A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

[AQ]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

Thanks danny :)

I hope you won't mind me asking you any question regarding this which later comes in my mind ... :)

[danial]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

no problem dude, just post em here.

[USResident]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@danial shah

i learned,i grew up in a religious family. my mother still wears hijab and prays. organized religion is (to me) more a culture then religion. there are many sects, (this board is perfect example) many view points, i rather do good and try to be humble and respectable to others (in this life) **then condemn them to hell after they die, or promise them an amazing life after. **we are an organism, we evolved not created. there are signs of it all over the place, right in front of you. this is my opinion i'm not saying it to upset anyone, i respect everyone's belief and opinion,

I am basing my reply on the sentences I bolded. Where did you get the impression that doing good, being humble and respectable to others is proper. Who is responsible for propagating that norm?

I take it you have read Darwin and you take it pretty seriously. I have read Darwin as well i.e. Origin of Species and Natural selection and Descent of Man. There are many things which Darwin observed and tried to theorize the facts about them that I agree with i.e. Natural selection is a process that happens and varieities are created as a result of it. However when it comes to species morphing into another, even he concluded it is a theory which has no facts and he has hidden all the details or masked by giving the argument that it is possible with the lengthy passage of time. Some aspects of it I agree like Natural selection to some extent can be seen can be seen through Islam as well, we were all created from the union of Adam and Eve. And now look at all the races and varieties of humans we have. This is definitely evidence that Natural selection produces varieties among a species but not species from another species and single cell organisms into complex organisms.

[USResident]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Seminole

I was born in a secular Christian family and "became" agnostic at about 11 years old when I was told the analogies of the Bible - Noah's arc, Samson, creationism, etc - were literal accounts. I felt there was no way to force myself to believe in them. I later read the Old Testamament and found Leviticus and other such horror stories very un-Godlike which futher cemented my belief that I was not Christian. I met too many good people who were supposedly going to hell.

I have since come to the realization that it is possible to interpret the Bible - and most religious texts - into my belief system w/o believing that every animal in the world was gathered and put on one boat or that the vast universe was created like a magic trick in 7 days. Or that one belief system trumps all others and that everyone else is going to hell.

What is it that is not possible about the analogies that have stated?
Why do we die? What is the purpose of death? Let us forget the purpose of life for a while because we all tend to explain it from our own living perspective however we all die and its all the same after that. So why do you think we have to die?

[Seminole]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

I realized the impossibilty of gathering 2 of every animal and then having them repopulate the earth at 11 years old. That was probably the one issue that got me into questioning the fundamentalist view of religion, the rest followed. I believe in miracles, but not the magic acts of ancient scripture.

Many reasons that we must die, the one that trumps all is that everthing must die. That is a rule of nature. Our souls aside, we are very developed mammals. Humans aren't some kind of freaks of nature.

[Mostar95]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

All the book people belong to the middle east only - the area from Egypt to Turkey and then down to Yemen! We never heard of any prophet being sent to Aztecs of Mexico, Aborigines of Australia, New Zealand indeginous people, American Indians etc. Even we do not find any prophet sent to Japanese, Koreans, Chinese, Africans etc! So all the book religions tell the same storeis!

[The_Old_Man]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@picoico

Seminole,

…doesn’t that make you a theist of some sort? Or is the God question still open for you?

It makes Seminole an “Agnostic Christian”. There are many, even preachers that hold this position. Many Christians have been discouraged by actions, interpretation of Bible, science, etc. to adopt a much wider view to their faith.

Also see link

[SyedAbduallah]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

I will prepare my questions for atheists and agnostics this weekend. Be ready.

[The_Old_Man]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Seminole

I realized the impossibilty of gathering 2 of every animal and then having them repopulate the earth at 11 years old.

(Tongue in cheek) You obviously then didn’t knew about the few rabbits that escaped and became Australia’s big problem or the African bees used for experimental purposes in South America that escaped and is taking over the USA.

(Serious note)

I believe in miracles, but not the magic acts of ancient scripture.

What would be your definition of a miracle?

[Light_Bearer]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

Agnostic from muslim background.
Turned away when I was 18 years old. My family knows about my stand.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@picoico

Atheism predicates itself on the negation of a belief (rather, all beliefs); but it itself is a belief...I can't accept that internal inconsistency.

The broader, and more common, understanding of atheism among atheists is quite simply "not believing in any gods." No claims or denials are made — an atheist is just a person who does not happen to be a theist. Most good, complete dictionaries readily support this.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

USR you posted the questions for Danny, but I just wanted to share my views on the same issues. I hope you or Danny don't mind.

@USResident

I am basing my reply on the sentences I bolded. Where did you get the impression that doing good, being humble and respectable to others is proper. Who is responsible for propagating that norm?

Human instinct same as we learned to kill each others. If you believe that all the goodness was started by the religions and humans are not able to propagate the goodness by themselves then you have to agree that all the evil in the mankind also came through religion. If people cannot generate goodness why give them credit to generate badness.

