Welll look, you people need to make up your mind. Here we have Hareem requesting we peacefully deal with them, and you agree with her, and yet you criticize the government for not taking action?
Do you or do you not think that this nonsense in NWFP in Swat needs to be dealt with militarily by the government?
Make up your mind.
maybe the action people want teh govt t take in this 'peaceful' action is to acquiesce to the militants and enforce militants tjeir version of shariah..and u know what..if these ppl were elders of these areas and thats what they wanted, as long as it was nto goign counter to Pakistani laws, that would be fine, but remember this all started with ppl engaging in cross border attacks and harboring terrorists, tribal elders were kileld by these ppl not the military, the militants killed em to take over.
if they stop sheltering goriegn terrorists, and allowing them to, or joining them in their corss border attacks, then there is no real reason for anyone to try and drag them out of their stone age.
Swat is not in FATA. It was in full government control. Waziristan is a differetn story.
I have been saying this for some time. Having these FATA territories is a terrible idea - first thing is first is to abolish any old deal with them and bring them under general Pakistani law like the rest of Pakistan. The fact that they got away with it in Waziristan has ALLOWED them to take SWAT. You fight a cancer, and you leave a lesion behind, its going to fester and grow, and your patient will have cancer again, despite your treatment, right?
They left this hole uncovered in the FATA areas and its biting them. This is historical trouble-making on BB and NS's part - they helped create these guys to send them in Kashmir, and look what its done.
link:
** As the US-inspired and Saudi-funded jihad raged during the early 1980s, the holy warriors were feted in the corridors of western capitals. But most soothsayers and sages — foremost amongst them Khan Abdul Ghaffar Khan on his way from the raging fires of Kabul to Peshawar — had declared: “This is not a jihad but a fisad and it will soon envelop the entire subcontinent and then the world.”
The tables have been turned on their fortunes. The military establishment has again trained its guns on their pristine valleys. Having shamelessly abetted, funded, trained, armed and provoked the most violent, ruthless ideological forces to sponsor their so-called ‘strategic depth’ nonsense, they have conveniently mended fences with their arch enemy (India) on the eastern front. There is an endless stream of Indian delegates and dignitaries partying in major Pakistani cities while the NWFP and Peshawar have been rewarded with being turned into the war frontline once again. This time they have been gifted a new surname: Al Qaeda.**
What if mush starts attacking punjab and sindh like this, will they use the same excuse then?
If punjab has a relevant part to play on War on Terror (which I dont believe it really does), then yes. But Sindh could have been a major target, but bombing Karachi with F-16 might be the wrong way of dealing with MQM.
maybe the action people want teh govt t take in this 'peaceful' action is to acquiesce to the militants and enforce militants tjeir version of shariah..and u know what..if these ppl were elders of these areas and thats what they wanted, as long as it was nto goign counter to Pakistani laws, that would be fine, but remember this all started with ppl engaging in cross border attacks and harboring terrorists, tribal elders were kileld by these ppl not the military, the militants killed em to take over.
if they stop sheltering goriegn terrorists, and allowing them to, or joining them in their corss border attacks, then there is no real reason for anyone to try and drag them out of their stone age.
You cannot control what's going on outside of your borders. Only what's going on inside. They had the entire border being watched by the military, so how did the insurgents get inside the NWFP border and start overthrowing the daada-abbas of stone age rule (village tribal leaders)?
This is not a simple, "ok, i'm taking over your village crap" - this happened gradually over time and there were lots of variables.
You cannot control what's going on outside of your borders. Only what's going on inside. They had the entire border being watched by the military, so how did the insurgents get inside the NWFP border and start overthrowing the daada-abbas of stone age rule (village tribal leaders)?
This is not a simple, "ok, i'm taking over your village crap" - this happened gradually over time and there were lots of variables.
sure... but does it change what needs to be done now?
and as far as peaceful resolution, pick up papers from 2001 onwards how many times were these people ask to stop dickin around? requested, resolutions drawn up at the expense of pakistan bashing in international press. but did it work..
so hindsight is 20/20 these ppl should just have been crushed then..instead of playign nice with them
knowing what happened is good, but there is a certain situation that exists now. based on prior events, peaceful settlement is not going to happen.
they just need to be crushed. period. and u know what...bleeding hearst can cry all they want, but either Pakistan is going to have to do it, or US will.
**You cannot control what's going on outside of your borders. Only what's going on inside. **They had the entire border being watched by the military, so how did the insurgents get inside the NWFP border and start overthrowing the daada-abbas of stone age rule (village tribal leaders)?
This is not a simple, "ok, i'm taking over your village crap" - this happened gradually over time and there were lots of variables.
I don't agree on this fully. We have a very good example of handling extremists outside of borders: TURKEY.
I believe we have enough Force, Know-How and Logistics to actually copy the way TURKEY is dealing with PKK and Kurds.
Yes we should. Mohammad pbuh punished the enemies of state / traiters by killing "all" of their men, and taking "all" of their women, children, and land.
Terror sympathizers don't want to see what Mohammad pbuh did to the traitors and enemies. They just want to put a bhonpoo of "peace".
Peace my foot! Suiciders and killers of our law-enforcement officers do not deserve any sympathy.
Don't hide the truth nor mix truth with falsehood antiwhatever.
......Let me remind you the true history.
My Prophet Muhammad(may peace and blessings be upon him) even forgave the person who brutally murdered his uncle, .....
Yes Mohammad pbuh did forgive few for "personal" attacks. However he never forgave anyone who violated the sanctity of the "State". Our history is filled with stories where traitor tribes were butchered and their women and kids were taken as slaves.
I hope you can understand the difference.
And to hell with American policies, don't ever try to compare Prophet of Islam with American Government.
No comparison between Arabs and Americans Mohtarma.
These are just two examples for Pakistanis, from "different" eras, nations etc. to show you how successful leadership deals with the traitors.
There is an incident where the Prophet executed a group of Jews who had agreed to help fight, and then bailed during the fighting. That constituted treason, and therefore, he executed them. Or do you conveniently forget these sorts of things, because you think its ok to kick Jewish behind, but forgive even the worst Muslim traitor?
Treason is punishable by state, Islamically. Therefore, a muslim government of Pakistan has the right to kill these people. Period.
There is an incident where the Prophet executed a group of Jews who had agreed to help fight, and then bailed during the fighting. That constituted treason, and therefore, he executed them. Or do you conveniently forget these sorts of things, because you think its ok to kick Jewish behind, but forgive even the worst Muslim traitor?
Treason is punishable by state, Islamically. Therefore, a muslim government of Pakistan has the right to kill these people. Period.
Wot does Islam states when the state is involved in treason.? and wot does the rule say when one man or in other word THE STATE is involved in treason in every act.? Islam doesn't leave anybody out... thats wot i said in another post in another thread of yours.. (i don't why the moderator moved it under another topic).
The justice from top to bottom... everybody accountable from top to bottom. and every decission present infront of the People... people should know on wot terms President granted permission to americans ?
Wots the difference between you and other Mullahs.. they bring one definition of Islam which suits them and you bring one definition of Islam which suits you...
Just a little incident... hazrat umer's son was found guilty in one of the wrong doing and Hazrat Umer ordered i think 80 or 100 kora for him... but his son died before taking the entire punishment. (after 30 or 40) so after burying him, hazrat umer himself administered the remaining punishment... so that people will never say that the son of caliph didnot recieve the entire punishment...
The Pakistan Army over the years has worked together with these Talibans, trained them, funded & armed them and used them against Afganistan & India. In Kargil they were used, in Kashmir they are still being used - so how can you suddenly expect the PA will crush them.
This will not happen, since the PA too is radicalised and symphthises with the Religious fringe. No wonder the PA would not fight them and instead surrendered in their hundreds.
Musharraf knows this and dare not use the Army - and be internationally exposed to the nexus between the two.
The Pakistan Army over the years has worked together with these Talibans, trained them, funded & armed them and used them against Afganistan & India. In Kargil they were used, in Kashmir they are still being used - so how can you suddenly expect the PA will crush them.
This will not happen, since the PA too is radicalised and symphthises with the Religious fringe. No wonder the PA would not fight them and instead surrendered in their hundreds.
Musharraf knows this and dare not use the Army - and be internationally exposed to the nexus between the two.
expose the nexus b/w the two, is it a secret? I mean it all really started with the trinity of US providing funds and arms, saudis providing indoctrination and funds, and pakistan providing expendable free mercenaries to fight the soviets. Thats when it all began really...since when did it become a secret.
There is an incident where the Prophet executed a group of Jews who had agreed to help fight, and then bailed during the fighting. That constituted treason, and therefore, he executed them. Or do you conveniently forget these sorts of things, because you think its ok to kick Jewish behind, but forgive even the worst Muslim traitor?
Treason is punishable by state, Islamically. Therefore, a muslim government of Pakistan has the right to kill these people. Period.
Sweet heart either you didn't get my point or you are playing naive.
"u said in islam harsh treatment was done according to history "
Those people are more strick muslims then me and you.
SO
guess who is gonna chop more heads off????
remember recent beheadings ???? ?