confused!!!

Gaia · January 26, 2012, 3:31pm

Re: confused!!!

Some of you are really messed up in the head. May ALLAH help you, for real!

As for the girl, she needs her mother. Period. No one needs a dumbass father like him.

Exodus · January 26, 2012, 3:37pm

Re: confused!!!

I'm sorry if I come across a the perfect candidate for the clueless award here. In my defense, I just haven't been able to peak through all the posts within the time I had. Rest assured, I have no doubts about how better a mother can take care of her children compared to a father.

So I'm curious, has the OP mentioned anything about the mother of the fifth child, i.e: her treatment towards the child, was she taking up responsibilities just as most mothers would do?

Four daughters in Pakistan and the husband/father chooses to kidnap the fifth one as well. Kinda begged the question really.

diwana · January 26, 2012, 3:46pm

Re: confused!!!

Muzna:

since you are so efficient at producing links to studies.....would you be able to pull up some numbers on how many female children were brought up by single fathers and turned out okay or not? thanks....I'm curious to compare the numbers.

Far be it from me to deny or even question "a study"......but is this the same study that you mention below that was conducted on criminals?

Granted.....one finds a common denominator....but what if there are other common denominators? Do we isolate the one that is relevant to support our position or do we further investigate?

I'm not saying that the 100 people that ate at the same restaurant didn't get sick from something they ate there.....but I have to also consider how many other people ate there and did not get sick. I will not condemn the entire restaurant. I will say that there could be another reason.......perhaps these 100 folks are allergic to nuts or shellfish and the entrees they ate were contaminated.......perhaps these 100 were people that ate at a party which was catered by the restaurant and an entire item was spoiled......whatever.....

Point is that you cannot simply draw conclusions based on such studies. You need to consolidate a number of such studies. You are quoting a study that shows one side of the coin. Perhaps a study that shows how many female children grew up to be well-educated, professional adults with a well-rounded personality while in the care of a single mother would help us see that your position is correct. If what you are suggesting holds water then the number of successful women would be far lower than the number of criminals.....no?

Seriously? You want to use a GS thread as a study and the number of posters here as a decent sample size? Really is that what you are suggesting?

Like I mentioned in my post, one can try to refute or accept studies based on any statistical method. All I say I posted something which a woman said based on her best seller book and if anyone has problem, then the person should direct these questions to the source.

I agree with these studies, someone may not agree.

So far I have no counter study presented by anyone. If someone wants to refute these studies then welcome to present opposite studies.

Why are you asking me to do the leg work for someone else?

Sorry, but your counter argument on my restaurant example is flawed. Why?

You assumed that somehow other people who ate at the restaurant may need to be looked at. I mean overwhelming majority get sick after eating at the restaurant, even health departments get involved and closes the restaurant. Why? They have to safeguard the people at large and they don't take chance of keeping the restaurant open, by saying, "Oh so and so did not get sick, so keep the restaurant open".

Perhaps those who did not get sick have 'immunity' to the harmful agent. And why should those who do not have immunity to the agent be exposed further?

When it is clearly observed that someone CAN get hurt, then why not try to remedy the situation than continue exposure to ALL people?

I don't about anyone, but if I get sick after eating at a restaurant, I don't go back there. Least I will do is ask my companion if that person ate the same thing and got sick. If that person also got sick. Good enough reason not to go back. I don't go around asking a lot of people if they got sick or not.

You mentioned about the educated people coming from single mothers. Fine. That may happen and does happen.

Let me summarize here something:

Best scenario: Presence of both parents. Ideally a good environment.

Somewhat better scenario: Especially for the girls. Presence of a natural father. Who may marry with another woman and is around.

Acceptable scenario: Presence of a single mother who is well off, has other family support. OR Presence of a step father. But this requires a lot of efforts to keep the upbringing of children in line.

Bad scenario: Presence of a single mother, who may not have other support, who also may be desperate to get married with anyone whom she may have little encounter. Children especially the girls lacking a good father figure.

Studies have suggested that these kind of girls look after their mom's behavior. They also look for a male figure in their lives and then keep falling in love with any male who gives them attention and risk being exploited.

Please read the studies on promiscuous women/girls also.

Regarding your last point, I was merely refuting the requirement of 'sample size' which was asked. And the examples which were given by some posters being brought up in single mother families and did fine really should not make any difference in terms of drawing conclusion in this thread that somehow ALL females brought up in single mother families do OK.

Now: Coming to the scenario at hand as presented by OP.

