Re: With no offense to women
dawa, my friend. My goodness but you are prolific in your typing! And your ideas, I'd be curious to know just where you get them. About the western way of life I mean. I was born and raised here and am a few decades in age....I havent seen the types of people or situations you speak of with such conviction. So WHERE do you meet these people? Or you're just conjecturing on the western way of life? Beleive me, its not the way you picture it....
Re: With no offense to women
STP rocks, too bad we dont get more stuff. I love their song plush. wonder what scott weilend is up to these days...
but they are posting on GS... ayiii ayiii
big-ups to scott, robert, dean and eric..
stone temple pilots...what a band
ISN'T IT OFF TOPIC.
Re: With no offense to women
dawa, my friend. My goodness but you are prolific in your typing! And your ideas, I'd be curious to know just where you get them. About the western way of life I mean. I was born and raised here and am a few decades in age....I havent seen the types of people or situations you speak of with such conviction. So WHERE do you meet these people? Or you're just conjecturing on the western way of life? Beleive me, its not the way you picture it....
Mama - I was just wondering the same thing! I never knew that we westerners were such degenerates.
Heera - I'm surprised at some of your responses. You do claim to live in Canada, after all. Please leave the desi ghetto once in awhile to see how people actually live in the 'west'.
Re: With no offense to women
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Heera - I'm surprised at some of your responses. You do claim to live in Canada, after all. Please** leave the desi ghetto** once in awhile to see how people actually live in the 'west'.
why.........has she said something wrong or false about the western life.
or you're just having a go at her bcoz of her urdu.
Heera
nice posts. keep it up.:)
Re: With no offense to women
Let women decide what they want to do for themselves without interference from any other person, man or woman. Even if you don't agree with what they do it is their choice, not yours. You are not their keeper, they are not your pets.
Of course they are...What do you call playboy bunnies?
Re: With no offense to women
i agree ...provided the marriage "really" takes place between a man and woman in a church....and i think no need to tell that how much "such " marriages actuallty take place in west ...usa...and scandenevis...europe etc..
Re: With no offense to women
*that means, either he was a liar, or he was pressured. *
*i was by the way, ready in many things to adjust to his demands for a cooperative future spouse. * *may be that was not clear to him. * *and will become in due time. *
*then he can become an 'Israr' ahmed. * *and teach other men, not to betray women, who are proposed by them and stick by her side as a man of his words. *
dushwari
pyari bahna...i am afraid...if i will say something off the topic..again warnings....
but i will only say....that its too dificult to say anything about other...but i personally think family pressures worked...i give you an example...if your mother and father did not want to marry him but with thier own bhateega or bhanga.....could you take a stand .....against your parents...they would have listen to your choice but would it necessary that they also listened to it....if not ...what would be your next step then ?
Re: With no offense to women
^ sorry for poor grammar...i want to say...agar aap kai waldain aap kishadi apnai kisi rishtaidar sai karnai parbohat israr kartai .....aap unhai batati bhi apni choice kai barai mai..laikin wo na mantai...phir aap ka agla qadam kya hota ?
Re: With no offense to women
one, my parents are not that kind of parents.
two, i will never ever take back a proposal, made in conditions in which he made the proposal to me.
so, just because he is under pressure and induced doubts, it means that i am guilty and he is innocent.
what justice?
Re: With no offense to women
so you are saying what in West people usually stay with average 9 girls(some may 32 …some may be 4) etc…without setting to one wife…according to statistics of USA some department…its not “unnatural” for you people living in West becaust you used too it…so nothing “surprize” for you…
furthermore…are the OLD houses not been in West …have you ever been there …just listen to thier stories…and then tell us …what is the importance of family bondage …
the problem is that you have never heard of Jewish(not all but most) hitory ofpast 3000 years…why Allah says in our greatest book that “They are your worst enemies”…why says that they will keep on wandering till qiyyammah due to azzab…do you not wonder why Allah is so much be furious with them…so i request you to have some reading of it…then you will fully recognizethat what i am saying is true or false…
not so far…jut in 2003…what happened…when Bush attacked Iraq…ehy ??? WMD;s …now tell me where the hell those WMD’s…655,000 people have been died yet…if you want to see HELL on earth…you can see IRAQ…never heard of such bloodshead before in human history where shia doctors of mahdi malysia are givingmore anaythesia dose and poison injections to sunni patienrts…can you believe it…and sunni al-qaedais blowing the innocent people…just because USA searched for WMD…who poisoned the the people of USA withthe threat of WMD…CNN…FOX,Wall street jounal…Times…Washimgton Post…who urged Bush to attach Iraq…in his cabinet…national security advisors…Dick Cheeney…from which lobby they all belong to…whoare neo-cons…who is arrnging stage for Armegadon…jerry faul etc etc…
i hve given just single example…but the problem is that while living in multi-cultural environment …you think…jews …and christians are more than your “real brothers and sisters”…no doubt some of them are really very good and peaceful specially christians…but what is inside thier hearts…you cannot imagine..and what plans they make against muslims…its defence …social…and political forts…you cannot even think off…
.as in quran…that whatever inside thier hearts..is more malicious…and this is about jews and kuffars…
Re: With no offense to women
it is about each and every human being and his and her personal dignity. east or west and ways of east and west has NOTHING to do with it.
