Re: confused!!!
As long as he is not abusing the child in any way, then stay out of it. It is his own daughter after all he has a right to decide how he wants to raise her. Western custody laws are often very cruel in terms of visiting rights for fathers. This is really none of your business. It is the mans daughter.
and what about the mother's rights? It's her daughter too, she gave birth to her and has equal right to decide how she should be raised.
Re: confused!!!
and what about the mother's rights? It's her daughter too, she gave birth to her and has equal right to decide how she should be raised.
Sara, kaisi baatain kar rahi ho? Don't you know? If the mother wasn't a virgin at the time of marriage......then she has no rights. DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:p I tease, Edal, I tease.
Re: confused!!!
You're assumptions are very broad
Ok so say her mother is not muslim that makes her a bad person? Incapable of raising a child with standards.?! Seriously? Just because he said he doesnt want her growing up with the mum u assume hes a good muslim.? Maybe he is just afraid he wont be able to control his child as he wishes and pleases. Has anyone thought what the child wants.? He should have bloody thought about how he wants his kids raised before marrying a western woman and having child with her. Or was he just looking for a passport.?
Secondly you say that kids raised in the west by single mums are raised in questionable conditions.? Statistics please. I was raised by my mother after my father died my brother was 1 and i had siblings ranging from 4-15 i was 17 at the time and my mother coped fine and we have the freedom we see as acceptable and mashallah wer uni graduates and in college school etc. just because u have seen a few cases doesnt mean single moms in the west are not capable at all.!
OP Speak with your husband and try to find out more about the situation without making it sound like ur the pne whose going to report the cousin. Also if she has been taken without mothers permission it needs to be reported.
Oh please. Everyone knows children raised by single parents are more prone to teen pregnancy, drug abuse, sexual exploitation, and trouble with the law. Just because you turned out fine doesn't mean anything, some people also live into their 90's while smoking. Single parent homes in the west with a single working mom are prone to all sorts of issues, this is why morality and society is so broken down here.
Those girls selling themselves on the street, or kids out committing offences after dark don't usually come from a healthy home environment with a mother and a father, it's usually a broken home - often a single mother.
Courts in the United States/Western countries, are very cruel and biased when it comes to fathers, imposing strict limitations and standards.
The father made an excellent decision, if it was my daughter I'd damn well do the same, to heck with the authorities and the law. Would never leave my daughter to a single parent home, with only a mother, with rotating boyfriends. If the mother loves her daughter so much she should move to Pakistan to be near to her.
Also you people are naive, this is Pakistan not Switzerland. Nothing is going to happen, courts there are notoriously slow, they don't even process murder and violent crime cases, you really think they will give a hoot about some girl from Germany? Plus the child would be a Pakistani national, thus Germany wouldn't be able to do anything.
You really think Pakistani police will come busting down his doors to grab the daughter and put her on a plane back to Germany? I don't think so
Re: confused!!!
and what about the mother's rights? It's her daughter too, she gave birth to her and has equal right to decide how she should be raised.
No she doesn't as per Islam father has final say.
Re: confused!!!
till the puberty mother will have the custody
Re: confused!!!
You mentioned earlier that you're a mother....so as a mother....you can imagine what the girl's mother must be feeling right now. The girl's mother doesn't even know whether or not her own daughter is dead or alive. You can also imagine how YOUR child would feel if he/she was separated from you all of a sudden.
I think you, as a mother, know what's the "right" thing to do in this situation already. You've already been given quite a bit of advice on how to help the girl. You don't need to explain or debate with anyone here. You have the necesssary info. Now it's upto you to follow your heart and decide whether or not you want to help this little girl reunite with her mother. Remember at the end of the day....choose a decision that will allow you to live life (and look at the faces of your own children) with a clear conscience.
What a beautiful, compassionate, kind and excellent advice. The best I have seen - period. God Bless!
Re: confused!!!
I relate to this so much because same thing happened to my Uncle. He came to the U.S and married some Mexican-American lady in order to get a Green card, stupid I know but this is how a lot of Pakistani men got legalized in the U.S back in late 80's and 90's. He did have a wife back in Pakistan and 1 son.
By mistake, he ended up getting the Mexican lady pregnant and had my cousin (a girl). When she was five he took her back to Mardan (his village in Pakistan), this was around 1994. Her mother complained a lot, nothing happened, courts in Pakistan didn't care and the U.S didn't do anything either. My uncle still freely travels back and forth between the United States and Pakistan.
