Re: Bargaining or begging...
^ok ok I replied back to you - two posts down!! LOL
bu if it was a professional field then obviously I am Right =) about the pin!
If you are in a field where you have to do handshakes every now n' then - then just wear a polite batch - a Pin on your left shoulder saying "I don't do handshake" - That will be READ and understood - and will be hilarious - a moment to break into a conversation anyway!
Re: Bargaining or begging...
A narration of Ma'qil ibn Yasaar (Radhiallahu Anhu) who narrates that the Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi wasallam) said:
*"It is better for an iron rod (nail, needle etc) to be driven into the head of a man, than for him to touch a woman who is not permissible for him." *
The hadith is narrated by the great Hafiz of Hadith , at-Tabrani, in his al-Mu'jam al-Kabir (Vol.20 Pg.211) and by the Muhaddith al-Ruyaani, in his Musnad (Vol.2 Pg.323).This narration has been classified as Sahih (authentic) by Allamah ibn Hajr al-Haitami in his az-Zawajir while both Hafiz Munzhiri in his at-Targheeb wat Tarheeb (Vol.3 Pg.26) and Hafiz Nuruddeen Haithami in Majma'uz Zawaid (Vo.4 Pg.326) have classified all its narrators as reliable narrators of Sahih Muslim.
One can always avoid shaking hands with a non-mehram through ways of hikmah (wisdom). Even in case of non Muslims some people only shake their head by keeping enough distance. Also there is nothing wrong in telling them politely that in our culture/ belief people of opposite gender don't shake hands out of respect for each other.
...my husbands relatives always do handshake n hug their female relatives.when i went to pak they tried to handshake with me.
oh sorry sorry - you said YOU HUSBANDS RELATIVES!!!!
yikes - I would RUN
LOL
OK CB wat if a person muslim or non-muslim(mostly goras in this case) brings his hand forward for a handshake with u wats the best way to avoid that without being rude? i had two incidents....my husbands relatives always do handshake n hug their female relatives.when i went to pak they tried to handshake with me.i said"i don't like to"they got offended n said"we r like brothers"i said but still its not same n i feel uncomfortable" they don't do it with me now but they do find me rude.i thought as a muslim they should hav some sense n my husband would hav objected to this himself Next my sons gora teacher met us n after meeting did the customary handshake with me n my husband both.i didn't refuse.this time he a non-muslim said "i thought muslim ladies r not allowed to shake hand with men"n i was really embarassed.
Mabrook, I like your nick :-)
Mate, I have been thinking hard about this but will be honest , I dont know any other way but to politely say I do not shake hands for religious reasons.
I guess its like any other thing really , I had a similar thing , with the head scarf , I dont wear one and once went to this event our company had organized and a gora client mentioned that mostly muslim women wear head scarfs and I got soooooooo embarassed ...
I do realize that we are not perfect muslims at the end of the day, aspiring to be , yes, but not perfect yet. my friend told me not to feel bad and continue trying to be a good and a better muslim.. coz a girl at work started bullying me once saying , you talk about character and moral and you dont cover your head etc ... I felt so down , thinking either i should be a perfect muslim or should totally give up on character and morals and be like them westerners ...
then , my mother said when you are trying dont feel alarmed when people say such things , just tell them you will obtain that goal too one day inshallah.
With no offense to anyone, at times specially among desis (including some of my own relatives), I feel that while bargaining with a shopkeeper some of them don't realize that they are not talking to a close relative or mehram. The politely using (insisting) of the terms like "please" and "But you had promised that my clothes would be ready on this date" in a soft voice and having a long conversation with a person whom they would totally ignore in daily life (as part of their belief to not chat and smile frankly with a non-mehram) gives an impression of hypocrite to non-Muslims.
why are religious people always obsessed with curtailing womens freedom? no bargaining or smiling while shopping indeed..
Re: Bargaining or begging...
Some input from my wife related to this topic: (In her own words):
As she was brought up in Islamabad, she knows a lot of religious girls there who usually don't like to interact much with a non-mehram but on their wedding, they allow a male to do their whole makeup, due to which they unintentionally violate their own belief system.
Re: Bargaining or begging...
May Allah (swt) forgive me if anyone thought I was against bargaining or smiling. My intentions were only to point out that confused people like me should realize that they are at times unintentionally following double standards.
