Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
And why would Obama do that, khatti, had Pakistanis/Muslims not pressurized him into doing so by speaking out against the illegal attacks? We can't just tell people to pay more attention to what's happening in the middle east than what's happening in their own country. If you see a Pakistani condemning what the UN calls immoral and unethical policies such as the drone attacks, he's not doing it just for the sake of defaming the West but because it's an issue that is very relevant to Pakistan, it's something that has directly affected the country.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
To be fair, it's not just Pakistanis/Muslims who have put pressure on the US government to open up and scale back drone operations. In fact, it's probably more due to Western reporters and watch groups putting pressure on Obama.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
Whether or not drone attacks can be justified is not the point.
When a Pakistani is condemning the West while ignoring or concocting bizarre conspiracies to explain away terrorist acts committed by his fellow Muslims Pakistanis, well then why should we conclude his lambasting of Drones isnt anything but defaming the West for the sake of defaming the West?
majority of Pakistanis cant stop condemning the drones, but their throats suddenly gets parched when asked to condemn the Taliban or other Muslim extremists.
And I doubt Obama is caving to pressure from Pakistanis. He could have done that a long time ago. More likely its what Ghost mentioned.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
Huma on fire*
You can condemn away all you want, but I think what the main issue is that the condemnation becomes hollow and it affects more people than just pakistanis.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
So just because Pakistan has a million internal issues to deal with, Pakistanis don't have the right to condemn foreign policies?
Pakistanis should condemn all human rights violations equally regardless of who commits those acts.
To condemn foreigners, and that too only NON Muslim foreigners, while ignoring, being apologists for, or concocting conspiracies (especially conspiracies to link Non Muslim foreigners to obvious crimes committed by Muslims themselves) to explain away crimes committed by their fellow Muslim Pakistanis, is duplicitous and suspect.
Correction : all Non Muslim foreigners except the Chinese, who's friendship is deeper the the ocean and taller then the Himalayas, yet ironically are far more ruthless in their treatment of Uighur Muslims then any Western superpower.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
If armed forces from muslim nations took to task and dealt with issues of terrorism in muslim countries, it would be far more fair. But we can't have that! God Forbid muslim nations should get the idea of forming an alliance like NATO.
Aggression without evidence is a one-way street that only Nato and Allies are entitled to (Or atleast that's what has been seen thus far; UN was ridiculed over Iraq invasion). WMDs have been found; Saddam had them stashed in his back pocket when he was hiding.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
I suspect if the Saudis were the ones flying the drones, everyone would be ok with it.
yeah, bilkul theek kaha hai. we are more obsessed with what white/american person is behind the drones than the actual use of drones. makes total sense.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
To be fair, it's not just Pakistanis/Muslims who have put pressure on the US government to open up and scale back drone operations. In fact, it's probably more due to Western reporters and watch groups putting pressure on Obama.
the recent statement from Obama came after the revelation of 4 American's death in drone attacks...so it's neither (muslims or humanitarianjournalists ).
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
Who told you everyone would be okay with Saudi drones? Assumptions much?
Fair assumption i think. Pakistanis salivate it the thought of Saudis.. The Pak govt and media in particular would never highlight or be overly critical of anything the Saudis do. That a fact. If anything, if it were the Saudis, you would hardly ever hear about it. Its only because America bashing is in the vogue that drones even get mentioned, otherwise, it would be just another bombing...
i bet you didnt even know about the 12 people killed by a bomb in Quetta today...
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
Fair assumption i think. Pakistanis salivate it the thought of Saudis.. The Pak govt and media in particular would never highlight or be overly critical of anything the Saudis do. That a fact. If anything, if it were the Saudis, you would hardly ever hear about it. Its only because America bashing is in the vogue that drones even get mentioned, otherwise, it would be just another bombing...
i bet you didnt even know about the 12 people killed by a bomb in Quetta today...
That's true, and very tragic that muslim leaders are deep asleep behind the wheels while countries head to disaster with no law and order present.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
Anyway, just wanted to say that I'm proud of British public who see this attack as two crazy individuals' doing and not as an act by whole Muslim community or religion. Except the EDL supporters...and good on British police for handling the EDL goons.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
If armed forces from muslim nations took to task and dealt with issues of terrorism in muslim countries, it would be far more fair. But we can't have that! God Forbid muslim nations should get the idea of forming an alliance like NATO.
Aggression without evidence is a one-way street that only Nato and Allies are entitled to (Or atleast that's what has been seen thus far; UN was ridiculed over Iraq invasion). WMDs have been found; Saddam had them stashed in his back pocket when he was hiding.
Well someone has to do it. The Pak army which eats up half the national budget doesnt seem to gie rats rear end about anything but their housing schemes, golf courses and perks for high ranking officers. The Pak govt is happy to simply let things be as long as they have something to fill their own pockets.
I'm not in anyway condoning America's foreign policy or drone strikes, let's be clear about that. However, I agree with Ghostie & Med911 here.
The "blame Obama/America for everything" argument is getting really old. And this is rampant all over the Muslim world, so I'm not pointing a finger just at Pakistan here, but it's become too easy to blame the "West" for everything.
Pakistan was founded as a safe haven for Muslims, yet how is that working out so far? Muslims are shedding the blood of Muslims right and left on Pakistani soil...radical Islam is spreading like wild fire yet it's protected and enabled...US is condemned for drone strikes yet the government is taken no steps to cut off their own dependency on US Foreign Aid..the same goes for the Middle East..I had this debate with a group of friends awhile back about how incredulous it is that KSA/Jordan/Egypt/Syria are all in the position to end the plight and suffering of Palestine yet they don't do a damn thing...and the answer I got back (from a Pakistani) was "America won't let them". Ahhhh...okay.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
Anyway, just wanted to say that I'm proud of British public who see this attack as two crazy individuals' doing and not as an act by whole Muslim community or religion. Except the EDL supporters...and good on British police for handling the EDL goons.
Britain is a very civilized society in general. More reason for me to not be critical of the Western countries. They seem far more humane as a society, and far more Just then most of the Muslim country I can think off, DESPITE the drone strikes and Guantanamo, that are blemishes but not outright reason to condemn them.
Re: British Soldier Beheaded in London in busy street
I agree. The point being, it's fashionable to bash muslims for some deranged individuals committing heinous crimes because they happen to know a few arabic phrases.
Honesty dictates that we should have a balanced view of things. There are other countries that seek to cause trouble in muslim countries; it is the obligation of the those muslim leaders to attend to affairs, but they're busy stuffing their pockets and only too happy to look the other way or pretend to ignore the rise of extremism due to whatever reasons.
It's not just one community that's totally wrong; it goes both ways. Action/Reaction/Action/Reaction. What a vicious cycle that causes only the strangers to suffer who have nothing to do with the policies directly.
Overall, this has been an extremely tragic event. Whoever urged those two guys to commit this act should be brought to justice for all to see.