Anyway the daughter grew up much better in Pakistan, she's enrolled in med school and will be married soon. That certainly would not have happened living with a Mexican lady in East LA. No doubt my cousin would have ended up drugged up in some alley somewhere, or joined a gang, you don't know how rough the streets can be in U.S cities for vulnerable kids. Europe is even worse.
Re: confused!!!
What EDAL said is like this:
"Of all single mothers in America, only 6.5 percent of them are widows, 37.8 percent are divorced, and 41.3 percent gave birth out of wedlock. The 6.5 percent of single mothers whose husbands have died shouldn't be called 'single mothers' at all. We already have a word for them: 'widows.' Their children do just fine compared with the children of married parents." -- P.35
"Here is the lottery ticket that single mothers are handing their innocent children by choosing to raise them without fathers: Controlling for socioeconomic status, race, and place of residence, the strongest predictor of whether a person will end up in prison is that he was raised by a single parent. By 1996, 70 percent of inmates in state juvenile detention centers serving long-term sentences were raised by single mothers. Seventy-two percent of juvenile murderers and 60 percent of rapists come from single-mother homes. Seventy percent of teenage births, dropouts, suicides, runaways, juvenile delinquents, and child murderers involve children raised by single mothers. Girls raised without fathers are more sexually promiscuous and more likely to end up divorced. A 1990 study by the Progressive Policy Institute showed that after controlling for single motherhood, the difference between black and white crime rates disappeared. Various studies have come up with slightly different numbers, but all the figures are grim. According to the Index of Leading Cultural Indicators, children from single-parent families account for 63 percent of all youth suicides, 70 percent of all teenage pregnancies, 71 percent of all adolescent chemical/substance abuse, 80 percent of all prison inmates, and 90 percent of all homeless and runaway children.
A study cited in the Village Voice produced similar numbers. ** It found that children brought up in single-mother homes 'are five times more likely to commit suicide, nine times more likely to drop out of high school, 10 times more likely to abuse chemical substances, 14 times more likely to commit rape (for the boys), 20 times more likely to end up in prison, and 32 times more likely to run away from home.' Single motherhood is like a farm team for future criminals and social outcasts.**
....Many of these studies, for example, are from the 1990s, when the percentage of teenagers raised by single parents was lower than it is today. In 1990, 28 percent of children under eighteen were being raised in one-parent homes (mother or father), and 71 percent were being raised in two-parent homes. By 2005, more than one-third of all babies born in the United States were illegitimate. That's a lot of social problems coming.
...Imagine an America with 70 percent fewer juvenile delinquents, 70 percent fewer teenage births, 63 to 70 percent fewer teenage suicides, and 70 percent to 90 percent fewer runaways and you will appreciate what the sainted single mothers have accomplished." -- P.37-38
"But Americans used to be able to care about the circumstances of their children's births: The illegitimacy rate has gone up by more than 300 percent since 1970. Moreover, even assuming that, sometime around the year of 1969, the entire human race lost the ability to defer gratification, there's still the wholly volitional decision not to give the baby up for adoption. In 1979, only about 600,000 babies were born out of wedlock and one quarter of them were put up for adoption. By 1991, the number of illegitimate births had doubled to 1,225,000 annually, but only 4 percent were allowed to be adopted -- and most of those babies were snapped up by either Angelina Jolie or Mia Farrow. By 2003, 1.5 million illegitimate babies were born every year, but only about 14,000 of them, less than 1 percent, were put for adoption. Not surprisingly, unwed mothers who care enough to give their children up for adoption also come overwhelmingly from responsible backgrounds. They tend to have higher education and income levels and to come from intact upper-middle-class families with highly educated parents.
You will note that we do not read about adopted children filling up the prisons, welfare rolls, and runaway shelters. Adopted children are no worse off -- and, indeed, are generally better off -- than nonadopted children." -- P.43
"A 2008 study led by Georgia State University economist Benjamin Scafidi found that single mothers -- unwed or divorced -- cost the US taxpayer $112 billion every year." -- P.51
"According to the US Justice Department crime statistics, domestic abuse is virtually nonexistent for married women living with their husbands. From 1993 to 2005, the number of married women victimized by their husbands ranged from 0.9 to 3.2 per 1000. Domestic violence was about 40 times more likely among divorced or separated women, ranging from 37.7 to 118.5 per 1000. Even never married women were more than twice as likely to be victims of domestic violence as married women." -- P.57-58
*"A Cornell study found that unwed mothers are 30 percent less likely to marry than other single women..." -- P.70
*
By Ann Coulter
Read the last sentence carefully.