@USResident

Some aspects of it I agree like Natural selection to some extent can be seen can be seen through Islam as well, we were all created from the union of Adam and Eve. And now look at all the races and varieties of humans we have. This is definitely evidence that Natural selection produces varieties among a species but not species from another species and single cell organisms into complex organisms.

If theists believe in Adam and Eve saga! then believing in single cell organism into complex organism is a much lesser leap of faith.:)

[Mostar95]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

Islam claims to give a perfect system for each and every aspect of our lives! Yet its calender is based on primitive method - the lunar movement ; thereby making it redundant for our day to day lives especially growing corps!

This led to me that all religions including Islam are man-made.

[Seminole]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

^ I would have trouble with that too.

Old Man, I believe God works in wonderful and mysterious ways. Maybe what I call miracles are actually 'blessings'. They happen every day - the sick are healed, the lost are found. I believe everything wonderful about man and earth are somewhat of miracles.

I don't think the more demonstrative miracles of monotheistic texts are literal. If God felt it important enough to reveal himself in that way, I feel sure something would have been revealed in a more doucmented way to a more educated group of folks.

[danial]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Mostar95

All the book people belong to the middle east only - the area from Egypt to Turkey and then down to Yemen! We never heard of any prophet being sent to Aztecs of Mexico, Aborigines of Australia, New Zealand indeginous people, American Indians etc. Even we do not find any prophet sent to Japanese, Koreans, Chinese, Africans etc! So all the book religions tell the same storeis!

true, and thats where the main drama and wars are usually. so it might be time to let the people without the book go at it and change it for the better.

[USResident]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Seminole

I realized the impossibilty of gathering 2 of every animal and then having them repopulate the earth at 11 years old. That was probably the one issue that got me into questioning the fundamentalist view of religion, the rest followed. I believe in miracles, but not the magic acts of ancient scripture.

Many reasons that we must die, the one that trumps all is that everthing must die. That is a rule of nature. Our souls aside, we are very developed mammals. Humans aren't some kind of freaks of nature.

Actually, your argument can be contained if we try to understand whether the Noahs Arc incident wiped out the entire world or just his native surrounding. The views about this incident which state it was only his village seem highly probable. Even I agree that 2 of every species could not have been gathered by him unless he ventured the whole world. If you are objecting to the view that the whole world was wiped out and 2 from every known species was gathered then I would agree with you.

How do single cell organisms die?

[USResident]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Mostar95

All the book people belong to the middle east only - the area from Egypt to Turkey and then down to Yemen! We never heard of any prophet being sent to Aztecs of Mexico, Aborigines of Australia, New Zealand indeginous people, American Indians etc. Even we do not find any prophet sent to Japanese, Koreans, Chinese, Africans etc! So all the book religions tell the same storeis!

Somewhat true if based on recorded history however the concept of God existed among people from all regions of the world. How would that have happened?

[USResident]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Light Bearer

USR you posted the questions for Danny, but I just wanted to share my views on the same issues. I hope you or Danny don't mind.

Human instinct same as we learned to kill each others. If you believe that all the goodness was started by the religions and humans are not able to propagate the goodness by themselves then you have to agree that all the evil in the mankind also came through religion. If people cannot generate goodness why give them credit to generate badness.

If theists believe in Adam and Eve saga! then believing in single cell organism into complex organism is a much lesser leap of faith.:)

Hey LB! Nice to see you.

Actually, I do not hold the view that good and bad was started by religion. Religion is the message Allah SWT has sent mankind from time to time to teach them about his presence and what is required from them. The intent is to show how to harness these instincts to achieve salvation. Can you quantify instinct?

Actually no, you said it, it involves faith. Single cell to complex organism says there is no intervention of God and it just happened by nature. How can we quantify what nature is?

[SlaveofAllaah]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@Mostar95

Islam claims to give a perfect system for each and every aspect of our lives! Yet its calender is based on primitive method - the lunar movement ; thereby making it redundant for our day to day lives especially growing corps!

This led to me that all religions including Islam are man-made.

With due respect the thread opener, this thread is for the Agnostics and Atheists, the reason they moved away from there religion, and reason they have relinquished the religion.

Based on these points USR, is going to summarize, and come up with the next set of questions. Unfortunately the thread is already populated with some misleading comments.

** I would respect all the guppies to hold there breath and let the Agnostics and the Atheists put there point across, before anyone of them refutes each other**.

Here, I am quoting Mostar95 as he is one of them, and he has all the rights to key in few points in this thread and reason for abandoning his or her religion.

Well, just my 2c.

[ssingh]

Re: A question to Agnosts and Atheists?

@USResident

My question is what was your belief before you chose to become an Agnost or Atheist?

I would like all the atheists or agnosts who participate at Gupshup to state that here. Once I have enough participants I would like to analyze and question what compelled them to leave their former belief be it Islam, Chrisitianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism etc. So the question would then be WHY?

if you try to answer this question as to who created this world?...or where did it come from?....then you are about to enter into an infinite loop. Besides, buddhism is already a agnostic faith.