If in their "own belief system" it is alright to smile at a shopkeeper of opposite gender while bargaining, then why is it not alright to smile to the gate keeper, personal driver, servant, personal gardener...etc.
I am sure they don't smile only to make bargaining more effective (though some shopkeepers do get impressed and appreciate a beautiful smile), but they only do it as a goodwill gesture, but then what is the fault of other non-mehrams who serve them and whose day might also brighten by a good will gesture (smile)
It is a matter of maintaining one's principles (beliefs) in all occasions and in all situations, because people like me twist their beliefs when it seems beneficial to do so.
CB - you are quality!
Re: Bargaining or begging...
SO we dont have Boutiques and beauty parlors owned by ladies in Pakistan, anymore? .. all the ladies should go there so Male ladies tailors go out of business or they start tailoring for guys
Re: Bargaining or begging...
Submission:
If other girls are soooooooooooooooooo religious, then it's right. Why did they let a man do their make-up? They had choices - didn't they?
You see - There are two types of people. Modern and then the religious ones.
A modern person will NEVER let religion take over.
A religious person will NEVER let the common sense Rule.
So why did a religious person like those other girls let go of their Iman - their religious beliefs - on their big day?
We have to find that distinction between modern and religious people. Modern person will not become ALL religious on her big day. So why did a religious person become MODERN that day?
(by the way - it sounds that I am angry... but I am not. I am just questioning you with respect).
Re: Bargaining or begging...
Correction: My wife didn't allow any non-mehram touch her in her whole life. Alhamdulillah.
She was giving example of girls she know who are religious but unintentionally made this mistake without realizing that those men who do make up are also humans with feelings. Of course they did not intentionally allow a man to do it but might be out of excitement didn't realize that they were violating their own beliefs.
I hope it is clear now.
Re: Bargaining or begging…
NJmasti that was totally uncalled for .. please read the posts clearly before jumping the guns
Re: Bargaining or begging...
^sorry - about the wife part... I will correct and put other girls :)
Re: Bargaining or begging...
well a struggling muslim is as noble as a perfect one.coz the more u struggle the more points u get from Allah for ur efforts.and CB really i'm impressed by ur mom.She gives such nice advice
Lol u don’t hav to run from me.come back girlie 
About working women and their interaction with clients etc ...
My mother is a doctor and worked alongside men all her life , when I started my career , she told me one thing clearly , which i remember till date ..
she said , its very easy for a woman to sound enticing and look beautiful and your client and your employer will both have lots to win , but you will lose your respect ... therefore learn to remain stern and extremely business like when at work and in front of clients , remain polite but do not look or speak invitingly... you must learn the difference between the two.
I would humbly like to seek permission to share it on another site, but not as my own words but as an appropriate example for my similar discussion there, while keeping your nick anonymous, if you think it is appropriate to do so. In my opinion your mother would inshaAllah get the blessings of Allah for becoming a source of guidance for all the people who would read this example on that site
I would humbly like to seek permission to share it on another site, but not as my own words but as an appropriate example for my similar discussion there, while keeping your nick anonymous, if you think it is appropriate to do so. In my opinion your mother would inshaAllah get the blessings of Allah for becoming a source of guidance for all the people who would read this example on that site
STP , please surely go ahead . Sharing good words is sadqa jariah.
Re: Bargaining or begging...
JazakAllah khair sister. May Allah (swt) bless you and your family with all the blessings of this life and hereafter.
Re: Bargaining or begging...
How does bargaining equate to 'begging'? I take it it is just part of business, that is if you allow women to step out of their homes.
Sidra its like"bhai plz thora tu kum kerain na.aap tu bilkul bhi koi discount nahi day rehay"
shopkeeper"main ne pehlay he buhat kum ker dia hai.aur margin he nahi hai.main khud ka nuqsaan ker k aap ko discount de reha hoon"
Lady"Nahi nahi aiasa kaisay chalay ga.ye tu buhat ziada maang rehay hain app.plz thora tu kum kerain.."
well it looks less like professional dealing n more like begging Lol then it turns to threatning n black mailing “falani dukaan pe itnay ka hai”..“theek hai jao hum nahin laitay tum se"then to batameezi"ajeeb fazool aadmi hai.pagal samjha hai hum ko”…
n in some cases it gets reversed now shopkeeper begging u “chalain aap batain kitnay ka laina hai.jo aap munasib sumjhain day dain”
how i miss shopping in Pak