Wrong Interpretation

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Re: Wrong Interpretation

It was already done during the life of the Prophet, several times over.

Problem is, in our history the Pagans had broken all treaties with Muslims. Muslim-Christian relations were also soured by the murder of Muslim envoys by the Byzentian viceroy. Ditto with the Persians.

Early Muslim history is so littered with examples of Muslims acting in good faith and getting screwed over by non-Muslims that modern people reflecting back often wonder what’s the point?

The trick for us is not to fall into “they’re all the same” trap.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

This is simply false. Islam is in fact credited with transferring Greek and Hindu knowledge, with Arab contributions, to Europe. There, further progress was made as Muslims gave up on transmuting lead into gold (that is in fact what “Science” was back in those days)…

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

anjjan, you can expect only honest answers from me, be rest-assured.
I think you have a valid point that birth rate has been a factor. But i’d like to stress that it is not the sole reason..You can count birth rate in in less literate countries as a major factor, but in the west it is not… The US has 12,000 mosques, 80% of which have been built in the last 12 yrs. that comes to 9600 mosques in 12 yrs. A Muslim population bomb must have exploded if only your theory held true.. plus, what benefit would the western/ Christian press reap from spreading this so called rumour? to create fear or is it to advertise Islam?..beats me:konfused: .

Next point , can you name the irregularities that you feel are related to islam..I have stressed throughout that Muslims are to blame for their own problems, but please elaborate with evidence why Islam is to blame…

The next and most imp. question i need an answer from you is that you have stated that " Islam is more or less credited for the halt in the progress"…please enlighten me as to how you have come to this conclusion.

Lastly, the honest answer to your question re-if Christianity has contributed towards progression..It probably has.The reason for this i believe is that majority of the Muslims have reduced islam to rituals while forgetting or not even knowing the bigger picture. Islam encourages positive and progressive education in every form, but our mullahs prefer to ignore that part while Christians have flourished in that area.
Its your turn to be honest and answer my queries.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Can’t agree more :kiss: . I’d also wanna see how he answers your question about Islam… “Why Islam is to blame”

Is ki idhar bhi pita-ee ho rahi hai :bash: -------> :hehe: :hehe:

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

I nice comment. Iam really handicapped against ignorance, mostly when for you ignorance is a bless.

-----Lifey !!! REPORT HERE----
46

Re: Wrong Interpretation

Doc_2000…

  1. Have you ever checked up with migration record from Arab countries to the West, especially to USA in last fifty years?

  2. The Christian press making claims of Islamic expansion….yes, Church definitely wants to create a psycho fear among Christians.

  3. Mosques being built up in the West………..it’s a money power game. Arab money is definitely playing a dirty game which in fact will harm Muslims more than Christians at a later stage. USA constitution cannot halt you making the mosques, as Islamic States can relating to the creation of worship places of other religions.

  4. Christianity favors progress…..no one told you that the Church priests had always been against the scientific progress? Church priests have never played a role better than any Mullah.

That is another thing that Christianity could not become a burden, as it in your case and Christians progresses in a genuine way.

So blaming Mullahs for taking people against education and progress is not correct. If Islam is a religion of knowledge there must have been floods of scientists in Arab countries and in Central Asia after so many years of acceptance of Islam.

Frankly…how many centuries you need more to prove your scientific religion?

And why Islam to blame……..For a little advancement you make much noise crediting to Islam and why you do not credit to Islam for so many odds?

-----Lifey !!! REPORT HERE----
-----Lifey !!! REPORT HERE----
47

Re: Wrong Interpretation

anjjan, you are beating round the bush.

I have already got the mssge and your opinion of your beliefs around islam not being progressive and i have already stated that it is the Muslims to blame for this..But you have failed to respond or give evidence based answers to 2 of my questions.

I will ask u them again.

  1. What irregularities ( as u've mentioned) have u come across in your study of Islam ( & please don't give me your objective view of the current muslims as i've already agreed that Muslims have gone astray from Islam).

2.What part of Islam has caused a halt in scientific progression..again i would like authentic sources of information..not articles written in the Christian press!!!.

I need to know what your ideas and opinions are based on b4 we can further this constructive argument.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

And by the way..i have not checked up with the immigration records re influx of Arabs into US..But what i do know is that the largest migrants into US is from South America..whom i believe to be staunch/practicing Christians..So that shoud have more than diluted the effects of Muslim migrants..So that factor more or less stands nullified or negligible.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Dear Doc2000, We can definitely continue this constructive discussion…..only if you explain me why you are so much interested in blaming the product for bad quality and not the product maker?