Men are more likely to marry again.
Girls are more likely be raped by their step fathers or mother's boyfriends. Exceptions do apply though.
Re: confused!!!
If anyone has any doubt then read this also. Absence of father CAN have deleterious effects on girls.
We just sensationalize the issue of importance of mothers for girls but the reality maybe something else.
library.wcsu.edu/dspace/bitstream/0/527/1/Final+Thesis.pdf
Re: confused!!!
I relate to this so much because same thing happened to my Uncle. He came to the U.S and married some Mexican-American lady in order to get a Green card, stupid I know but this is how a lot of Pakistani men got legalized in the U.S back in late 80's and 90's. He did have a wife back in Pakistan and 1 son.
By mistake, he ended up getting the Mexican lady pregnant and had my cousin (a girl). When she was five he took her back to Mardan (his village in Pakistan), this was around 1994. Her mother complained a lot, nothing happened, courts in Pakistan didn't care and the U.S didn't do anything either. My uncle still freely travels back and forth between the United States and Pakistan.
Anyway the daughter grew up much better in Pakistan, she's enrolled in med school and will be married soon. That certainly would not have happened living with a Mexican lady in East LA. No doubt my cousin would have ended up drugged up in some alley somewhere, or joined a gang, you don't know how rough the streets can be in U.S cities for vulnerable kids. Europe is even worse.
By mistake?
What? He fell on her? Really?
Giving her a proper upbringing is what he owed her. He didn't do anyone any favors.
Re: confused!!!
Wow I am speechless after reading some of the responses
Re: confused!!!
You know what EDAL and Diwana are saying is right, all western women are incarnation of evil (thats what POPE and his followers use to believe) they are only machines to gets passport/working permits and have s e x with for free and if accidentally they produce a baby, then like a pepsi vending machince they have no right on the product.. because western women have got no heart no love and emotions, they are witches from hell which are only there to be punished... i hope Diwana and EDAL would do the same to these witches of hell!!!
Re: confused!!!
That certainly would not have happened living with a Mexican lady in East LA. No doubt my cousin would have ended up drugged up in some alley somewhere, or joined a gang, you don't know how rough the streets can be in U.S cities for vulnerable kids. Europe is even worse.
This reveals a lot about your way of thinking.
Re: confused!!!
Diwana and EDAL you both seem to have a warped mindset when it comes to single mothers. Do I sense mother issues??? How dare you say that a child shouldnt be brought up in a single parent family? no mother chooses to be single, so one should stay married to an abusive partner just so that the child can have a father? Great environment to bring up a boy in so that he can grow up thinking women are trash or for a girl to be brought up thinking its ok to get beat up everyday cos mummy does!!
I'm a single mother, have been for the past 9 years and the only male company my daughter has seen is my dad and my brothers. My house doesnt have a revolving door for men!! and i know many ladies that are in the same position white and pakistani.
This girl doesnt deserve to be taken away from her mother, the father knew what he was doing when he married the women. If he only wanted to get his stay sorted he should have used protection.
The problem with Pakistani men is they will marry anyone just to get that green card or the permanent stay...
Re: confused!!!
My friend works with the german consulate in Karachi, but I dont have contact with her anymore. Just call the german consulate in karachi and tell them, this is not right!
A kid needs its mother no matter what.
http://www.pakistan.diplo.de/Vertretung/pakistan/en/02a__Consulate/__The__Consulate__General.html
Re: confused!!!
Make sure when you call the German embassy ask them that you want to remain anonymous. Phone calls are recorded a lot of the times. You don't want them to trace you down in any case.
But ur assuming that by this child being left with her mother would end up underage and pregnant in jail for prostitution or drugs. Oh plz. Also do you pay attention to the news? Criminals dont only come from broken homes. For example when we had the riots in the UK suprisingly many arrested were privatley educated kids from well off backgrounds.
You have a very chavunistic view point. Your post about your uncle 'accidently' getting a mexican lady pregnant, what was he so busy woooing her for a green card he couldnt afford contraception...Anyhow if your cousin has turned out well we could assume she is a minority example. Can you confidently say her father has not forced her to have no contact with her mother? Or fed her lies about this woman and led her to believe shes not worth of a motherly status??