1- Some people automatically assumed the father does not know his ex-wife and her life style. No one knows. ** He is better judge than any of us.**

This is his daughter too. He decided to take his daughter away.

2- Some people also assumed he did not have permission from his wife. A third person came and told the story. How can we all be sure he did not have produced some papers to satisfy the authorities?

3- Some people also assumed he will cause harm to his daughter. And the daughter has to be returned to her mother. Any proof?

She may very well turn out to be OK or even better if away from her mother.

Possible or not?

diwana · January 26, 2012, 4:23pm

Re: confused!!!

http://www.maritalhealing.com/conflicts/angrychild.php

****Single motherhood and angry children ****

Another source here.

Angry child-ODD
…

A cause of major concern in regard to the growing anger problem in  children is the increased in children being born to **single  mothers.**  In the U.S. almost one third of children are born to  single mothers and in many European countries almost 50%of children are  born to single mothers. A study  cited in the *Village Voice* found that children brought up in  single-mother homes “are **five times more likely to commit suicide,  nine times more likely to drop out of high school, 10 times more likely  to abuse chemical substances, 14 times more likely to commit rape (for  the boys), 20 times more likely to end up in prison, and 32 times more  likely to run away from home.”**

By 1996, 70% of inmates in state juvenile detention centers serving  long-term sentences were raised by **single mothers**.  70% of teenage  births, dropouts, suicides, runaways, juvenile delinquents and child  murderers involve children raised by single mothers.  **Girls raised  without fathers are more sexually promiscuous and more likely to end up  divorced.**

Mehnaz · January 26, 2012, 4:26pm

Re: confused!!!

Diwana, can you please find a study on the psychological and long-term affects on children who have been forcefully separated from their biological mother? Also, a study on step-parents (or in this case, step-mothers).

Thanks!

UZ · January 26, 2012, 4:29pm

Re: confused!!!

Diwana and Edal

Just one quick question for you guys who are so much in favor of keeping that girl in Pakistan, can you answer some simple questions:

Do you even know how step moms treat their children in Pakistan?
Do you even realize when that poor little girl's dad will be gone how alone she will be?
Do you know how hard it is for children who are born and raised in western countries to adjust in Pakistan?
Do you think a guy who already has 4 DAUGHTERS how he will be taking care of 5th one which is hardly accepted by Pakistani society?

And last one if she lives in psycho environment of Pakistan how she will turn out to be with all those step mom beating and totally thrown like a trash.

You are talking about how bad single moms are in Western Society but did you even notice how bad Pakistan's society is where step children are treated like trash. No daddis and phoopis give them love and she will be alone.

Muzna · January 26, 2012, 5:03pm

Re: confused!!!

You brought the studies in question to the table and you have stated that you agree with them.....hence the questions are posed to you. You really shouldn't raise material that you are not willing to either support or defend.

I am not asking you to do the leg work for anyone else. I am merely asking you to be fair and present both sides of the coin.
Certainly if you are confident that your argument is correct then you will have no issues in presenting the other side as well. Of course if the evidence proves otherwise then I can understand your hesitation......

Frankly your restaurant example was flawed to begin with because it simply does not apply to the situation being discussed. The analogy doesn't fit. How can you compare taking a child away from its mother with a restaurant serving contaminated food? Were you suggesting that certain female members of society should be licensed to have children? In that case we have a completely different thread of discussion here.

I was merely humoring you and loosely applied the theory that you have to consider all factors when you decide what the cause of the sickness was in the 100 ill.

Ahhhh.......so it may happen and does happen. How do you know this?

Enigmatic · January 26, 2012, 5:08pm

Re: confused!!!

I didn't read through all those posts in the previous thread pages. But any sane person can see that the father who already is married in Pakistan and has four daughters cannot be expected to take care of this poor little kid in a good way with step sisters, step mom and of course a whole bunch of nosy family to make her life more miserable. It's common sense.

Also single moms are completely capable of raising their kids in a good way. Those who relate ALL single mothers with crap like drugs, teenage pregnancies, multiple boyfriends, booze and partying are being unfair and undermining the efforts of a woman who sacrifices her life for her kids.

Muzna · January 26, 2012, 5:17pm

Re: confused!!!

Here is some food for thought:

“Mom and Dad.” In our cultural fantasies, that team will always be #1 when it comes to raising happy and healthy kids. As for single moms, well maybe some of them are trying hard, but they are up against it, forever trying to lure their children back from the brink of addiction, aggression, and crime.