If you try to find a sincere reply, I suppose that you may find answer to rest of your enquiries.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Because everything that i read about Islam from authentic material makes sense to me & when i see muslims not following that way of life and still calling themselves muslim makes me believe that the Problem is with representatives not the product maker( as u have called it!!).. How many times do u want me to repeat my self.

Now for the umpteenth time, are u going to answer my questions or not?..I have been continuously answering your queries and accusations of Islam but u have come up with no viable explanation to ur beliefs. Unfortunately i can't find the answers to ur beliefs, so u need to to tell me them so that i may be able to counter them..
If u have no argument, then practice what u preach and give me an honest answer and say that u have not studied islam and that u are basing your opinions on the current state of the Muslims,or b'cos of what u read in papers/hear on the news,or plainly on hearsay.

Please answer this query if u want to further this discussion. If u don't, then i will assume that these are just your plain" blind opinions" as i like to call them with no basis to them.

Awating your reply to the above question in anticipation. Please don't disappoint me again
thank You

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

What do you mean by authentic material? Do majority of Muslims have no approach to the authentic material? And off course what is the authentic material? Does it mean the original texts in Arabic of 7th and 8th century or many-many interpretations?

Ok, you want to know where I find problem in Islam. I do not find problem in Quran. Being a Muslim you can believe that Quran is a source of knowledge and being a non-Muslim (or unbeliever in your terms) I can outright reject it. It is not important.

I find problem in the setup of Islam…Majority of Muslim minors start their religious life at some Madrisa and spend some thousand brilliant years of their child-age in learning Quran.

What do you think…what a minor can pick up from Quran? What mind setup he finds for his future upbringing?

A fair study (not mere learning) can give you a correct answer.

Ps, Thanks for being very sincere in our discussion!

Who is the king of GupShup?
Who is the king of GupShup?
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Re: Wrong Interpretation

@ doc2000
Intersting efforts to read …
That would be an accomplishment if you would be able to get an answer from him :bukbuk:

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Oh deary deary me!!!..after all that discussion is that all u can muster?
Please please please don't tell me that u believe that a child going to a madrassa is the reason why Islam is the cause for the halt in scientific progression..I would love to answer/comment on your last mail but i find it too laughable..

Ok, so u have confirmed that u find no problems with the Quran ( i will extent u the benefit of doubt and assume that u have studied the Quran to make that statement). So which part of Islam is it then ( and please not the Muslims!!) and i will repeat again ..WHICH PART OF ISLAM, do u think is the cause for the halt in scientific progression.

By the way Lahorey 981, i know that he does'nt have an answer..i just want him to retract those words that he used without having a clue about what Islam is about.

Over to u again anjjanji.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Doc2000...and what is progressive and what is scintific in Islam & Quran?

Quran was compiled in accordance to fight against the dissimilarities existing among 7th century Arabs and today a newly born child in Kirgistan or eleswhere is filled with all useless thoughts of superiority complex.......result you have in many-many Islamic states. Islam could not help them to come out of dark ages, instead has become a reason for them to remain in dark ages.

Is not it very strange that Quran failed to change the psychology of an Arab, where it was invented?

Your problem is that you go to Islam with a selective mind for mere learning.
Try some time to approach Islam with an open mind to study.

I doubt, you can not.

Ps, Donot worry..there is nothing scintific or progressive in Hindu religion or Christianity either, the only difference is that these religions are not a burden for followers.

Time Pass
55

Re: Wrong Interpretation

anjjan, You are sounding more and more confused with each thread that u are posting..You start off by attempting to sound like an intellectual and degrade Islam by saying it is the cause of halt in progression of advancements ( for which u have continued to give me only opinions but no sound evidence). Then you say u have no problems with the Quran ( i assumed that u had studied the Quran for u to make that statement).
Now u are stating that the Quran has failed to change the psychology of Arabs, that it is the reason for being in the dark ages.While on the other hand you then try to enlighten Islam by saying we should approach it with an open mind ( which sounds to me as if u are saying that the problem is with Muslims and not Islam)..But then u say that other religions are not a burden which i assume u are trying to say that Islam is!!..( By the way, being a Muslim, i would never dear even saying that to another religion as my religion forbids ridiculing other religions)

What are the reasons for your contradictions of yourself?

Do i need to revert back to "YOUR" previous threat and ask "u" if u are trying to be funny or a hypocrite?..Or are u just plainly thought disordered..If u want to talk about psychology, i would be more than happy b'cos i'm from a psychological background and would entertain that with open arms.

