:bummer:
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
That is normal. There is donor fatigue and apathy from the West. The reason the Tsunami got so much money is because it affected Europeans and Americans. The Pakistan earthquake was 90% Muslim donations. Out of the original 800 million received, 600 million was from Muslim Countries.
Such is life. The West does not care, why should we be bothered why they are not giving money. We will survive, have survived without donations from the white man.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Few reasons...
Corrupt Government, (Everyone knows that)
President of Pakistan having Summer tour and giving damn to his country. Which makes others to think, that when the leader dont care about its country, what it will be for them donating to the same corrupt government?
Corrupt Citizens of those areas, (Specially those who have any relative in overseas and is NOT willing to help them and others)
Corrupt Businessmen and again due to Government, (Storing and stocking food to increase the price of food and daily usage commodities 4 times more than what it was during Kashmir Earth Quake)
Less awareness by International media about the damage, done by the flood, compare to Haiti's Earth Quake.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Quick question regarding Point 2 and 3. Corrupt citizens do you have any proof to this affect? Or is it a figment of your imagination? Secondly regarding rising prices of food commodities - when was the last time you were in Pakistan and more importantly do you understand basic economics?
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Quick question regarding Point 2 and 3. Corrupt citizens do you have any proof to this affect? Or is it a figment of your imagination? Secondly regarding rising prices of food commodities - when was the last time you were in Pakistan and more importantly do you understand basic economics?
Point 2 and point 3. Yes it is so. I dont need to point few people out of all of them.
Food prices.. well I think which economics you are talking about? Oil price? They are same for long time but increasing in Pakistan. What else is making it costly? No electricity? Own created problem where as there is so much enough power generation for almost double of Pakistan. What else you want to say? That people need a Tomato from Holland, a Carrot and Orange from Spain and a Butter from Germany to have something to eat? I am talking about basic need.
Further more well if I havent been to Pakistan in one and half year but I have my whole family there who is observing it and is a part of it. They explain me the reality more than what I even resist not to think of. If you still have some further excuses that I dont know nothing then ask the Thread Opener if he can provide us more information as he is currently in Pakistan (as I think).
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
The reason I ask is because anybody who has lived in Pakistan knows that prices increase during Ramzan. It is normal practice. Seriously what is making it more costly? Really? I mean really? We have had floods in half the freaking country. 1 billion dollars worth of crops have been destroyed. Stored supplies have been destroyed. We have water in half of our power plants.
And you wonder why the prices have gone up. As always the disconnect between reality in Pakistan and what people think on this forum is amazing.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
The reason I ask is because anybody who has lived in Pakistan knows that prices increase during Ramzan. It is normal practice. Seriously what is making it more costly? Really? I mean really? We have had floods in half the freaking country. 1 billion dollars worth of crops have been destroyed. Stored supplies have been destroyed. We have water in half of our power plants.
And you wonder why the prices have gone up. As always the disconnect between reality in Pakistan and what people think on this forum is amazing.
Crops has been destroyed for upcoming reaping season. Not just right now. Stores were not only built in Khyber Pakhtoon Khwa. Huge stores are in Karachi. In Ramdan prices go high only in Pakistan but never saw prices as high as of now. Not due to Flood but they were planned even before flood. Also I am NOT only talking about food but other things for regular use that can help them survive.
Further more its amazing that you can just shoot out your favoritism for Government without thinking that what basically causing it.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Seriously? Inflation has been on the rise in Pakistan for the past 3 years? They have been increasing every year and they will contnue to do so with the current political climate. Secondly this is not the middle ages. People do not store food for a full year and reap only once a year. There is a continuous cycle of work and crop production. To state that this current crop destruction has no affect on prices is beyond idiotic.
How do you know the increase in pricing was planned before the flood? Got any physical proof?
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Seriously? Inflation has been on the rise in Pakistan for the past 3 years? They have been increasing every year and they will contnue to do so with the current political climate. Secondly this is not the middle ages. People do not store food for a full year and reap only once a year. There is a continuous cycle of work and crop production. To state that this current crop destruction has no affect on prices is beyond idiotic.
How do you know the increase in pricing was planned before the flood? Got any physical proof?
political climate? which political climate you are talking about? Spending millions on daily expenditures of Governmental Royalties and taking Credit from IMF causing more inflation. Is that you are talking about political climate? A country is from the nation not from political or other climates. If there is not even living rights for their owns then I think there is no need of any politicians.
Oh well you think I was talking about "people" storing food for a full year? I was talking about Businessmen storing food for more than 6 months!! Who then sell it for more money, regardless if anyone dies or if anyone cant afford it. Dont they have even any feelings for humanity to sell the product for the price they bought it, at the time people need it the most?
I think calling idiotic wont make me hyper because I got your mental level, that can not accept any criticism but only feel that he is right. Well good luck with that. Just take an example, If I have two bags of rice now and thats the only thing available for me. Somehow there is no food in market for one month and my friends or neighbors need something to eat. Will I ask them to pay me 100 times more than what I paid for it or will I help them by giving that portion for free or if not free maybe for the same price I bought it? There is something called feeling for humanity. Doing what Islam tells us.
