British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
41

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

I didnt post that in order to get your views out about MQM joining some mollah madrassa. I was just pointing out how lota-pun can creep up despite the fact that it might go against a party's tag line secular agenda. I for one never beleived MQM's sincerety so this news to me isnt a surprise.

42

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

Well, in any war, even by Islamic standards, Military is a fair target... Just stating a fact, didnt say I supported it.

43

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

Still wondering how the Mush govt has decreased the strength of the feudals when they are members of his chamcha govt and no land reforms have taken place...

44

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

Maybe you should change your name to Wahabipatriot 1 instead of Pakpatriot 1. :wink:

45

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

That is all handy and dandy but you have got to know who is running this “BLA”. Unlike Awami League [later it and mukti was very much indian military infiltrated] came through a populist voice while the sardars survive by playing off each other. I think everyone agrees that the seventies operation was very unfair [bhutto sahab dismisses balochi govt because PPP wasn’t in power there] yet BHUGTI didn’t have a problem back then because he was CM and actively supported the killing of fellow Marris and mengals! :wink:

My friend’s dad was in the military back then [he like balochis] and he shared stories of the pathetic poor balochi fighters who were fighting w/o even knowing about their cause. I bet you wouldn’t find that with mukti bahini..

46

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

I have been getting that alot.. You know, I have been changing my views over the past couple of years… And I have come to the conclusion that the Balochis have a genuine reason for being up in arms… If Musharaf and anyone who comes after him treat their own people like this, then we should support the people against the Army… Because Pakistan is nothing but for its people…

And whether you like to admit it or not, Baloch Nationalist, barring the incidences where they have killed innocents, have been fighting a just war.

I also have heard the same thing about Balochis, that they fight blindly… One of my relatives is a Captain and was present at some iterogations and said that these people put their nawab over god himself.

But still, doesnt change the fact that Pak govt and this one included has treated Baloch like garbage.

47

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

Actually musharraf was the first one who made a port and opened the Saindak project.

Btw, going by that, would you also support sindhis and mahajirs [bhutto nationalization and quota system ruined Karachi] if MQM starts a movement tomorrow? :wink:

48

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

Those projects arent enough to appease the Balochis as what they want hasnt been repected..

One of the main issues was with the fact that despite being such a rich province, the Balochis are still the poorest in the country.

The Saindak project and the Port in the eyes of the Balochis, is just another way for the govt to exploit the resources of their province at the expense of the people..

The govt never tried to meet any of the just claims made by the Baloch nationalists, not one.. Instead they klilled their leaders and have continues along as bussiness as usual..
If you recall, Mush even Pardoned that Army captain or whatever he was of the rape of that lady doctor that started this whole thing! My god!

As for Mohajirs and Sindhis… Mohairs rule an entire city, and perhaps even the whole province on a good day, so what are they complaining about? Sindhis suffer from the problems that would be faced by any people that had to live downstream froma huge province, in a country thats as dry as Pakistan to begin with.. That has more to do with circumstance then an actual problem… Still, the govt hasnt done well in addressing the grievances of any group in Pakistan.

49

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

Rule what? Quota system and nationalization plus indiscriminate operations against them in the nineties.

Mahajirs are surviving because w/o them, the business of pakistan would be thap but they are not able to realize their full potential of themselves AND Pakistan. I suspected that, as a PUnjabi, you would be clueless about karachi.

Mohabbat
Mohabbat
50

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

Mohajirs rule Karachi... You know it aswell as I do.. And with Musharaf govt there, the MQM has seen its fortunes turned around.. They went from being a beaten and reviled party in the 90's to being part of the ruling coalition...
And if there was any doubt to the strength of their hold over Karachi, all that was dispelled by what happened on March 12th...
Well I was born in Karachi and we lived there for a number of years.. Father was PPP supporting Lawyer until Zia crackdown... Short family history.

And "indiscriminant?" I think the 90's are open to debate. Fact of the matter is, and im sure you would agree, is that Mohajirs are some of the most upwardly mobile people in the country.

So comparing yourself to the Balochi, who still live as nomads, or poverty stricken and illiterate farmers and herders under the rule of nawabs, is like comparing a fine steack to two day old bread... Come on!