If i was forced away from my mother and all of a sudden have no contact with her 'because dad says so' well i would resent my father for that. Islam gives women rights also. Not just the father so its kind of pathetic using religion as an excuse to force his rights. We see this happen alot.! Bottom line is this girls mother has a RIGHT to know her child may not be coming back. This man has 4 other daughters with a second wife whose to say his wife wnt resent this child? And cause more emotional upset. Open your mind abit more instead of saying single mothers are not capable. And FYI yes me and my siblings turned out fine and i know a lot of muslim families like mine who are coping well without a father. Oh and guess what plenty of non muslim families also.
[quote="BellaShabba"]
You're assumptions are very broad
Ok so say her mother is not muslim that makes her a bad person? Incapable of raising a child with standards.?! Seriously? Just because he said he doesnt want her growing up with the mum u assume hes a good muslim.? Maybe he is just afraid he wont be able to control his child as he wishes and pleases. Has anyone thought what the child wants.? He should have bloody thought about how he wants his kids raised before marrying a western woman and having child with her. Or was he just looking for a passport.?
Secondly you say that kids raised in the west by single mums are raised in questionable conditions.? Statistics please. I was raised by my mother after my father died my brother was 1 and i had siblings ranging from 4-15 i was 17 at the time and my mother coped fine and we have the freedom we see as acceptable and mashallah wer uni graduates and in college school etc. just because u have seen a few cases doesnt mean single moms in the west are not capable at all.!
OP Speak with your husband and try to find out more about the situation without making it sound like ur the pne whose going to report the cousin. Also if she has been taken without mothers permission it needs to be reported.
Oh please. Everyone knows children raised by single parents are more prone to teen pregnancy, drug abuse, sexual exploitation, and trouble with the law. Just because you turned out fine doesn't mean anything, some people also live into their 90's while smoking. Single parent homes in the west with a single working mom are prone to all sorts of issues, this is why morality and society is so broken down here.
Those girls selling themselves on the street, or kids out committing offences after dark don't usually come from a healthy home environment with a mother and a father, it's usually a broken home - often a single mother.
Courts in the United States/Western countries, are very cruel and biased when it comes to fathers, imposing strict limitations and standards.
The father made an excellent decision, if it was my daughter I'd damn well do the same, to heck with the authorities and the law. Would never leave my daughter to a single parent home, with only a mother, with rotating boyfriends. If the mother loves her daughter so much she should move to Pakistan to be near to her.
Also you people are naive, this is Pakistan not Switzerland. Nothing is going to happen, courts there are notoriously slow, they don't even process murder and violent crime cases, you really think they will give a hoot about some girl from Germany? Plus the child would be a Pakistani national, thus Germany wouldn't be able to do anything.
You really think Pakistani police will come busting down his doors to grab the daughter and put her on a plane back to Germany? I don't think so
[/QUOTE]
Re: confused!!!
Oh please. Everyone knows children raised by single parents are more prone to teen pregnancy, drug abuse, sexual exploitation, and trouble with the law. Just because you turned out fine doesn't mean anything, some people also live into their 90's while smoking. Single parent homes in the west with a single working mom are prone to all sorts of issues, this is why morality and society is so broken down here.
Those girls selling themselves on the street, or kids out committing offences after dark don't usually come from a healthy home environment with a mother and a father, it's usually a broken home - often a single mother.
Courts in the United States/Western countries, are very cruel and biased when it comes to fathers, imposing strict limitations and standards.
The father made an excellent decision, if it was my daughter I'd damn well do the same, to heck with the authorities and the law. Would never leave my daughter to a single parent home, with only a mother, with rotating boyfriends. If the mother loves her daughter so much she should move to Pakistan to be near to her.
Also you people are naive, this is Pakistan not Switzerland. Nothing is going to happen, courts there are notoriously slow, they don't even process murder and violent crime cases, you really think they will give a hoot about some girl from Germany? Plus the child would be a Pakistani national, thus Germany wouldn't be able to do anything.
You really think Pakistani police will come busting down his doors to grab the daughter and put her on a plane back to Germany? I don't think so
The 15th century called, they want you back.
Re: confused!!!
Huh? 
THe point of my post is to negate that somehow it is not so bad to have no father as long as the mother is taking care of them.
People use emotions when it comes to children not having mother but do not think that father for children especially for girls is very important to be around.
Ideally both parents are needed.
There is nowhere I talked about the western women in general, I talked about the importance of a father.
I posted what a western woman wrote in her book in 20th century!
Did you or anyone who is thinking along your silly ideas got my point?
By the way the junk you wrote in the post is still very amusing. 
Re: confused!!!
Okay so the majority of us believe a child's place is with his/her mother.
Except for TWO: diwana and EDAL.
Sanity wins.