Yes I have physical proof of that.. Want to have that? Go meet my father in Pakistan to have a "physical" proof of that. I can only tell you what he told me and I know my father well enough.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
People just dont trust the government and you cant blame them.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
the largest donations have come from saudia arabia, china, and turkey.jordan and srilanka are also helping out. they didn't care about trust deficit in corrupt gov and all those excuses. they've proved their friendship time and time again. usa, england, and the rest have only given 'khaali waade'.. but then they aren't really our friends. they're more like foes.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Yup thats the very core reason that no one trust the government . But as CM mentioned that should we wait for western countries to help us ? May be answer is no to it . Now what are the alternatives we have ? No waiting for a miracle is not one of them . May be we can ask other governments . We can ask for a long term loan . May be try our chines and Arab friends . I don't know , but I doubt if that will be enough .
Things will get worse for sure , but may be God wants to really test us this time . Question is if we really tried to pass this test , noops I don't think so . Anyways , indications are pretty clear , more than enough for the wise ones .
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
There's no comparison between Pakistan and Haiti. Haiti was a very poor country even before the earthquake. Would you trust giving money to the Pakistani government? If Pakistan can make nukes than they can also help the people.
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
^ Because we are always interested more in taking lives of our people than saving it .
May be its a solution they came up with for population control 
. . . with the kind of wisdom our policy makers hold , you just never know .
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Am I missing something. Has China announced more aid after the initial $2 million . The only additional aid that I saw was:
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2010\08\18\story_18-8-2010_pg7_21
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
the largest donations have come from saudia arabia, china, and turkey.jordan and srilanka are also helping out. they didn't care about trust deficit in corrupt gov and all those excuses. they've proved their friendship time and time again. usa, england, and the rest have only given 'khaali waade'.. but then they aren't really our friends. they're more like foes.
I thought there was a rather large chunk coming from UK
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
Look guys there is an image issue, partially our doing partially the doing of foes, partially the doing of lazy media.
thats the challenge, u dont see sad scenes played in slow motion with heart wrenching music playing again and again and with some catch phrase coined by some channel to tug at people's hearts.
its not fair and is inhumane but that is what it is
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38687569/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/
ISLAMABAD — The global aid response to the Pakistan floods has so far been much less generous than to other recent natural disasters — despite the soaring numbers of people affected and the prospect of more economic ruin in a country key to the fight against Islamist extremists.
Reasons include the relatively low death toll of 1,500, the slow onset of the flooding compared with more immediate and dramatic earthquakes or tsunamis, and a global “donor fatigue” — or at least a Pakistan fatigue.
Triggered by monsoon rains, the floods have torn through the country from its mountainous northwest, destroying hundreds of thousands of homes and an estimated 1.7 million acres (nearly 700,000 hectares) of farmland. In southern Pakistan, the River Indus is now more than 15 miles (25 kilometers) wide at some points — 25 times wider than during normal monsoon seasons.
The floods have disrupted the lives of 14 million people — 8 percent of the population. Many are living in muddy camps or overcrowded government buildings, while thousands more are sleeping in the open next to their cows, goats and whatever possessions they managed to drag with them.
And the U.N. says more flood surges may be on the way. Late Friday, local TV reported more flooding in towns and villages along main rivers in Sindh and Punjab provinces.
Going by the numbers of people affected, the disaster is worse than the 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami, the 2005 Kashmir earthquake and the 2010 Haiti earthquake combined, the U.N. says. But international aid for those disasters came at a more rapid pace, aid experts say.
Ten days after the Kashmir quake, donors gave or pledged $292 million, according to the aid group Oxfam. The Jan. 12 disaster in Haiti led to pledges nearing $1 billion within the first 10 days
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
from the stats on BBC, seems US has provided the most funds…
Re: Why Western donors are snubbing Pakistan after giving to Haiti ?
The Qureshi and UN absurdities
Published: August 18, 2010
Dr Shireen M Mazari
Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi can certainly be put in the ranks of politicians and leaders with a penchant for making absurd remarks – a group that includes Bush Jr and our very own President Zardari and his predecessor Musharraf, to cite just the tip of the iceberg. Given how the whole international community has failed to deliver on flood aid because of the lack of credibility of the government, it was incredible to hear Qureshi state his “horror” over the fact that the issue of transparent use of aid had become such a major domestic issue. In fact, we are horrified to discover that it has taken so long to make transparency in the use of aid the major issue that it should rightfully be. After all, had this been made a central issue at the time of the Kashmir earthquake, perhaps tales of earthquake funds being diverted elsewhere would not now be coming to light because there would already have been accountability of these funds. Nor is this all.
Is it not shameful for the government to find that the army had established its own relief fund thereby adding to the question marks over the government’s credibility – especially since there already was a Prime Minister’s relief fund? Unfortunately given public scepticism, that fund is hardly drawing major funds despite the fact that Pakistanis are giving in large amounts – but primarily to private charities and NGOs. Clearly the army felt more people would be willing to donate directly to its fund, given how its presence has been most visible in the flood-stricken areas. But the worst of it is the announcement by the Prime Minister, after talks with PML-N leader Nawaz Sharif, to establish a “clean” flood commission comprising people of “impeccable” character. This, more than any other instance, reflects an admission of a lack of credibility by the rulers.
So Qureshi should not be shocked to find Pakistanis seeking transparency when the government does not trust itself. Actually transparency should be made an even bigger issue by the people of Pakistan, regardless of what the international community feels. After all, this is money that belongs to the flood affectees and should go only to them, not be pilfered along the way by a corrupt government machinery. The needs of the stricken people are extreme and so far there is little visibility of the government functionaries actually undertaking effective flood relief work in the more remote parts of the country. The only effective presence of the state is the military’s – otherwise people are having to fend for themselves or starve to death – if disease does not overtake them first.
It is also sad to note the politics of the United Nations itself. Secretary General Ban Ki-moon may only have realised the gravity of the situation when he finally decided to visit Pakistan but the UN has been slow to respond to this crisis even as it is criticising other donors on this count. For the spokesperson of the UN Office of Humanitarian Affairs, Elizabeth Byrs, to declare rather arrogantly, that it was Pakistan’s “image deficit” that was hurting aid flows is simply unacceptable. Has she forgotten how Ban went to Myanmar – a country with a massive “image deficit” in the West – after Cyclone Nargis and meekly watched General Than Shwe take (some would say “steal”) at least 25 percent of the aid money through forced currency exchange foibles all of which were swept under the carpet by the UN. In fact, Ban’s publicists saw his Myanmar trip as a major success for him, declaring that the visit had saved 500,000 lives! So at least during Ban’s tenure it is a little ridiculous for the UN to talk of Pakistan’s “image deficit” as a reason for aid not coming in! While other players may have an issue with corruption within the Pakistan government, and Pakistanis are certainly concerned about it, at least for Ban Ki-moon this is not a problem judging by his Myanmar example.
The Ban leadership at the UN has consistently shown a hostility towards Pakistan. Only recently we had the flip flop over the remarks on Kashmir and it is now believed that the Secretary General’s Indian Chief of Staff Nambiar (who also accompanied Ban), a former Indian diplomat and intelligence operative played a key role in this incident. Now we have seen the belated Ban visit and the confusion in the UN with the SG’s spokesperson’s remarks, over who exactly the humanitarian coordinator for Pakistan was. Nor did the coordinator do much before the Ban visit and no one really knew where he was as the flood situation worsened. In fact. UN headquarters did little till the Ban visit which itself was deliberately painted as “low key” so as not to upset India! Once again the role of the Secretary General’s Indian Chief of Staff seems to dominate his actions. And let us recall how the story of Indian security forces wearing UN blue berets in Occupied Kashmir to fool people barely received a mild reprimand from the UN before it was all hushed up. As usual Pakistan said nothing – to our shame. Where was the Foreign Minister’s voice on this important issue that deserved strong criticism?
The extent to which this SG is under the US-Indian influence is also reflected on the statements coming out from the UN about the dangers of the relief work being done very ably by Islamic religious outfits like Jamaat-ul-Dawa. If one links such political statements with the Kashmir flip flop, it leaves little room for doubt as to the highly politicised approach Ban is displaying towards the Pakistan flood disaster. It also shows the cynicism pervading the international community at a time when the Pakistani people are literally drowning not only in the floodwater itself, but also in the blowback of hunger and disease – with children the worst affected.
Amid all this anti-Muslim sentiment prevailing in the West – and that is the unstated reason for a delay in aid flows no matter what spin is given out – one should, I suppose, be grateful for the support the US has given to Pakistan’s call for a UN conference on the floods. However, given the reluctance of the international community to come forward to provide humanitarian assistance to Pakistan in its hour of need, the UN conference may be a case of too little too late. Another drama like the FoDP drama.
However, it would be good for Pakistan to remind the UN that this country is not only a member of the UN, but also one of the leading troop providers for UN missions. Equally, Pakistan needs to tell the lead stakeh-olders in the US-led “war on terror” that unless they deliver on aid and assistance, Pakistan will back off from the support it is giving at all levels. In any case, we are already being overstretched in this US agenda – especially since the Coalition Support Fund payments are also not updated – and now is as good a time as any to create that distance between ourselves and the US and its NATO allies. After all, we have bigger domestic issues of survival to deal with and this requires diversion of military manpower and resources. We can help ourselves if we are honest in how we use our resources and relief aid – which is why Mr Qureshi needs to realise there will continue to be a strong voice raised for transparency and accountability. But equally, let others fight their own misdirected wars also – especially since the costs so far have been greatest for Pakistan.