I have come to the conclusion that u have no idea of Islam and just make an argument for argument sake.

Even if i asked a 10 year old many times to give me proof for what he/she was saying ,even he/she would atleast to make an attempt or even say that he/she didnt have any.
Your opinions are not only baseless but also has made u look and and sound as if ur not with it.

You were right Lahorey, i failed to get this person to come up with an intelligent argument or answers..only blind opinions which have not been studied.
There are a few more individuals with a similar mind set on this forum who will attempt to ridicule Islam just for fun/sake of it..and when u ask them for evidence, they have none ( Please see in the archive a previous thread i initiated under " preaching by reasoning", and u will notice a similar individual who attemted to confuse everyone with his/her so called knowledge of Islam and worldly affairs using so called pseudointellectual vocabulary, but ended up sounding like an idiot.

If anyone alse can reframe what i am attempting to get out of anjjan then please try as i might not be putting my question crystal enough.
( to put it lightly).

Time Pass
56

Re: Wrong Interpretation

Hey doc2000, you write very well. Full marks to you on this thread (I am a Hindu Indian - wish most Muslims were like you...)
(Oh No I am not saying who is right or wrong - I am only commenting on the way the arguments were presented by doc)

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Thank you PRNR...Your comments are very encouraging.

May i take the liberty to state that Islam condemns making arguments in an uncivilised manner and forbids one to degrade or ridicule others beliefs..Unfortunately this rule is seldom followed. Another example of Muslims being the ones to blame rather than Islam.

Thanks again.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

Dear Doc2000...there is an Ayat in Quran...we have given many hints but they will not understand (Please donot throw another question...which verse?).

I have given you many hints but you need an open mind to follow, your psychological background does not help you if you do not know how you enshape a minor' mind at madrisa....

You do not ridicule other religions....it is hippocrisy. Can a true Muslim recognise other religions? I doubt, if he can.

For rest I have no comments for you.

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

I agree with PRNR....I also vote for you as victor in this thread...least you remain happy!

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Re: Wrong Interpretation

My dear, My intention is not to be a victor in this thread but to make u understand that u have a totally wrong impression of Islam..I do not get a thrill out of it!!!!!
As a Muslim, it is my duty to defend my religion, just the way u are defending your beliefs/opinions.

What do u mean by " can a true muslim recognise other religions"...first of all, atleast u have now come to say a "true Muslim"!!!!.

A true Muslim will recognise it in the sense of being tolerent of others beliefs..those who don't are not following Islamic teachings.

You carry on to say rather sarcastically that " You do not ridicule other religions..it is hypocrisy"....again, a true Muslim will never ridicule others religions..The whole point of all my threads ...yawn!!!

Now, talking about hypocrisy..you state that there is an Ayat in the Quran..and then tell me not to throw another question...What are u afraid of?..If u are so sure of your research/knowledge?? u should be confident enough to be able to challenge all queries that relate to ur statements...obviously u are not!!..( By the way if u want, i can give u a hint of where this Ayat is and what it actually says, and what it actually means ).

You keep going on about minors in Madrassa's...U categorically stated in an earlier post that one should'nt blame the Mulla's ..While now u are attacking them as madrassas are run by them ( Hypocrisy or thought disorder???).

I don't like telling people about my background on such forums, but i took it upon myself to tell u when u stated in an earlier thread That it is strange that Islam failed to change the "psychology" of Arabs...It only shows how poor your history of the Arabs is...If u want to discuss further about The psychological effects of Islam, i'd be more than happy..btu your knowledge of Islam is too limited and narrow minded confined to Muslims rather than Islam..( I hope u know the difference)
I feel that u have been moving around with or have been acquainted with the wrong Muslims to have such extreme and negative views of Islam.. ( according to the statements you have been making)...But this is an ideal forum for u to convince yourself of your opinions as u will get all sorts of people, probably mostly resorting to unislamic ways of getting thier points across in responding to ur antagonising statements...So ur as bad as one another.

I am not a very intelligent person so u will have to give me more than hints asu have stated..i'm afraid i'm not good at hints/puzzles/clues!!...i only believe in facts/evidence..Unfortunately, thse ahve been non existent in all your threads.

A word of advice, Be prepared to be asked intrusive and factual based questions whnever u decide to make comments about other religions/beliefs.. So please don't write " Do not throw another question", as it puts your credibilty into doubt.