Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
any person with the means to get to any city in Pakistan has every right to stay there. as for those who cannot get to urban centers, I agree with those saying that the federal/provincial governments need to settle them in different parts of Pakistan in order to distribute the cost. at the moment, most refugees are coming to places like Swabi, a lot of them on foot.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
Yet another hateful anti-Pakistan thread.
MQM or other parties may have to show the leadership in a crisis. But setting up locations for refugee camps is upto the government.
Private citizens (my own family) is already doing their bit by opening up homes to the refugees.
BTW Swat residents are educated, and well established middle class folks. So they will be excellent addition to any city and any home.
Please do not confuse them with uncouth nomads.
Swati families have long history of hosting tourists and treating them well.
This time they need our help, and we should all open our homes and our hearts to support them.
And Karachi will be no exception.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
Every citizen has a right to stay, study, work anywhere in the country on equal footing with every other citizen.
I think this needs to be a federal and provincial initiative looking at what are the best practices for handling internally displaced citizens and how to provide them temporary accomodations of sensible quality (i.e. no dang tent with no electric supply or water) assuming that this operation to clear out the militants is going to wrap up in a short timeframe. provide the displaced citizens options of govt developed and supported programs or for them to go do it on their own where they can gravitate towards larger urban centers where there may be better chances of income, or try and stay close to the region.
If this is going to be a longer duration then we have different challenges.
Plus many people who are displaced may not want to go back even after things are back to normal. we saw that with afghan refugees in pakistan, also with the earthquake in 2005, many people who would have stayed in their towns, had to move and then found a better life somewhere else. in US we saw that with New Orleans residents who moved to other cities after Katrina and have decided not to return there. I think Houston especially has many former neworleans residents calling it home. which is again fine, any citizen should be able to live anywhere in the counry and on equal footing with anyone else in terms of access to education, employment, etc etc
we can take a pagebook from US because what it has done to settle refugees has been to try and look at varied population centers so any one area is not overextended over the years. Bosnians were settled in St Louis area, Somalians in Minneapolis etc.
what you dont want for people is an out of the frying pan into the fire situation where they are living in subhuman conditions in some shanty towns.
Govt should rehabilitate all the refugges in some cities. No one city should be filled with all the refugees to put all the burdon. Fed Govt should grant extra money to cities accomodating these refugees.
MQM, since vows to become "national" party should have welcomed these refugees and asked govt for grants to build refugee homes, provide extra care but then they resorted to their old ethnic game.
All displaced swaties should be accomodated in karachi.
Why Karachi? Why not Peshawar or Quetta where they'd have very similar culture.
Yet another hateful anti-Pakistan thread. .
So are you going to cry for the 'forum police' again like you did in that other thread? hahaha
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
For those of you explaining how its their right to settle in Karachi, we already know that. The real test is whether the MQM will let them in or not. I predict a ethnic class of a large magnitude in the city soon.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
MQM has so far not stopped any pashtun from migrating to karachi. Yes, there are ethnic tensions, but that has not stopped pakistani pashtuns or afghans from coming to karachi in large numbers.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
I am all for refugees staying in Karachi, but for God sake people, stop using Karachi as dumping ground. 1947, 1971, Afghan War in Zia 's regime .. was not that enough proof that Karachi is always open towards accepting more refugees.
Why is that other provinces or other metros have such a resistance towards accepting refugees and people start putting Karachi and Karachi people on test and start checking their Patriotism when it comes to refugee settlements.
I am all for refugees staying in Karachi, but for God sake people, stop using Karachi as dumping ground. 1947, 1971, Afghan War in Zia 's regime .. was not that enough proof that Karachi is always open towards accepting more refugees.
We are referring to a party that came after the 70s, and is giving out anti-pakhtun statements in the press. Did you listen to mayor don kamal's interview on NPR recently? In his racist charade, he pointed out at a random pakhtun mazdoor in Karachi to a western journalist and said 'they are all extermists' with the utmost disgust. Even the western journalist from NPR disagreed with him, based on the poverty ridden condition the rag tagged mazdoor was in.
[quote]
Why is that other provinces or other metros have such a resistance towards that and people start putting Karachi and Karachi people on test and start checking their Patriotism when it comes to refugee settlements.
[/quote]
Peshawar holds the highest number of refugees in the world actually, and other cities have their share. Most importantly though, these other cities and their respective provincial governments have never sponsored an ethnic genocide against any refugee.
Peshawar holds the highest number of refugees in the world actually, and other cities have their share. Most importantly though, these other cities and their respective provincial governments have never sponsored an ethnic genocide against any refugee.
You dont think that 1947 and 1971 immigration count at all? Those people came to Karachi and are well settled their.
No Mahajir ever went to Peshawar and killed 300 Pashtuns, although Pathan truck drivers did that to Mahajirs in Ayub era in Karachi.
There was a time when Urdu speaking students were not allowed in Mehran Engineering University.
PIA was known as Panjab International Airlines and it was impossible for a "MAHAJIR" to get a decent job.
Pak fauj had only 2 percent quota for the population that made up almost 10% of pak population.
Sindh was the only province divided into Sindh Urban and Sindh Rural quota system, just to further press down the rights of Karachi people to get a decent govt job ..
You want me to stop or keep going ?
Its easy to look at the reaction of a city, its hard to figure out the 45 yrs of suppression that they went trough before they became what they are.
I am not supporting MQM, I am just telling you what Karachi went through before it became what it is now.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
TLK
Its propaganda of ethnic haters that has been hammered into minds of people of Karachi. Punjab had huge influx of migrants in 1947, difference is that they were not systematically settled into one city, rather the urban settled in cities and peasants in villages and they did not maintain a separate identity.
Also the Afghan refugees in huge numbers settled in Lahore (has 2 million Pashtun population) and Quetta and ofcourse all over NWFP.
[QUOTE]
No Mahajir ever went to Peshawar and killed 300 Pashtuns, although Pathan truck drivers did that to Mahajirs in Ayub era in Karachi.
[/QUOTE]
No punjabi also went to Karachi and killed Muhajirs, yet they were targetted in Karachi as well now being targetted in Quetta.
You dont think that 1947 and 1971 immigration count at all? Those people came to Karachi and are well settled their.
No Mahajir ever went to Peshawar and killed 300 Pashtuns, although Pathan truck drivers did that to Mahajirs in Ayub era in Karachi.
There was a time when Urdu speaking students were not allowed in Mehran Engineering University.
PIA was known as Panjab International Airlines and it was impossible for a "MAHAJIR" to get a decent job.
Pak fauj had only 2 percent quota for the population that made up almost 10% of pak population.
Sindh was the only province divided into Sindh Urban and Sindh Rural quota system, just to further press down the rights of Karachi people to get a decent govt job ..
You want me to stop or keep going ?
Its easy to look at the reaction of a city, its hard to figure out the 45 yrs of suppression that they went trough before they became what they are.
I am not supporting MQM, I am just telling you what Karachi went through before it became what it is now.
You seem to be drawing your own conclusions. Where did I say mohajirs murdered pakhtuns. On the contrary you are saying pakhtuns murdered them.
I talked about the city Govt of Karachi, and the MQM. You seem to be equating the MQM to the 'mohajir' community by yourself.
All I am saying is, you do not know whats been going on in the last few years, i.e. the efforts of the MQM to eradicate the Pakhtun community of Karachi. You should listen to the NPR interview for yourself, and perhaps read some fo the articles on the topic of 'talibanization of Karachi', if you want.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
I am not supporting MQM. I am not a MQM person. You know that and I think its an open knowledge for all.