u do see immorality in muslims too.
and there is nothing done about it by 'good and honest' muslim men.
thus, the exploitation of women is actually subverted on women as if they are the reason why they are exploited. be it in marital or in out side of marital contract.
shame on such women and men. happening in a "muslim" and "islamic" society is even more of a shameful evidence.
remember that a man is also contracted in the same marriage, in which a woman is.
so if more than one woman marries a given man, he is actually there for them as well - physically and of course monetarily.
what kind of a woman or a man, are we talking about, who would want a rectangular or a triangular or a pentagonal social and sexual marital commitment.
personally, any one with their right mind working, will find it ethically and morally wrong above and beyond the religion.
but then again, each person will get 'rewarded' for his or her deeds accordingly. and that is by the way in the holy scripture that no man and no woman can deny, if even religion is being dragged into this very human and reason- warranting question.
Re: With no offense to women
one, my parents are not that kind of parents. two, i will never ever take back a proposal, made in conditions in which he made the proposal to me. so, just because he is under pressure and induced doubts, it means that i am guilty and he is innocent. what justice?
i agree bahna...your parents are very good...but do all parents are also as good ????? as yours ??????
i fully agree with you...to the extent he had gone for your proposal...he should not left you like that....but if her mother blackmail of eating poison...father black mail him of "aaq" means leaving all his property share.....mother stop talking with him....
bahna... i am not jocking....if parents "impose" aything on tjier children...then they can go to any extent ... we see it in daily life ....
but it is very injustice to you... i fully admit....
but what will a boy will have to do in above black mailing situations...in your opinion...???
Re: With no offense to women
may be bahna...due to family pressure...he ha has to marry the girl of her mother's choice...but since he knew that how he has gone so farwith you in proposal...so just not to break your heart completely...wanted to have some social and frienship behaviour so that you will not consider him "complete" betrayer but consider his "helplessness" in marriage issues...
Re: With no offense to women
Heera - I'm surprised at some of your responses. You do claim to live in Canada, after all. Please leave the desi ghetto once in awhile to see how people actually live in the 'west'.
we fully know that...no need of telling you....kan-e-enamak mai ja kar sab namak ho gatai hai....aur phir unhai siraf namak hee namk nazar aatai hai
Re: With no offense to women
Submission To Peace- Very nice post!
I am a women but i do feel the whole thingy abt same for men and same for women gets out of hands. Yes both r equally and shud be treated so but these 2 can't and should not be compared cuz they r made differently hence different set of rules/expectations wl follow for them. For example i alwayz see the women complaining that oh if these men can do this n that y cant we do that.....agreed at many cases they r rite but its stupid 2 think both can do everything same. For example girls complain that if the guys can stay out till really late at nite y can we? why can't those girls understand that its just that the men r physically stronger n can take better care of themselves alone. Howcome these same girls wl hide behind their beds if they hear a knock at their door at nite and wl expect the guys to chck out if everythings ok...y is that the case then? if u want to do everything same than y not do this yrself 2.
Re: With no offense to women
some women and men have utterly no ability to discern the God made differences in biology and psychology between women and men.
evolutionarily, human female has to select the best male for her self and her off spring .
if she is suspicious of any hidden motives, she can actually be quiet forsaking of the best of the best.
as adults, it is not about physical strength so much as it is about psychological and stamina to gauge the honesty in the interaction.
when that is lost - it is never ever possible to find inner peace for either side, who was playing shots of second bests and double dips.
sticking to this difference and abiding by its limits is what will make a relationship successful.
otherwise, one is better off without any relationship at all.