And FYI, much of the growth in the economy under Musharaf has been isolated to the main cites... Karachi is just one of those cities.. Lahore and Islamabad, both of which have a substantial Punjabi population are others:)...
So while Mohajirs are good hard working people, dont insult the rest of us by claiming to be the sole saviors of Pakistan Bussines community:)

51

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

The point was about discrimination [hence your support for BLA] and my job was to show that mahajirs have been discriminated a lot as well. If mahajirs are better than balochis, then it has a lot to do with their creativeness as well! Mahajirs are not one single group but a collection of many people from all over india and that is the reason they haven't faded away in history by quota system and military operations..

52

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

[quote]
And "indiscriminant?" I think the 90's are open to debate. Fact of the matter is, and im sure you would agree, is that Mohajirs are some of the most upwardly mobile people in the country.
[/quote]

So you think nationalization was ok? Putting people from outside in karachi when there are millions of fit locals to do the jobs is ok [remember you are basing your support of BLA on this outsiders argument]?

53

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

Not hardly as much as Balochis buddy...
Mohajirs came froma strong base.. They already were well educated and filled a vacuum left by those fleeing to India... Mohajirs were also city dwellers from India, and adjusting and succeding wasnt difficult for them.

The Baloch are where they are not due to lack of efffort, but because they have never had a base to start with. Ublike Mohajirs, they were poor and illiterate at independance and they are the same way now... The fact that their province is so rich in resources of all kinds, should have meant that the province and its people would be well of.. The govt, should have seen to it that these people are brought on par with the rest of the country... Instead the govt choose to ignore them and still exploit the resources of thier province...

So bottom line, Mohajirs were ALWAYS upwardly mobile... They had oppurtunities... The Baloch never had such oppurtunities.

Tablet Suggestions
54

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

But it is not all musharraf’s fault that he gets BLA love in return. How much you try to sugarcoat the balochi sardars and downplay mahajirs, it is a fact that mahajirs made it because of their entrepreneur spirit.

PS The city argument is BS! The biggest slums of the world are in Mumbai and Kolkata which are major hubs of India! :wink:

55

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

No... But like you said, despite nationalization, the Mohajirs have still be succesful... Your trying to compare the problems of Balochis and claiming that issues faced with Mohajirs are on the same level...
Thats absolutely wrong... The Mohajirs, by your own admission, still prosper and still succeed... The Baloch are still poverty ridden and still exploited.. Go figure...
Its laughable to think that the issue of nationalization is on par with the sufferings of a people who have been left destitute all while the resources of their province are stolen from under them...

"My Settings" link is MISSING :(
56

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

In fact, mumbai i believe is a financial hub like Karachi. Like we follow KESC in Pakistan, indians talk about Sensex when talking indian stock market :)

57

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

I, for one, am not handing over free food to some fat ass balochi sardar. If you want then that is your perogative.

If it is about education etc. in **free **balochi areas then that can be discussed.

58

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

No one is down playing the sardars… But the govt has done nothing to undermine the powers of these sardars… The govts role is to support the people, but all they have done is prop up these Sardars and steal from the people…

Who’s job is it to support the people? The govt or the sardar? If the sardar has a virtual grip over his people, who is more at fault, the govt or the sardar?

Mohajirs made it because THEY HAVE ALWAYS been well off… If you move to america and you have a PhD, the lilihood of you succeding is far higher then somone who has a highschool diploma..

Mohajirs came to Pakistan with a PhD so to speak, while Balochis were always illiterate and poor… They had no base to build on.

59

Re: British police arrest "Baloch Liberation Army" terrorists

[quote]
No... But like you said, despite nationalization, the Mohajirs have still be succesful... Your trying to compare the problems of Balochis and claiming that issues faced with Mohajirs are on the same level...
[/quote]

Your issue was that mahajirs are majorly upward mobile which is false since the doors of bureaucracy were closed by movement of capital to islamabad in the sixties and then nationalism by Secretary General of Paki Politburo Bhutto in the seventies. How is nationalization NOT a big thing when it snatched companies made by mahajirs while getting nothing in return.

Karachi has seen some growth for the first time in many years under Musharraf and you, for a karachiite, should not feel jealous about it and support BLA.

60

Re: British police arrest “Baloch Liberation Army” terrorists

Oh yeah, altaf hussain has a PhD! :hehe:

Forgetting altaf, you surely don’t know about Partition because you or prolly even your family didn’t go through with it. Mahajirs came bhookay, in shambles, in 1947. Kindly go look over some videos of that era or read books about Partition :slight_smile: