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and the point to be noted here is that "he does not Drink"
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So a person who is disobeying Haqooq-ul-allah are bad or the people who are abusing Haqooq-ul-abad?
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You both are hurting others in your own way…
You are hurting by being a person who will have children who themselves will drink, although they will have Muslim names, they will not be Muslims and as such, will not care who they hurt and will be part of a culture that lives only for its own pleasure…
I can’t say for the others (clergy) because whatever I am hearing, I am hearing from you, and even if it was true, then they will be punished for cheating and lying…
However, the clergy will not be held responsible for rebellion against God…
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The point to be noted here is " Allah (SWT) says , I might forgive you the crimes you commit against me , but not the crimes you commit against humanity"
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Where did you read this? And there is no question of ‘might’ in wilful rebellion…
It’s like you keep slapping someone in the face and asking for forgiveness…
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Although I was in for a serious response, but this just cracks me up.
Lajjo dear, kya ho gaya 
Khuda tera wasta dalay in kay saaath
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OK Lajjo Read this VERY carefully,
The crimes I commit against HIM is Between ME and HIM? but the crimes I commit against humanity I have to ask the forgiveness of every person I hurt?
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ok think about the response...
lllallalalallalalalallalal
shab bakhair.
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The crimes you commit against Him out of ignorance, ill knowledge, bad upbringing, wrongful exposure, they can be forgiven and if the desire to desist is there, they will be forgiven…
However crimes against Him done out of desire, self-imposed justifications, deliberately and knowingly will not be forgiven…They are pure and simple rebellion…
But, I am sure you must think yourself clever enough to know that you can probably give Allah :swt: a good answer that He might forgive you everytime you drink…
So what is it? Depression? Sadness, loss of someone dear, unrequited love, loneliness e.t.c.?
So, what’s your excuse for drinking? Just pleasure?
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garam garam pakoreh...
garam garam samoseh...
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**
i get more n more surprised by the sort of replies our muslim mass write…
reading the religion section or the general section makes me feel SORRY for oursleves…& makes me think k “wht has the world come to?”
i din know we could actually argue on things which r obviously wrong to be correct…
i mean theek hai…if a person is doing wrong so fine he/she gets gunaah of it…magar doing wrong n then even justifying it n saying it out in public:hayaa:
pata naheen wht will happen to my tiny winy brain if i start going to WA n such sort of sections…where i suppose ppl argue more n more n more…
kumseykum when u do wrong just admit it…:halo:
khair…as for the question asked in the initial post…alhumdulillah i’ve never seen anyone drunk…the most i’ve seen is ppl drinking cigaars on streets(though i don understand wht they like in it…it even smells disgusting n gives me a slight cough if i pass by someone drinking cigarettes)
MODERATION or no moderation…ALCOHOL is alcohol…kumseykum if ppl don want to stop drinking for staying within religious boundaries…they should think abt health…even scientifically its proved k it’s harmful…n jo thora sa(not even1%) alcohol main faida hai…woh dawaai main isstemaal hoo jaata hai…
khair …this may not be a very witty sort of a reply…i’m neither good @ debating or arguing or replying to such questions…but well..i just could not resist…so i wrote wht i thought…
**
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garam garam pakoreh...
garam garam samoseh...
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They're both doing wrong.
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Yep it’s bad world out there. And as I said in my earlier post that if your religion prohibits it and you follow your religion with all your heart and soul; Don’t drink.
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Maybe from your POV I am doing wrong. But thats your believe/POV. You are entitled to it as much as I am.
Smoking kills period.
Wrong. 2 units per day which is 120 ml of alcohol in the blood stream actually helps. Don’t believe me just google it.
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Sara, It does not have to be witty all the times, Its always good to say what’s on your mind. 
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Doesn't mean anything.
As all drinkers are not bad people.
Likewise all non drinkers are not pious people.
You have good and bad people on both side of the line.
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I assume you are addressing me hence my comments.
First of all it's your assumption, as religious poeple do not have religious children everytime all the time. So my children may or may not drink.
Second, Once the children are adults they are allowed to do what they think is right. What you or me thinks about it, is all besides the point.
That will not happen if you teach them correctly about the sanctity of human values.
I am sure you want to say something else which I am not understanding. Please revise the sentence.
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never said I do them individually either. I just said that I dont do them together. It does not mean that I do them separately as well. You came to conclusions that you wanted to get to.
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sara, is your post spsonsored by ICI paints? all such pretty colours. reminds me of a childrens book.
btw people do not ‘drink’ cigars.
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Sab bhayon se iltamas hai, Jab Azan ho rahi ho tu sharab na piya karain 
be adbi hoti hai
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Yes thats right :)
But we can also help guide them to the correct path Insha'ALLAH. By doing this we will be setting a good example to other fathers also and doing an obligation. It is unlikely that they will go astray if they have a good up bringing although it is a possibility they may get in the wrong crowd out of peer pressure laikin most of the times they will be safe Insha'ALLAH...
And by doing so you must also insure they stay away from things like alcohol that can change them and/or harm them including people around them!
I dont know exactly but i think he was referring towards the fact that, imams may not be held account for certain peoples deliberate denial of the truth, after they have done thier best to convince someone who does not wish to agree...