Before I read reams of scientific papers comparing children who grew up in different kinds of homes, I probably bought what both political parties were selling - the belief in the supposedly overwhelming superiority of two-parent homes. There is a certain logic to the arguments. Don’t children raised by two parents have twice the love, attention, and resources than children raised by just one parent? And isn’t each of the parents in a married couple all the better at parenting for having the love and support of each other?

So I wasn’t surprised when the results of a national substance abuse survey, based on 22,000 adolescents, found more substance abuse among the children of single mothers than among the children of two biological parents. But, considering the rhetoric about single parenting, I was struck by how few of the children of single mothers had substance problems - 5.7% – and how similar the number was for the children of two biological parents - 4.5%. A difference of about one percentage point is not a very big return on twice the love, attention, and resources.

It’s not that two was a magical number of parents - on the average, the kids did better living with a single mom than they did with a dad who was married to a stepmother. The best living arrangement of all (with regard to substance abuse) included three adults - typically, mom, dad, and a grandparent.

What about grades? Relationships with siblings and friends? There’s research on those questions, too. In a nationally representative sample of many different kinds of households - two-parent biological households, single-mother households, adoptive households, stepmother, and stepfather households - there were no differences at all. What mattered was NOT how many parents there were, or whether the parents were biologically related to the children. Instead, whether children had problems with their grades or with their siblings or friends depended on whether there was a lot of conflict within families, high levels of disagreements between parents, or endless arguments between parents and kids.

Sometimes children of single parents do better than children of married parents. For example, a study of hundreds of 10- to 14-year olds and their parents showed that in their day-to-day lives, single parents were friendlier to their children than were married parents. The children of single parents also spent more time with people in their extended families than did the children of married parents.

But if two-parent households have twice of everything that adults have to offer children, then why don’t the children in those households do far better than the children in single-parent households? And why would they ever do the same or even worse?

Here’s how I answered those questions in the chapter on single parents in my book, SINGLED OUT: “I think there are several ways around this dilemma. The first is to let go of the fantasy that all children living in nuclear families have two totally engaged parents who lavish their love and attention on all their children, and on each other, in a home free of anger, conflict, and recriminations. The second is to grab onto a different sort of possibility - that many children living with single mothers have other important adults in their lives, too. I don’t mean just kids who have Grandma living with them. I also mean all of the kids who have grandparents, aunts, uncles, neighbors, teachers, family friends, and others who care about them and make sure they know it.”

Sociologists who have studied single mothers of different races, classes, and sexual orientations have found that those mothers are rarely raising their children single-handedly. Instead, they have networks of friends and relatives and neighbors who care about them and their children, and have been part of their lives for years.

I agree with the traditionalists about stability: It is good for kids. So is the comfort of knowing that you can walk outside the door of your family home and have other adults who believe in you. Adults who have cared about you for as long as you can remember. Many children of single parents have the stability and security of a loving parent and a supportive network.

[Full references to all of the studies described here are in the Notes and Bibliography of Singled Out. In one of my previous posts here at Psychology Today, I described a study comparing reading scores of the children of single parents than married parents in five Asian countries. Children of married parents did better in one of the countries, children of single parents did better in two of them, and there were no significant differences in the others.

Source: Children of Single Mothers: How Do They Really Fare? | Psychology Today

Muzna · January 26, 2012, 5:24pm

Re: confused!!!

gee…I found some more…

SINGLE MOTHERS, FATHERS EQUALLY SUCCESSFUL AT RAISING CHILDREN

COLUMBUS, Ohio – A new nationwide study refutes the theory that children in single-mother households are disadvantaged because they lack the presence of a father.

Researchers at Ohio State University compared a sample of 456 15- and 16-year-olds who lived in single-father households with 2,583 teens who lived in single-mother households. The results showed that the two groups were very similar in terms of deviance and behavior at school, relationships with others, and school performance once factors such as family income and parent education are accounted for.

The results suggest researchers should rethink the assumption that the sex of a parent plays a critical role in the development of children, said Douglas Downey, co-author of the study and assistant professor of sociology at Ohio State.

“It is well-known that there are a lot of problems associated with children who grow up in single-mother households,” Downey said. “But our results suggest the problems aren’t mainly due to the lack of a father. We believe the problems rise more from the absence of a second parent in general, and the fact that single mothers are more likely to be disadvantaged in terms of income and other factors.”

The research was published this week in the Journal of Marriage and the Family. Downey conducted the study with James Ainsworth-Darnell and Mikaela Dufur, both graduate students in sociology at Ohio State.