And OK I agree, Karachi Operation was a justified one. So is the Swat operation. Although keep it mind that Karachi operation was against Pak Citizens, while Talibans are nothing but illegal residenst of Pakistan. Karachi operation was over looked by the Ministry of Internal affairs. I am sure that Swat operation has foriedgn affairs and Defence Ministry involved. There is a difference between these two. When Karachi Operation happened, locals of Karachi did not flee the City and ran to other cities. Local Swat people are doing that. In spite of all negativities, MQM still had support of locals, talibans don have local people support.
There is a difference between those two operations.
They will goto Karachi for sure, and every effort will be made by the MQM to stop them, because it defeats the purpose that the MQM was after i.e. getting rid of these people who were already in the city. My prediction is the slaughter of these people in the city in the guise of talibanization too. MQM's ethnic agenda here is quite evident, a cleansing based on ethnic lines, devoid of all Pakhtuns/northerners in the city.
Pukhtun habitation of Karachi predates that of urdu speaking people...Karachi is the largest pukhtun populated city in the world, even more so then Kabul or Peshawar, and they are just as if not more indigenous and native to Karachi then any other people, race or group...They have their own dwellings and areas, where any pukhtun arriving from up country can easily fit in and feel at home, perhaps more then any other part of the country outside of NWFP/Tribal areas...
So, pukhtun refugees arriving in Karachi is only natural they should be facilitated and accomadated by the local, provincial and federal governments.
I am not supporting MQM. I am not a MQM person. You know that and I think its an open knowledge for all.
And OK I agree, Karachi Operation was a justified one. So is the Swat operation. Although keep it mind that Karachi operation was against Pak Citizens, while Talibans are nothing but illegal residenst of Pakistan. Karachi operation was over looked by the Ministry of Internal affairs. I am sure that Swat operation has foriedgn affairs and Defence Ministry involved. There is a difference between these two. When Karachi Operation happened, locals of Karachi did not flee the City and ran to other cities. Local Swat people are doing that. In spite of all negativities, MQM still had support of locals, talibans don have local people support.
There is a difference between those two operations.
And you should know I am not a Taliban person, infact taliban is not even the topic of this debate.
p.s. how do you know they dont have the support of the locals? Ok, both you and I are far away from Swat, Ive just been there lots of times before, but I can show you credible pictures from reputed Pakistani papers of jalsas the tSNm did there recently with massive rallies. The truth of the matter is, the people of Swat were fed up of the Govt. They were promised shariah a long time ago, this mess took a long time to boil up and isnt just something that popped out of the blue. Perhaps you should read up to the events before, there were some threads about it. With that said, the support of the locals does not mean their actions are right or wrong, and theres alot more to that.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
^ public support can be easily gauged by election results. That area has not voted for the shariah walay, ANP won most of that area in the last elections even though the radio peer has been spreading his filth over the airwaves since 2004.
The people of Buner and Dir have locally resisted these clowns only for the government to bail out on them.
So, pukhtun refugees arriving in Karachi is only natural they should be facilitated and accomadated by the local, provincial and federal governments.
Agreed, so lets see if that happens or not.
^ public support can be easily gauged by election results. That area has not voted for the shariah walay, ANP won most of that area in the last elections even though the radio peer has been spreading his filth over the airwaves since 2004.
If you have elections now, both the ANP and PPP will be routed out badly. A test of popularity for the 'present'.
Re: Will the refugees by allowed to reside in Karachi
^^ Look yaar it’s as simple, we have a problem (Taliban) and we have to root them out by force (army).
The political maneuverability is all secondary now right? When election will be happened after the current government term (InshALLAH) people of Bunir, Swat have right to choose what they like.
Right now, we have to stand by our Soldiers 
If you have elections now, both the ANP and PPP will be routed out badly. A test of popularity for the 'present'.
Shall we ask ANP and PPP to resign based on your assessment? You have no way of knowing anything of the sort, and elections conducted a year ago are a much more reliable indicator of popularity. and finally the present popularity isnt at issue.
You propagate the myth that shariah is a longstanding demand etc. Surely longstanding must cover the last year! ANP won handily last year, on the other hand the terrorists have been trying to take over since 2007. That ought to tell you something right there.