Re: With no offense to women
Submission To Peace- Very nice post!
I am a women but i do feel the whole thingy abt same for men and same for women gets out of hands. Yes both r equally and shud be treated so but these 2 can't and should not be compared cuz they r made differently hence different set of rules/expectations wl follow for them. For example i alwayz see the women complaining that oh if these men can do this n that y cant we do that.....agreed at many cases they r rite but its stupid 2 think both can do everything same. For example girls complain that if the guys can stay out till really late at nite y can we? why can't those girls understand that its just that the men r physically stronger n can take better care of themselves alone. Howcome these same girls wl hide behind their beds if they hear a knock at their door at nite and wl expect the guys to chck out if everythings ok...y is that the case then? if u want to do everything same than y not do this yrself 2.
very nice post and explanation....
Re: With no offense to women
Dawa, this is becoming a bit silly now. Your comments on western men "staying with" myriad number of women prior to marriage seems to be your explanation of dating. Although thats not an option for those of Desi background, dating is culturally acceptable and the norm in western societies. It doesnt mean that all westerners are harlots and whores, it means that young people in western societies are brought up to find their own mates in their own time rather than have their parents arrange someone for them. Its fine to disagree with western ways but dont make ignorant assumptions - a "date" is going to dinner, movies, etc. Its NOT jumping into the sack. Although that does happen sometimes in both the west AND the east.
Someone above made a reference to "playboy bunnies" as if they are running around rampant....I think theres around 30 of them....how can you judge a nation of millions by looking at a group of 30 people???? How would YOU like if all Americans judged all desis by looking at a group of 30 or so Jihadi terrorists?
Next....my goodness this thread has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the war in Iraq, problems in Malaysia, president bush or Dick cheney, I have absolutely NO idea how THEY ever came to be in this discussion. Sheesh, tart a new thread over in world affairs for discussions on those topics!
Your next point was to go on about christians and jews and their evil private plans for muslims. Sorry, I was born and raised christian and married a Muslim. No one I know has any evil thoughts or plans on Muslims except for those like OBL and that evil Maulvi over there in Swat. Anyway, Jewish history of past 3000 years once again has nothing to do with the subject of the thread here.
You seem so eager to be a westerner-basher that you can't stick to the topic at hand. The post that I directed to you was my attempt to educate you about the realities of western life. Your ideas on this are so far off-base that it makes you sound pretty ignorant and judgemental.
Re: With no offense to women
hahahaha…great…so now sister ..you are proving even thier own statistics wrong…where a boy of 13 having a sex relation with his teacher in school…where there are 13 13 years old mothers…where there are 7 out of 10 every girl(western plz. not desis ..some of them are more muslims than arabs or others)…is willingly or forcibly experienced pr-martial relationships bfore reaching 18 or 16…an not jumping into the “sack” …you said also happened in east…but sister…should i tell you the comparison ratio of “jumping into sack” of east and west…
In the U.S., 7 in 10 women who had sex before age 14, and 6 in 10 of those who had sex before age 15 report having had sex involuntarily. (Facts in Brief: Teen Sex and Pregnancy, The Alan Guttmacher Institute, New York, 1996).
-Nationally, one-quarter of 15 year old females and less than 30% of 15 year old males have had sex, compared with 66% of 18 year old females, and 68% of 18 year old males who have had sexual intercourse. (A Statistical Portrait of Adolescent Sex, Contraception, and Childbearing, National Campaign to Prevent Teen Pregnancy, Washington, DC, 1998).
Approximately 4 in 10 young women in the U.S. become pregnant at least once before turning 20 years old.( Facts in Brief: Teen Sex and Pregnancy, The Alan Guttmacher Institute, New York, 1996).
you can read the full statistics here ..i just gave the few glimpses…and of 1996…not 2007 …you can imgine what are figures now…
and accidently… i found that page …showing “cultured” Westrns…just have a look …
{Removed}[
no sister… i am not from sawat…neither i want to twist the topic…but since you have read nothing about jewish history and what they did it in past and still what are they doing…so useless to debate with you on that…by the way …no offence at all…you still are christian accepted islam…?](“http://www.aztlan.net/iraqi_women_raped.htm”)
Re: With no offense to women
*two wrongs do not make one right. *
if jews or christians do bad things, among themselves, u think that muslims and musalimahs must do it too?
this is not right, dawa dil*.*