The researchers used data from the 1990 wave of the National Education Longitudinal Study. Downey said they compared teens on a variety of measures that past researchers had suggested might be affected by whether the children lived in single-mother or single-father households. For example, some researchers have argued that fathers are generally the disciplinarians in families, so children in single-mother households may be more likely to have behavior problems.

In order to examine this question, the researchers used data from the NELS that asked teachers to evaluate children on a variety of behavior measures. The results showed that, if anything, children raised by single fathers were less well behaved in the classroom. Teachers judged youths raised by a single father as less successful at getting along with others and as putting forth less effort in class.

“The results contradict the assumption that fathers are more successful disciplinarians than mothers,” Downey said.

Another assumption has been related to the fact that men score higher on tests of quantitative skills while women score higher on tests of verbal skills. Given these facts, some researchers have argued that children who grow up in single-mother households won’t do as well in mathematics, while those growing up in single-father households won’t do as well in English.

However, the results of this study showed no such difference. “We found that single-mother households didn’t promote verbal skills over quantitative skills, and single-father households didn’t promote quantitative skills over verbal skills,” Downey said. “These findings are inconsistent with the claim that women and men facilitate unique capabilities in their children.”

The biggest differences between single mothers and single fathers had to do with various background characteristics such as income, education and occupational prestige. “For nearly every demographic and background characteristic that we measured, single mothers were disadvantaged compared with single fathers,” Downey said.

This suggests that children living with single mothers would be more successful if the mothers were better off financially. “Parents with higher socioeconomic status are usually better positioned to create positive family environments,” Downey said.

Some researchers have claimed that the effects of living in a single-mother or single-father household won’t show up until adulthood, Downey said. To test this claim, the researchers examined data from the General Social Surveys collected by the National Opinion Research Center. They examined 4,400 adults who reported having lived with a single parent at age 16 (750 lived with a single father and 3,650 lived with a single mother). They looked again at a variety of measures, including years of education, family income and overall happiness.

“Again, the overwhelming pattern was one of little difference between those who grew up in single-mother households compared to those who grew up in single-father households,” Downey said.

Downey said family researchers need to distinguish between family characteristics that affect children’s development and those characteristics that do not.

“People have assumed that the sex of the parent has a major effect on children’s development, but we found that isn’t the case,” he said. “Researchers need to focus on other factors, such as family resources, which seem to have a real impact.”

Contact: Douglas Downey, (614) 292-1352; [email protected]
Written by Jeff Grabmeier, (614) 292-8457; [email protected]

source: http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/singpar.htm

ashykh · January 26, 2012, 8:41pm

Re: confused!!!

for the love of GOD @diwana get the heck off of google and stop posting these long edit articles
i cannot believe you people are so close minded...who the heck cares what background the mother is from...she can raise her daughter better then a jahil step mother who will use her for house chores...

Muzna · January 26, 2012, 9:42pm

Re: confused!!!

Sara516 · January 27, 2012, 4:36am

Re: confused!!!

LOL. Seriously, quoting Ann Coulter, one of the most hateful, extremeist right wing personalities to further an argument against…nonMuslim women?

belledonne · January 27, 2012, 11:30am

Re: confused!!!

OK just got to know how the father exited without the mother consent

His Pakistani wife came back from germany a week earlier with her four daughters, then she took the passort of the eldest daughter her name is Zaineb and left back for Germany in a day or two...

and they made her travel on their daughter's passport how SMART... they reached PAK showed their passorts airport authority asked why there is no exit stamp of this girl...he said how do i know it is your job to put stamp must be your mistake....

The mother went to her ex-husband's brother house with police and is still looking for her daughter.....

I wish she find her soon

kakee · January 27, 2012, 11:35am

Re: confused!!!

what the frick
just report him to the authorities seriously..

S02 · January 27, 2012, 11:38am

Re: confused!!!

^ Looks like the police have been contacted.

kakee · January 27, 2012, 11:46am

Re: confused!!!

in pakistan though?
Doesn't her husband know this guys address?

belledonne · January 27, 2012, 12:03pm

Re: confused!!!

i dont know if she knows their address in Pakistan or not....

Gaia · January 27, 2012, 12:03pm

Re: confused!!!

And that’s the father some people here want this poor girl left with . Priceless.

pokenem · January 27, 2012, 12:08pm

Re: confused!!!

You must tell her mother and authorities as well coz a child can be happy more with mother than father.