in there and took them out after one year...says they are too corrupt for her children.

Wow! I'm speechless.

[asma786]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

islam says seek knowledge from the cradle to the grave-enough said. my daughter is 6 yrs goes to an islamic school there is a girl inher class whom her pareents sents to school inthe first yr and now is at home ,sad but it happens.

[Silver_Falcon_Of_Kashmir]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

Wow. I wonder why they bothered to bring the poor kids into this 'corrupt world'. Are you sure this woman is sane?

[Reha]

Re: Deen ya Duniya? Ya both?

She seems sane and has always come off as one of the most vocal among us when it comes to having to follow or conform to widespread ideas that make no sense.

Im sooooo surprised at her...was just staring at her when she was on her soapbox. I couldnt believe it but then I did say (I get sensitive about topics like this) if she marries her kid off at 14, I'll be the first one on the phone calling DCFS and yelling statutory rape. To which she responded that statutory rape is a Western phenomenon and Aisha (R) was married at age 9.

[TLK]

First of all, Islam is never against education, second thing is .. where did she get this "the next 7 are for education" stuff .. and if she is against west so much, why are they living here ..(did someone say Dollars?)

[PyariCgudia]

@Reha

She finds Western society an issue. Everything about the Western world is wrong.

Her words are: I dont care if my kids dont learn the ways of the world, I will do whatever I can to protect my children and their Akhirah.

It has to do with religion because apparently children that go to school are all doomed. Every parent out there thats working their butt off to provide a balanced approach for their kids is just wasting their time.

Saving them from schooling and education will help them in their Akhirah.

She went to regular school, which is where you know her from I guess? So...by that logic...is she doomed?

Like, dude. What the heck nonsense was she upto in school that she thinks everyone is up to no good at school? Was she one of those girls doing it in the boy's bathroom?

I find her comments, honestly, insulting.

I am a product of public school. It was great. Everyone around me was really dumb or really not interested, and so it was easy to get into advanced classes. Also fairly easy to shine at the top of your school and get good opportunities for college. Well I guess now competition for colleges is more difficult, but not as much when I applied (you know, back when we used to walk to school in the snow...). And I was a VERY good girl. Too good. I almost wish I spoke to more boys, and gotten a bf, because maybe I'd be married by now or something. But nope, I did not have a bf. I went to school, worked my butt off, did well in competitions, and did a lot of extracurricular and leadership work. Pretty much, people got to know about Islam, because THAT muslim girl was doing well and everyone knew about her, so obviously, everyone got to know her personal business too. So they knew that I fasted, and why. They knew that I prayed, and why. They knew that the only vacay I took was for Eid, and why. I mean, being out there and just doing well and having people look to you, you are actually REPRESENTING Islam.

Why can't parents see it like that? Do you know there were people who were muslim in school that I went to who were SUCH GOOD people, that people wanted to DATE them, and MARRY them, and if you were like, well that kid is muslim and it ain't gonna happen, sometimes you'd hear people saying "Well, I would convert for THAT wonderful hottie".

Especially the girls. Jeez. I remember some muslim boys had quite an effect on the girls, and those girls ended up learning about Islam. Can't remember exactly, but I think some boy met a muslim girl and possibly converted later on too.

I think its important to mix. I mean she says she is here for dawah, so how else are you going to do dawah unless you participate in society and show them an alternative social lifestyle?